Becker vs KaBar

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Leather

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Becker vs KaBar

Becker Knife & Tool, COMBAT / UTILITY KNIFE

versus

KaBar Next Generation

I have narrowed my choice down for my final purchase between these two knives. I am interested to hear which knife you would pick and why.

Thank you,
 
I think the Beckers would be a better all around knife thna the Kabar.... I found the kabar blade is too thin for chopping tasks and stuff. Perhaps I'm wrong with the D-2.
However I think D-2 is classified as semistainless (check Mr. Talmadge's FAQ in here) and would stain "less" than the carbon steel in the Beckers.
I'd choose a Becker myself anyways.
 
Originally posted by calyth
I think the Beckers would be a better all around knife thna the Kabar.... I found the kabar blade is too thin for chopping tasks and stuff. Perhaps I'm wrong with the D-2.
However I think D-2 is classified as semistainless (check Mr. Talmadge's FAQ in here) and would stain "less" than the carbon steel in the Beckers.
I'd choose a Becker myself anyways.
Click to expand...

Hello,

How much better is the D2 than the Next Generation KaBar ?
 
They're making some of them in a similar pattern to the traditional (#1217) in D2 but for the price that they're selling for the D-2 version, you're much better off getting the Becker anyways. The Becker would be cheaper and very likely to perform better.
Their next gen has no mention of the steel that they use.....
As to how much better the D-2 is over the next generation... I have no idea.
 
The Next Gen Kabars were made out of 12C27 but I hear they just changed to AUS6A or 440A.

Leather, if you have the money, why don't you get both? That way you will know which will work best for you.;)
 
I hear 440A in a knife store for the next gen Kabar. The stock thickness is still the same, but I suspect the Becker would be thicker and make a better chopper than the Kabar would.
 
Hi,
Anybody know when they switched to 440A? I just purchased a next generation knife and so far I like it very well. Admittedly the narrow tang is something of a concern - but overall its the best combination of grip (personally), blade and sheath I have found. For instance, the Fallkniven A! has a great blade, but the grip isn't so great. The Buck nighthawk is a good knife with very bad sheath... And I haven't had any problems chopping with the Ka-Bar - plus it whittles better, holds an edge well and is simple to sharpen.

Anyway, just curious to know whether mine is the 440A or Sandvik.
 
Hi,
Anybody know when they switched to 440A? I just purchased a next generation knife and so far I like it very well. Admittedly the narrow tang is something of a concern - but overall its the best combination of grip (personally), blade and sheath I have found. For instance, the Fallkniven A! has a great blade, but the grip isn't so great. The Buck nighthawk is a good knife with very bad sheath... And I haven't had any problems chopping with the Ka-Bar - plus it whittles better, holds an edge well and is simple to sharpen.

Anyway, just curious to know whether mine is the 440A or Sandvik.
 
The Kabar Next Generation hands down winner if you are looking for a fighting knife. Buy a copy of Greg Walkers book "Kabar the Next Generation." Greg is the real thing, not a wanna be. He explains how Kabar, over almost seven years, designed and field tested the Next Generation to be the ultimate fighter. The book gives a fascinating inside look at what really goes on inside a knife Co. You will change your mind about Kabar relying on it's name when it comes to knife design. The book is available from Paladin Press. Definitely read it before you offer any opinions.
 
Avenger,

I do like my Ka-Bar next generation very well - in fact it's one of my favorites. I'm not using it as a fighting knife, but more as a utility blade. Seems to handle any job with ease, at least so far. I'm just looking for a bit more info - sounds like Greg Walker's book is something I should read. Thanks for the tip.

I had contacted Ka-Bar about when they switched to 440A, but never got a response, just though someone here might know. Anyone know why they switched? (yes I know this is the Camillus forum - perhaps not the best choice - but this is where I found the original string...:rolleyes:
 
I have a BK7 and a KaBar 1272 Next Gen Fighting knife, purchased for general survival, utility and camp chores. Have to say that I rank the BK7 a bit higher than the KaBar (especially for the price). BUT, my Ontario RTAK has surpassed both in utility and value.

TT2Toes
 
Hey Leather

I hope I can help you with your choice! Yes I am Prejudiced but... If you will let me I will share with you some of the choices I made when I designed the BK7. The BK7 is by the way Camillus "new Generation" replacement for the venerable MK2 Marine Combat/Utility knife designed by and first made at Camillus in early WW2. I think it only fair to comment that when compared to other "issue" knives the 60 year old MK2 stacks up really well. Off hand, I cannot think of any better belt knife issued in quantity until perhaps the last couple of years.
Ka Bar tried an incremental approach .They Retained the fullers (as a kid I always referred to these as Blood Grooves)and the low hollow grind of the early Camillus product.
By contrast I was told to start with a fresh sheet of paper and so,..with the luxury of ten years of thinking about how to improve this classic(lots of clever people have thought about this same problem and BSed about it at some lengthj and some shared their thoughts, often in the" pit "at BLADE show - Steve Dick and Chuck Karwan come instantly but not exclusively to mind) . I immediately got rid of the upper guard which does little for a knife's fighting ability and is a positive hindrance to the field chores usually asked of a soldiers knife.I have been a MK2 fan since childhood ( my first case of knife envy was when Jeff Mesmer got one about age 10) but as an adult I have not been a fan of the MK2's low hollow grind so I put a high flat grind on a wide blade to give the blade some real slice and dice ability. The wide blade makes a really big hole - mind that if I did forget to bring that gun to the knife fight I really want my BK6 or almost any kukri. The MK2's main structural weakness was the stick tang so I used a skeletonized full tang. I also extended the tang rearward to make a headache inducer and a spot to hammer on or to break things wit, not to use as a hammer. Whatever knife you buy I urge you to NOT use the butt as a hammer as in nails or stakes. When you miss it really hurts - I have scars. Yeah, that's plural - I am German and we learn slow.

