Bacpack Frames

[mcconnad]

How important are backpack frames when carrying 35 lbs or more? Do they make a big difference in the ability to comfortably carry a medium to heavy sized load on a roughly 10 mile trek? I currently have a Maxpedition Condor II and think I might need something more comfortable for a longer haul with more gear. I like the bag but I think it might be better suited to shorter excursions.

Thanks for any opinions.

 

[Codger_64]

A frame can make all the difference in the world to carry comfort. The question might be which type frame works best for you. Having grown up with rigid external frame packs, the new internal frame packs are markedly different in how they distribute load weight and can conform to individual users. Neither type frame is much good if it doesn't fit. But both are generally an improvement over the tater sack.

 

[foxyrick]

Frames, internal or external, make a world of difference if you carry an appreciable weight.

I have a MaxP Vulture II and to make it more usable I put a large, stiff cutting board (Epicurean brand) in the bladder sleeve. It has the advantage that I always have a cutting board with me for food prep

I'm not joking (about putting the board in). As soon as I started making use of the pack's capacity I realised that it needed a frame. That's the drawback of MaxP's larger packs in my opinion.

A lot of the time I actually prefer to carry my Kifaru Zulu, even if I only need the capacity of the Vulture. The frame makes it more comfortable and stable, even if underloaded. It's a shame because I really like the organisational ability of MaxP's products.

 

[mcconnad]

Thanks for the responses. I've been eyeing the Kifaru Marauder But I want to get opinions on whether a frame system would be we worth the extra cost. I suppose the aluminum stays would be better than the composites as they can be bent to fit an individual's back. The composites look nice but the website says they're not adjustable.

 

[Army of Nobunaga]

I have a few of each. I hike a lot with all of them and my load is almost always over 30 lbs. I think its more of a matter of fitting the pack to your body correctly and then packing it correctly.

For loads of 50lbs or more I think I always use a frame. The best way to do this is to go to a nice hiking camping store and let those guys show you all of this so you can get a feel for the differences under each load.

 

[Codger_64]

Thanks for the responses. I've been eyeing the Kifaru Marauder But I want to get opinions on whether a frame system would be we worth the extra cost. I suppose the aluminum stays would be better than the composites as they can be bent to fit an individual's back. The composites look nice but the website says they're not adjustable.

From what I have seen, hybrids are available in nearly every blend immaginable, though you may have to stray from the currently chic brands to get what suits you best. I am not a slave to fashion by any means and have not tried the better more expensive brands. My need has been filled by a relatively low dollar yet well made adjustable pack. The shoulder strap position can be adjusted up or down to about seven positions in 1" increments. The plastic internal frame sheet that can be rebent for best fit. Best of all it has plenty of breathable padding on the frame, shoulder straps and waist belt. Multiple compartments help segregate gear according to weight, bulk and accessability. It is water resivoir capable, though I tried it and didn't like it. Far more to my liking is reaching into an outside mesh pocket for a store bottle of spring water. This pack is a 65L capacity and cost less than $100.

http://www.backpacker.com/community/gear_reviews/321

[video=youtube;RKDJl_pWhlc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RKDJl_pWhlc&feature=related[/video]

 

[PropThePolecat]

Frames, internal or external, make a world of difference if you carry an appreciable weight.

This^^

Stay away from the militarystyled backpacks for serious hiking. The shoulderstraps are often too thin, the hipbelt an outright joke and the frameless style is a killer on the back. The difference they make on a 35 pound load is immense. But its not only the frame that makes the difference. A proper hipbelt takes alot of the weight of the shoulders. But for a hipbelt to work, the backpack needs a frame, so it dosent collapse onto your back.

 

[mcconnad]

Again, thanks for the suggestions. I'm not dead set on the most expensive brand or the military style. I just know that I can be somewhat rough on my equipment and cordura or ballistic nylon has held up for me pretty well with smaller packs. Molle straps are nice but I probably don't need to attach much if I go with a bigger bag. I might have to head over to rei next week and see what they have.

 

[Brad "the butcher"]

Anything over 30lbs and I want a frame with a nice thick hipbelt and cheststrap to keep the shoulderstraps from migrating to the tips of my shoulders. Anybody with developed traps will understand how annoying this is (fatigues your upper back fast too)

At least one hiking pole with that kind of weight as well

 

[foxyrick]

I got my Zulu pre-owned at a fairly bargain price, although it was hard to tell that it wasn't new. It's a G1. The G2's have an improved back system, and it does look genuinely improved, not just changed to sell more sacks like some manufacturers do.

My G1 Zulu is by far the most comfortable sack I have ever owned. On one trip into the back of beyond I had it loaded to the absolute maximum. I don't have lightweight gear, either. As well as camping kit and provisions (at a 'luxury' level) for four days, I had climbing, rappelling, caving and SRT gear and a selection of knives (of course). I even took a fold-up seat! I had a large ATS GP utility pouch on the back, Kifaru long pockets on either side and two ATS medium GP utility pouches on the hip belt.

