Basic in action

Cliff Stamp

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Oct 5, 1998
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I commented recently that I had some shots of the Basic in heavy stress use. Well when I seen this I knew it had to be documented.

Before :

http://www.physics.mun.ca/~sstamp/images/basic_splitting_1.jpg

and after :

http://www.physics.mun.ca/~sstamp/images/basic_splitting_2.jpg

The knife goes flying when you do this so it is far from the most sensible way to split wood. Don't try this at home kids.

It also explains why I noticed the tip got flattened out some time ago. See all those pieces out of the concrete floor.

Some people definately need Busse Combat blades - or therapy.

-Cliff
 
I bet that was fun, if scary, to try. That's one thick piece of wood that was split!

Next item to split: 2" by 5" block of carbon steel...

Thanks for the pics Cliff.
 
Very Impressive.

Hey Cliff, I have read some of your reveiws and find them to be very informative and non bias.

Keep up the good work

I have a BUSSE Basic 7 in the mail.

Thanks

Wolf
 
:
Cliff how deep are the gouges in the concrete?
Interesting test.
biggrin.gif


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>>>>---Yvsa-G@WebTV.net---->®

"VEGETARIAN".............
Indin word for lousy hunter.
 
Yvsa, not deep, about 3/8" at most. Because the blade is torqued, it just digs in briefly and then flys out. It takes a fair amount of force to split the wood in this manner. Before it was jumped on, I walked on it to see if just my body weight (300+) would split it and it failed to do so.

Wolf, thanks.

-Cliff
 
Tag, that is a good question. Personally there are two ways I split wood with a large knife. If the wood is squarish I will just set the blade, put one hand on the wood and torque on the blade with the other hand. If the wood will not split under this effort I resort to the second method which is to basically pound the blade straight through.

The individual who invented this rather unique method severely injured his shoulder awhile back free climbing. Basically he slipped and caught himself by one hand and the resulting stress badly jarred his shoulder. I think his lack of a pressdown ability at that time spawned this technique.

There were a couple of other factors as well. At the time I think an ontario machete was being used to split wood and it initially the pounding method was used but the vibration destroyed the handle. Since the tang is far to thin to hold onto while pounding a different technique was needed and the lateral pry I used was out for reasons described in the above.

A couple of other things are important to note. First of all none I the knives I review are worked with in isolation. Mainly because I feel it is necessary to provide a reference point to the performance. As a side effect, this often prompts much more stressful work to be done. Because quite simply if you see that a 1/8", 1095, $15 machete can do something, you don't really have an argument against using a 1/4", tool steel blade costing 10 times as much.

Secondly when I am given a blade to review, except in very rare situations, the review is finished when the blade is no longer functional. The exceptions are if the maker asks me to just look at some things or avoid doing certain things, which I generally don't do, but might depending on the situation. If I feel that an obvious weakness is being overlooked then I won't. But if I feel that it is intentional and done so as to provide better performance in another area I will limit what is done and just comment on the possible weakness in whatever area is being ignored.

Anyway that being said. The reviews are done in stages. First off comes the general performance, low stress cutting ability, edge retention, sharpening, handle and sheath issues etc. . After this is done I relax for about 3-6 months and just look for long term wear issues. After this is done the work starts to get more and more stressful. A lot of it is not done by me personally but by friends who are simply told to do whatever comes up, don't be concerned about the consequences just try to find the scope of work.

The Basic in the picture above has been in stage three for quite some time and I am never failed to be amazed that it is still going strong. I have in fact asked for it to be returned to Busse Combat for retirement but the current owner was not exactly forthcoming in returning it. I think I will probably get a NO or SHII to trade for it.

Anyway, back to the method, I think it is very innovative as it requires little upperbody strength or grip stability and can be done readily with one hand. Consider in low temp situations where your hands are numb and/or injured and holding onto the grip and pounding with the other hand may be difficult/impossible. It is also quicker than a pound through. However it does place a lot of force on the knife, in a rather sudden jarring motion.