In answer to the steels problem 440A is a pretty reasonable conventional stainless cutlery steel, I used it for a dive knife but it is noy comparable in aggressivness or edge holding or edge retention to thD2. That brings us to the steel of the BK7 which is Camillus' proprietary O170-6C. Designed from the ground up to be a cutlery steel it exhibits outstanding aggressive cutting qualities with truly superior edge retention and is really easy to sharpen! I hope this makes your decision making a little easier...By the way you will find the Beckers a lot more affordable...Sometimes less IS more !

All Best
Ethan
 
Ethan,

First of all, thanks for your reply! I do agree that the BK-7 has a lot of nice structural features in it that make it a stronger knife than the Ka-Bar (such as the full tang you mentioned).

I have one further question about the 0170-6C steel Camillus uses for the BK-7. How does it hold-up to the elements - ie. corrosion resistance? Both the Ka-Bar and the BK-7 have coated blades and the 440A is pretty corrosion resistant all be itself. I know that most combat-utility blades are carbon steel - and I've always wondered why makers chose that over the stainless.

Dan

PS - I've heard lots of good things about the BK-7 from a variety of others too, not just you. :)
 
Hey Dan

Thanks for a great leading question. Most stainless steels that I am familiar with have only one thing to recommend them for cutlery applications ....they do not rust as rapidly as carbon steels. 440A has excellent mechanical qualities and is IMHO a decent performer . Better is 154CM from Crucible. The newest Crucible Tool Steels offer great promise, I really like CPM S30V
(When Chris Reeve goes bleeding BONKERS over something I listen very,very carefully). Some carbon tool steels have outstanding aggressiveness. You can feel the talons (OK,OK They are in reality carbides) ripping microscopically away !!!
I have a few Murray Carter kitchen knives that I use on a daily basis and they are of various Hitachi carbon steels and they outcut any stainless I am aware of(S30V may just be a real sleeper here... time will tell). In my experience if you get the most devoted stainless fan who has wide experience in the field drunk enough he will admit that stainless is mostly just prettier.
I have reasonably extensive using experience with several Carbon steels and of those, that , I think have both the mechanical strength as well as that really aggressive edge that I love so much Are:
0170-6C, A2, Carbon V, 1095, 4140 and D2.
I should also mention price differentials... 1095 , 4140 are both really inexpensive ( note I did NOT say cheap,) Jerry Fisk makes his knives from any damn thing he wants and he mostly wants 1095. A2 and D2 are a bit pricey more but still probably 1/4 that of say...440A and way less than a tenth of some of the better exotics. Mind that that el inexpensivo 1095 will out perform the expensive chromium blondes in aggresiveness, edge retention and ease of sharpening all day long.
Hope this helps....

All Best...

Ethan
 
Ethan, from your comments above I see that you aren't too enamored of stainless, and yet....don't you think there's somewhat of a market for stainless versions of the BK-7 & 9?

I know I'd snap up two of each immediately!

Sure, one of the big draws for these knives are their great pricing, but, depending on alloy, I'd pay up to 2x for a spiffier stainless version, with G-10 textured scales.

As to particular alloy, S30V?
 
If you like the MK II, buy the Camillus Mil-Spec version, a much better knife than the Ka-Bar IMHO. The BK-7 is far and away the better knife, but the MK II is very racy.
 
As a no nonsense field knife, the Becker BK-7 equals or outperforms the Ka-Bar in every catagoryincluding edge retention, chopping, stabbing/penetration, handle durability, slicing, prying strength, tang strength, balance, and in the long run, hammering. I cut, hacked, and chopped though a 5-6 inch thick tree branch with the BK-7 and it was still pretty sharp. If a Ka-Bar was put up to the task and could complete it it would very dull.
Because of the high saber grind on the BK-7, it cuts and slices MUCH better. But what really knocked my socks off is that it is much easier to sharpen when it finally does get dull. The Ka-Bar blade is thicker, gets dull faster, and is harder to sharpen and keep sharp.
The Bk-7 will also fare better as a fighter, in my opinion. The concave top sharpened portion of the Ka-bar will eventually get sharpened down to more of a hook, making deep penetration less efficient than the BK-7's spear point. However, you can sharpen the top portion of the BK-7 and not have to worry about it being ground down to a "hook" shape over time.
The Bk-7's tang is also much stronger. Using the Ka-Bar in extreme cold weather temperatures, i know that its tang bends rather easily from exposure to the cold.

Don't get me wrong, i love the Ka-Bar, it was my first fixed blade field knife, and the US Marines wouldn't love the knife and even go out of their way to use it instead of what they are issued(m-9 bayonets) if it wasn't a good knife. If i were stuck in a wilderness/work/tactical/survival enviroment, the Ka-Bar would meet my needs just fine for a knife. But in my opinion, the Becker BK-7 would meet them better. After all, it is a the finalized prodigy of the Ka-Bar, having over 10 years put into it's design and being based on adressing the shortcomings of the Ka-Bar and surpassing the Ka-Bar.
 
I own ALOT of knives. Among my knives are 6 Camillus/Beckers and NO KaBars. That might tell you something about how I feel about Becker VS: KaBar.:).
 
Although they are now both from the same stable I have to tip my hat to the Beckers although you can't really go wrong with either.
With the introduction of the new Zombie line from Ka-Bar both now offer some very tempting models.........too many great knives for my poor thin wallet to keep up with !!!!
 
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