Barkeeper's Friend too abrasive?

T

THG

Joined
May 18, 2008
Messages
3,644
I was cleaning a Diasharp EF stone with BK'sF, and the napkin wouldn't get less and less gray (metal kept coming off). I finally decided this was ridiculous, so I tested it on the bottom of the stone (no diamonds; I don't sharpen on that side). Lo and behold, metal was coming off! So apparently BK'sF is taking metal off of the actual stone. This isn't going to damage it, is it? I suppose that means that some of the metal has come off my stone, so there's going to be an ever-so-slight valley in the middle of my stone now...
 
It's not so much that it's too abrasive, but it can be somewhat corrosive due to its oxalic acid content.
 
Ugh, then why is it praised so highly around here? I just looked at it under a ~100x microscope, and it seems that there are more empty "pits" in the center of the stone compared to the edges. I'm just hoping it's my imagination, although it probably isn't since when dragging my nail across sections of the stone, the edges seem to bite more than the center...
 
knifenut1013 said:
I've used BKF on my DMT's for the last year and don't see any problems :confused:
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Try putting some on the bottom of one of your stones and rub at it. See if you find that metal comes off like I did. Then what do you make of that?
 
I thought it was recommended for ceramic stones/rods? Plain old soap and water seems to do the trick for diamonds.

I don't notice much difference between Barkeeper's Friend and any other scouring powder when cleaning ceramics.
 
And I just did an unscientific test: I gave the stone 12 strokes with a paperclip in different sections to see which would take off more metal. The edges seem to do more, and there is definitely a grittier feel when stroking.

Dammit... Looks like maybe I should get a new stone?
 
It just seems odd, I've never had any problem like that. I do a similar method, water a little BKF spread and let sit for about 30 seconds, I then rub with my fingers and rinse. The BKF does turn gray from the metal being removed but that's the metal from a knife and not the stone :confused:
 
knifenut1013 said:
It just seems odd, I've never had any problem like that. I do a similar method, water a little BKF spread and let sit for about 30 seconds, I then rub with my fingers and rinse. The BKF does turn gray from the metal being removed but that's the metal from a knife and not the stone :confused:
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That's what I'm wondering: is the gray actually from metal of a knife, or from the stone?

You have a microscope, right? See if you notice more diamonds along the edges of the stone compared to the center. Use your nail and see if the center is less gritty than the edges. I know lots of people here use BKF, but I don't think anyone has ever noticed this, or maybe it's only happening to me lol... :grumpy:
 
I only use the Bar Keeper's Friend on ceramics and stones. Dish soap and warm water on diamond stones.
 
THG said:
That's what I'm wondering: is the gray actually from metal of a knife, or from the stone?

You have a microscope, right? See if you notice more diamonds along the edges of the stone compared to the center. Use your nail and see if the center is less gritty than the edges. I know lots of people here use BKF, but I don't think anyone has ever noticed this, or maybe it's only happening to me lol... :grumpy:
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Its hard to see things with my microscope but what I do see looks like diamonds and everything appears to be fine. Even if you clean your stone with dish soap and water then use BKF it will still pull the metal out that was not taken by the soap. The metal shavings get deep into the stone and products like BKF are needed to properly clean them. Its really amazing sometimes how much you didn't get out.

Some other things to consider, how old are your stones, Have you always used light pressure, have you ever lapped with your stones, do you sharpen a lot of big heavy FB's, One time using too much pressure and you can do more damage than you think. I'm guilty myself and a spot in the corner of my XC stone reminds me often.

Picture1081.jpg
 
I'm not too worried about the coarser stones as I am about the finer ones. The finer ones have much smaller diamonds, so I'm afraid that those little ones might have been taken out by the BKF rather than the bigger diamonds.

knifenut1013 said:
Some other things to consider, how old are your stones, Have you always used light pressure, have you ever lapped with your stones, do you sharpen a lot of big heavy FB's, One time using too much pressure and you can do more damage than you think. I'm guilty myself and a spot in the corner of my XC stone reminds me often.
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My stone is less than 6 months old. I've never used heavy pressure on it, and I've never lapped it or lapped with it; the only thing abrasive it has ever been in contact with is (apparently) BKF.

The only things I've ever sharpened with it are my pocket knives (ZDP Endura, Delica, Stretch, and other small ones) and recently some kitchen knives (only done it a handful of times). I seriously doubt I've put this thing through anything close to abuse.

In any case, it still seems to be working fine. It may, however, be an explanation as to why it takes me longer to get the tip areas of my knives sharp.
 
Your stones might be just starting to break in.

My EEF is my most used stone and for the past year + it has seen the BKF treatment about every two weeks. I have thought about the abrasive in it having a effect but so far so good. The fine stones reduce dramatically in abrasive feel after break-in but do not loose their cutting effectiveness. The scratch pattern also decreases and edges become cleaner and sharper.

It could be break-in or you could have a problem with your stones, I would give DMT a call if you feel there is something wrong.
 
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