It is not the fear of a blade breakage that would prevent me from ever using it however, but the simple fact that it is very dangerous. Depending on how the knife hits you could easily get cut.


-Cliff



[This message has been edited by Cliff Stamp (edited 04-04-2001).]
 
Cliff,
To focus for a moment on the potential effectiveness of this technique in a "wilderness survival" scenario, have you ever attempted this maneuver on a surface other than concrete? I'm just curious what the effect would be if this same technique was used on a softer dirt surface.

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Semper Fi

-Bill
 
:
Cliff that's a pretty deep gouge without the knife suffering fatal consequences.
Did the edge impact or chip and how long did it take to bring it back to sharp?

I wonder how it would work doing it on a large slab of end grain wood.
And if the knife would further penetrate the wood and not be so apt to go flying through the air?

I am still amazed at my E-BM being able to chop well cured cow bone without any significient damage to the edge.

Like you have said, "Jerry you build one tough knife."
biggrin.gif



------------------
>>>>---Yvsa-G@WebTV.net---->®

"VEGETARIAN".............
Indin word for lousy hunter.
 
Bill, if the ground is really soft, I would assume you will just drive the blade into the dirt. However it should not take much to stop it, another piece of wood would be fine.

Yvsa, this pretty much turned the tip into a screwdriver. It didn't do much to the edge at all. I have chopped up concrete before and unless it contains rocks, it won't do much to a blade unless it can chip it out.

Not all concrete is equal though, there was an interesting discussion on this in the general forum last year or so.

And yes, if the knife is set in further the wood will tend to keep it in place. However if you take the time to set it in deeply (basically pased its own thickness). Then its not much more work to finish it off. It would be a way to kill a knot though.

-Cliff
 
Cliff,

Have any knives failed this test?

Is that wood dried?

Any thoughts on the effect of that method with a longer blade?

I have to say, I am impressed with a knife that can do that. Without specific knowledge that a knife could do that I would probably call that abuse.

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Thank you,
Marion David Poff aka Eye mdpoff@hotmail.com

My website, guided links, talonite/cobalt alloy info, etc....
http://www.geocities.com/mdpoff

>>--->Bill Siegle Custom Knives<---<<
-http://www.geocities.com/siegleknives-

"To wait for luck is the same as waiting for death." -Japanese Proverb

"A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step." Lao Tzu

"We will either find a way, or make one." Hannibal, 210 B.C.
 
Cliff,

This looks like it's way more productive stress-relief than therapy could ever be!
wink.gif


~Brian


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Brian Jones
Co-moderator
Wilderness & Survival Skills Forum

[This message has been edited by Brian Jones (edited 04-05-2001).]
 
:
Cliff what I was thinking of is a large flat piece of timber like douglas fir for example that's 2 feet or larger in diameter instead of the concrete. But I don't know how large in diameter the trees in your area are. In western Oregon it wasn't uncommon to find douglas fir up to 5 feet in diameter.
It would be interesting to see how much of the end grain the knife would chip out instead of the concrete and it may help to prevent the knife from flying away as well.


------------------
>>>>---Yvsa-G@WebTV.net---->®

"VEGETARIAN".............
Indin word for lousy hunter.
 
Marion, that particular piece of wood is dried and besides that quite old. As for blade length, you want to use the shortest possible. As the blade length increases the curvature induced by the stomp decreases and thus so does the splitting power.

You are exactly correct in your comment about it being abusive. I was of exactly the same mind the first time I saw it performed. As for other blades failing, I believe the Ontario machete cracked off. It was a piece of the 18" that I cracked off earlier.

As for other blades well to date it has not seen a lot. I would assume it will be a regular on future work. It was attempted with the Machax but the curvature made it problematic.

Yvsa, yes I was thinking of much the same thing in regards to outdoor use. One thing to be careful of is that the tip is drove in quite forcefully and then the blade is slammed down pretty much straight. If the tip digs in and is held, as it will be on wood, you will then be doing a very hard pry to straight. On concrete, the tip just blow a piece out and thus only sees an impact not a lateral stress.

-Cliff

 
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