Baton with a folder...Check this out!

WOW! Cross-cut baton-chopping with a folder.

That's pretty amazing. TBH i rarely use my knives, any of them, in this manner. The few times i have, and never in a wilderness setting, was strictly for testing.

I have gently batonned some small-ish (wrist-sized) rounds with my CS American Lawman and it did just fine, but i wouldn't want to depend on it - that's why i have a fixed-blade.
 
It's one of those things that nice to have if you need it. So far this Benchmade is the only folder I've seen pass this test. Many of the "hard use" folders that cost many time more didn't make it through this test. I've been looking for a just in case folder for some time now...I think I found it. :)
 
zpstl321 said:
It's one of those things that nice to have if you need it. So far this Benchmade is the only folder I've seen pass this test. Many of the "hard use" folders that cost many time more didn't make it through this test. I've been looking for a just in case folder for some time now...I think I found it. :)
Click to expand...

Can you elaborate on how they failed? Maybe it's the way I baton but I put very little pressure on the handle so batoning for me is a matter of how strong the blade is rather than the knife as a whole. Of course I don't make it a habit to baton folders because I generally have a fixed with me.

The way he rips the knife to the side is a good test on damage to the edge though but they don't show the edge in that vid.
 
I've never seen a folder eat on in a locked position that didn't cause the lock and or some part of the handle or bearings to fail. Of course proper batoni with a folder is dne inthe 90 degree open position, but many bearings fail from the vibraton during this test too. One of the really popular brands had blades twisting and breakins, tips breaking off, handles busted etc. When you alk tothem they sa don't bton them because they are not desined to tke i ad the warraty wn't cover batoning, throwing, or hard use. :)

Benchmade also posted up some lock test where they just keep adding pressure until it breaks. Watching the guage, it's crazy how much of a load that lock takes. You and 4 or 5 buds could std/jump on it and it old still hold up.
 
I was always taught to let the blade hang free when batoning to avoid messing with the lock/lock-up....it will result in bladeplay or a spoiled lock-up/lock if the blade is locked open. Didn't an Umnumzaan get messed up due to batoning?
 
That's why I was a little excited to see the Benchmade video. I've never seen a manufacture that had the guts to try that one. :)
 
Have you seen the guy in the back on his computer? Looks like he's not impressed by the action that's going on behind him.
If someone was doing this when i was around i wouldn't be surfing the net.
Great test, but not something i consider stadard practice to do with a knife.
These vids, however informative, might give he impression to new collectors that battoning a folder is a standard practice.
 
The Adamas has a beefed up axiz lock for military applications (read hard use folder) and withstands an additional 200 plus ft/lbs of force before any issues occur. Here is a video for a standard normal axis lock which shows the lock never failed, but th blade broke at 600 lbs.

[video=youtube;verXb0gZoM8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=verXb0gZoM8&feature=player_embedded[/video]

Here you can see the beefed up lock never fails even with 1600 inch lbs of force applied.

[video=youtube;6ZwwLWQk664]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ZwwLWQk664&feature=player_embedded[/video]
 
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zpstl321 said:
It's one of those things that nice to have if you need it. So far this Benchmade is the only folder I've seen pass this test. Many of the "hard use" folders that cost many time more didn't make it through this test. I've been looking for a just in case folder for some time now...I think I found it. :)
Click to expand...

I could baton cross grain just as well/quick with an Opinel. I'm pretty sure any triad lock folder would hold up just as well too. I'm sure my ZT's could hanlde it as well.

If it's the only folder you've seen capable of this, you haven't looked very far...

But more power to ya if you pick up an Adamas, it's a nice folder no doubt.

-sh00ter
 
That specific hammer was designed for absorbing impact energy more than transfer energy. Matter of fact, even today it still world wide use for house or cabin construction, to drive in pegs made of wood without damaging the peg itself!
Well, it is the Net era:eek::D
 
sh00ter01 said:
I could baton cross grain just as well/quick with an Opinel. I'm pretty sure any triad lock folder would hold up just as well too. I'm sure my ZT's could hanlde it as well.

If it's the only folder you've seen capable of this, you haven't looked very far...

But more power to ya if you pick up an Adamas, it's a nice folder no doubt.

-sh00ter
Click to expand...

