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I went out and did a quick comparison of the basic 11 and the CS TTKZ, mostly to test out the handle vibration on the CS TTKZ. I found some interesting things worth mentioning, and so I did a video of it and took some pictures.
There was a thread a while ago discussing whether the NMFBM was worth the weight and cost as an upgrade from the cheaper and lighter B11, most people said yes, but with reservations regarding cost to performance increase gained. With the basic 11 and the CS TTKZ (a thinned out version of the standard TTKZ) you get two knives that reach into the catogories above or below them. The Basic 11 is able to do heavier chopping then you would expect out of a blade so light, and the CS TTKZ is able to do lighter work with less fatigue then you would expect out of a knife so heavy and long. In my opinion, as a complete package, the CS TTKZ does a better job of this than the B11 does. A basic rundown of why:
The Basic 11:
-sticks far more often then the CS TTKZ
-It requires a faster swing to begin to match the CS TTKZ's chopping depthwhich requires forearm strength on every swing
-Requires a tighter grip because of the necessity of faster swings
-It has a smaller center of percussion where vibrations are minimized
-Vibrates more when chopping resulting in hand pain
The TTKZ:
-Almost never sticks, when it does it's removed with more ease than the B11
-can be swung with almost no power and still remove wood because of the weight of the blade. More mass, even when swung around it's center of balance (held in a neutral grip), = more momentum
-Has better handle ergonomics for chopping, where you can let the handle be looser in the hand and still maintain chopping ability and control.
-Has a huge center of percussion for minimal vibrations
-Has very little vibration when chopping
I beleive the sticking is entirely an issue of geometry. The basic 11 is a full flat grind and the CS TTKZ is very much a convex grind. The result is like trying to slice cheese with a flat knife, you end up getting the full sticky friction and pressure across the entire surface of the knife. With a convex grind you get a smaller percentage of the flats touching which results in less friction, less likelyhood of getting stuck, and less force required to remove it. Here's a small sample of the geometry difference between the original stock TTKZ, the Custom Shopped (CS) TTKZ, and the B11:
The vibration issue is likely due to a combination of the CS TTKZ having a taller blade with more curves, and a full exposed tang handle. The thinner tang on the B11 is probably doing what jerry described when talking about gutting tangs and acting like a tuning fork.
The knives, Basic 11 and CS TTKZ. Both knives have had the same edge treatment, a 24 degree per side primary, and an 18 degree per side relief bevel, brought to a mirror polish:
The wood: These are from a freshly fallen set of tree's downed by the crazy 60mph+wind gusts we had during the dusk monsoon storms. This is fresh honey mesquite (2345) and a tree from the mulberry family (2820). The numbers are the janka scale, putting honey a bit below and mulberry a bit above Red Mahogany in hardness.
B11 in Mulberry:
CS TTKZ in mulberry, deeper cut with less forearm strength, more in the shoulders:
Basic 11 sticking in the mulberry. It does this much worse when splitting, trying to extract the basic 11 from a knotted round of apricot wood required a wedge.
Basic 11 in mesquite:
CS TTKZ in mesquite:
it was a pretty deep cut:
This is the basic 11 sticking in the mesquite:
and the video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxmzgiDmS1o
[youtube]RxmzgiDmS1o[/youtube]
There was a thread a while ago discussing whether the NMFBM was worth the weight and cost as an upgrade from the cheaper and lighter B11, most people said yes, but with reservations regarding cost to performance increase gained. With the basic 11 and the CS TTKZ (a thinned out version of the standard TTKZ) you get two knives that reach into the catogories above or below them. The Basic 11 is able to do heavier chopping then you would expect out of a blade so light, and the CS TTKZ is able to do lighter work with less fatigue then you would expect out of a knife so heavy and long. In my opinion, as a complete package, the CS TTKZ does a better job of this than the B11 does. A basic rundown of why:
The Basic 11:
-sticks far more often then the CS TTKZ
-It requires a faster swing to begin to match the CS TTKZ's chopping depthwhich requires forearm strength on every swing
-Requires a tighter grip because of the necessity of faster swings
-It has a smaller center of percussion where vibrations are minimized
-Vibrates more when chopping resulting in hand pain
The TTKZ:
-Almost never sticks, when it does it's removed with more ease than the B11
-can be swung with almost no power and still remove wood because of the weight of the blade. More mass, even when swung around it's center of balance (held in a neutral grip), = more momentum
-Has better handle ergonomics for chopping, where you can let the handle be looser in the hand and still maintain chopping ability and control.
-Has a huge center of percussion for minimal vibrations
-Has very little vibration when chopping
I beleive the sticking is entirely an issue of geometry. The basic 11 is a full flat grind and the CS TTKZ is very much a convex grind. The result is like trying to slice cheese with a flat knife, you end up getting the full sticky friction and pressure across the entire surface of the knife. With a convex grind you get a smaller percentage of the flats touching which results in less friction, less likelyhood of getting stuck, and less force required to remove it. Here's a small sample of the geometry difference between the original stock TTKZ, the Custom Shopped (CS) TTKZ, and the B11:
The vibration issue is likely due to a combination of the CS TTKZ having a taller blade with more curves, and a full exposed tang handle. The thinner tang on the B11 is probably doing what jerry described when talking about gutting tangs and acting like a tuning fork.
The knives, Basic 11 and CS TTKZ. Both knives have had the same edge treatment, a 24 degree per side primary, and an 18 degree per side relief bevel, brought to a mirror polish:
The wood: These are from a freshly fallen set of tree's downed by the crazy 60mph+wind gusts we had during the dusk monsoon storms. This is fresh honey mesquite (2345) and a tree from the mulberry family (2820). The numbers are the janka scale, putting honey a bit below and mulberry a bit above Red Mahogany in hardness.
B11 in Mulberry:
CS TTKZ in mulberry, deeper cut with less forearm strength, more in the shoulders:
Basic 11 sticking in the mulberry. It does this much worse when splitting, trying to extract the basic 11 from a knotted round of apricot wood required a wedge.
Basic 11 in mesquite:
CS TTKZ in mesquite:
it was a pretty deep cut:
This is the basic 11 sticking in the mesquite:
and the video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxmzgiDmS1o
[youtube]RxmzgiDmS1o[/youtube]
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