I have no idea what it weighed, but it was a lot. Below are a few pictures of the setup for a later trip, but not loaded up nearly as much. Imagine the top extended up by another eight inches or so, with a rope bag strapped atop.

Since I had just got the Zulu, I tried packing both it and my Berghaus Vulcan with my kit. The Vulcan (100 litre+) took the load more easily, as it should, but the difference in comfort between the Vulcan and the Kifaru was like night and day even with the Zulu vastly overloaded. I had carried the Vulcan around Scotland for hundreds of miles (and the Pennine way twice - that's a 250 mile hill walk in the UK) and always appreciated how good it was but the Zulu blew it away.

I'm saying all this because I would really recommend Kifaru kit if you can afford it.

 

[JV3]

a frame makes a huge difference since it transfers the load to your hips and off of your shoulders (especially upwards of 20 lbs). the waist belt design also plays a big factor and just because a pack has a big waist belt doesn't mean it'll ride nice. the delta straps on the kifaru waist belt is amazing in the way it pulls the weight much closer to your lumbar...i have yet to see any commercial packs that comes close to their carrying comfort.

Thanks for the responses. I've been eyeing the Kifaru Marauder But I want to get opinions on whether a frame system would be we worth the extra cost. I suppose the aluminum stays would be better than the composites as they can be bent to fit an individual's back. The composites look nice but the website says they're not adjustable.

i have both the composite and aluminum stays - see my signature for the kifaru packs i reviewed. i rarely read anyone needing to custom-bend the stays to their back on the kifaru forums though so for the most part the weight difference is the main factor in most buyers' decision...that is, unless you have a weird-shaped back.

 

[Killinumsoftly]

I have a few of each. I hike a lot with all of them and my load is almost always over 30 lbs. I think its more of a matter of fitting the pack to your body correctly and then packing it correctly.

For loads of 50lbs or more I think I always use a frame. The best way to do this is to go to a nice hiking camping store and let those guys show you all of this so you can get a feel for the differences under each load.

Your absolutely right, having the pack fit to your body is the most important. If you look at most of the newer packs, of which are mainly internal frame you will see something that looks like a ruler, this is for adjusting if you know what your measurements are. If you go to a store like EMS they will load up the pack your buying with a bunch of weight and fit it to your body. I actually just wrote about this on another thread, there were pics of guys acting like they knew what they were doing and the hip belt wrapped around their stomache LOL. You need the hip belts center to ride on the top of your hip bone. This way about 70% of the weight is taken off your back and shoulders. EMS make some really nice packs that easily compare to and are just as good as the crazy expensive ones, and they are a reasonable price. Sometimes you can even get last years for really cheap, I got mine from them at about a quarter of the original price and I have carried it on some rough hiking and mountaineering trips. I am a guide so I spend a lot more time in the woods then most as it is part of my way I make a living. Ive hiked with over 35lbs and no frame or hip belt and it sucks, as soon as you take the pack off your shoulders feel like they are just about dislocated, your traps are torn to crap and your back kills from trying to keep it straight and not arching, i would certaily get something with a frame, hipbelt & thick comfy straps. At long distance you will regret it of you dont, it can be done but hiking is supposed to be fun not miserable and painful. If you want to know anything else feel free to message me, I'll help any way I can

 

[desmobob]

How important are backpack frames when carrying 35 lbs or more? Do they make a big difference in the ability to comfortably carry a medium to heavy sized load on a roughly 10 mile trek? I currently have a Maxpedition Condor II and think I might need something more comfortable for a longer haul with more gear. I like the bag but I think it might be better suited to shorter excursions.

Thanks for any opinions.

The Maxpedition packs are incredibly handy for organizing lots of small gear, but they suck for carrying any decent amount of weight (I have a Falcon II and love it for certain uses). 35 pounds is a pretty heavy load by hiking and backpacking standards, and I wouldn't even think of carrying that much without a framed pack with a good suspension that fits my torso length. I have a couple of internal-frame packs I used for years; a Lowe Alpine Crossbow 90 and an REI Tourstar, but finally decided to spring for a high-end frame and modular bags. I bought a Mystery Ranch NICE frame and the Crew Cab and Longbow bags. I still use the Crossbow for bulky loads (winter camping) but will eventually buy one of Mystery Ranch's large bags to fit my NICE frame.

I think the modular frame/pack option is a neat way to go.

Stay sharp,
desmobob

 

[ROCK6]

My recommendation is that if your load is going to exceed 15-20 pounds, use a frame. My wife has done a lot of research on AT section/through hiking and everybody that used frameless packs dumped that after the first couple of days. When you get to heavier loads, a frame (and quality suspension) is worth the extra weight. Not only does it provide a more stable pack (really important if off-trail), but they are often designed for better air flow and place the weight appropriately to reduce fatigue. I've done my share of military road-marches where we never used the waistbelts (because of LBE/V harness/pistol belt) and with 45 pounds, it creates havoc on your lower back, shoulders and neck after just a few miles.

ROCK6