Even the triad lock on the Espada XL, which I think can sustain the most weight, can only handle 600 something pounds. This one did 1600, right?
 
sh00ter01 said:
I could baton cross grain just as well/quick with an Opinel. I'm pretty sure any triad lock folder would hold up just as well too. I'm sure my ZT's could hanlde it as well.

If it's the only folder you've seen capable of this, you haven't looked very far...

But more power to ya if you pick up an Adamas, it's a nice folder no doubt.

-sh00ter
Click to expand...

You're kidding yourself if you believe that...I've seen both fail and the ZT has failed every baton test I seen done by the military and hard use tester.
 
Ferrari353 said:
Even the triad lock on the Espada XL, which I think can sustain the most weight, can only handle 600 something pounds. This one did 1600, right?
Click to expand...

You have to look as what EXACTLY is being measured and how the test are being done. Obviously there's a difference between Cold Steel guys hanging free weights on the tail end of a knife vs. using a dedicated machine that using very precise force to test to failure. To compare them fairly, it needs to be done the same way.

This was taken from another thread (about the test videos) where an individual emailed BM for clarification on their use of in/lbs vs ft/lbs, their response:
I talked with our engineering department and this is the answer I received about the YouTube video.

Concerning lock strength in knives, it is most practical and convenient to measure torque about the pivot of a folding knife using in-lbs. The main reason is that the average knife handle is around 4 inches long, and the force applied when prying or putting weight against the lock is distributed more or less evenly across the length of the handle. This can be simulated by applying a single point load half way along the handle (ie. 2" from the pivot).
The calculation for torque is this:
T (Torque around the pivot) = F (Force applied) X D (Distance from where the force is applied to the pivot)
For this equation to be valid, the distance must be consistent. Since we measure the distance to the pivot in inches, the resulting torque must also be In-Lbs, not Ft-Lbs.
In practical terms, 600 in-lbs of torque is the equivalent of having to apply 300 lbs of force to the handle. Most users would not be capable of applying that much force to a knife.
Typically ft-lbs would be used to measure something with a longer fulcrum arm, like a crowbar, not a knife.
Click to expand...

So really, 600 in the test means about 300lbs real world in ideal conditions and that's straight from the horses mouth.




zpstl321 said:
You're kidding yourself if you believe that...I've seen both fail and the ZT has failed every baton test I seen done by the military and hard use tester.
Click to expand...

And you're drinking the kool-aid if you don't...

And since when does the military do baton testing of folders?


If I baton an Opinel through a 2x4 and film it what do I get? I'll even use a regular hammer, not a dead blow:eek::D

-sh00ter
 
Yeah I don't know. I'm not into batonning folders so I haven't looked at all the "tests" out there for a comparison but I can't see how this "test" actually tests anything other than how strong the edge is. You're applying a force straight down on the blade which has an opposite force from the wood. How is the pivot or lock getting stressed to where it would fail in this test?
 
I'm not going to educate you. As to the military test use your googlefu. The Adamas would be 900lbs and I'm done with you!
 
zpstl321 said:
I'm not going to educate you. As to the military test use your googlefu. The Adamas would be 900lbs and I'm done with you!
Click to expand...

No need to educate me, take the time to read up yourself. Half of 1600 is 800lbs by the way and again, that's in ideal/controlled conditions with the force being a constant in only one direction.

Oh and those Cold steel test they post up online generally are at 4" from the pivot not 2" like the BM, kinda puts thing in perspective a little doesn't it;) And just to be clear, I'm not a CS fanboy, I'm just using them as an example cause they're the only other manufacture I know publicly posting videos of lock strength test.

Guess you're not interested in seeing what my Super Tough-Ultra Strong-Bomb Proof Opinel is capable of... oh well...:D

-sh00ter
 
zpstl321 said:
I'm not going to educate you. As to the military test use your googlefu. The Adamas would be 900lbs and I'm done with you!
Click to expand...

Sorry bud I just don't see what you're seeing. You have a force from the baton and a reactionary force from the wood. The reason why I don't think this tests anything other than edge strength is because the test is setup to where these forces are in line. Meaning there's nothing being torqued other than what the guy does with the hand holding the knife. Don't get me wrong, if the edge came out pristine from that guy ripping the knife to the side, it's still impressive. However they don't really show the edge in detail.
 
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