Beginner stones and Moras

The Government

The Government

Joined
Aug 21, 2009
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I am going to try and expand my skill range and learn to sharpen on stones. I plan to start on my Mora knives since they are cheap and I have heard that scandi grinds are easy to start with.

So, what do you think of these offerings: http://www.ragweedforge.com/SharpeningCatalog.html

I am particularly interested in the "two sided Arkansas stone" for $9.

Is it too cheap? Too small to learn on? Which one would you guys suggest?

Any other comments are welcome,


Thanks.
 
Govt. I'd get the larger stone,2x6" minimum.You'd be better off w/ a 2x8".The twin grit is good thinking.The Arkansas's will remove metal slow but they will work.If thats what you desire.For more info. check some other postings on this subject before purchasing.As several have ask this question.DM
 
Thanks. I will do some more research. One reason I posted was to see what everyone thought of Ragweedforge's offerings. I would like to start on natural stones. I have a guided daimond sharpener, but I want to learn freehand.

Since I dont really know anything about stones -other than course, medium, fine, and super fine -I was curious about quality.

Thanks
 
Ok,If your staying w/ Arkansas stones,their quality has gone down over the years.The quarry is being depleated.Some companies selling these stones are offering a inferior product.I'd get it from Norton sharpening stones at, http://www.toolsforworkingwood.com . Purchase a Washita (med.),a white soft or white hard and a hard black Arkansas in the size previously stated and a strop from them.This system will sharpen slow and be very forgiving but will give you what you want.Let us know how it goes.DM
 
I've a dozen or more stones, including Norton (very good), but I've gone to using diamond
plate (unguided) for 90% of my sharpening and honing. I've got Ragweed's diamond plates and glued them to a wood block to clamp in my bench vice. They remove steel quickly, cleanly and give a fine working edge.

Rich
 
Often repeated advice:

A) Buy the biggest stones you can afford.
B) Buy a stone as long as the longest knife you plan to sharpen.

That second advice seems particularly good to me. Trying to sharpen a 9" knife on a 4" stone is a pain. You definitely want larger stones than smaller.

Years ago I started with a medium sized Arkansas stone. I'm not even sure if it was soft or hard; I think hard. Sharpening was slow going with that. Now I really don't see the point. I'd rather use a coarse synthetic stone to get the bulk of the work done and then use finer stones to polish and refine the edge. Yes an Arkansas is more forgiving, but in the end you spend so much more time. YMMV.

Specifically, I use a medium silicon carbide stone. Norton calls that "medium crystolon"; that's just their trade name. For refining the edge, I use a Spyderco profile medium and fine.

This gets confusing because coarse, medium, and fine are only relative terms. Medium silicon carbide is very coarse, while medium ceramic is quite fine. This chart might help illustrate the point. Note: That chart isn't necessarily to scale. It just shows the relative cut rate and sharpness levels of different kinds of stones.

I really like the Spyderco ceramics. I haven't used diamond stones, but they're tempting because of the cut rate. I'm mainly worried about them wearing out, as so many people report that they get finer and eventually wear out, which seems like a bad investment given how expensive they are relative to other types of stones.

A strop is like magic in a way. I'd get a strop and some compound and learn to use it sooner than later. Even cardboard works pretty well as a strop; especially with chromium oxide compound.

Brian.
 
Thanks for that link and advice DM. I have done a little research and now I am second guessing my desire to use natural stones. From what I gather they are the slowest. I took a look at one of those "Speed VS Sharpness" charts and now I am going to consider waterstones as well. I really would like to try it all, but funds are limiting and I want to buy once and buy right -im forgetting about that cheap $9 stone all together.

About strops... Up until now I use a leather belt that I put on my table. It is a nice one that is smooth on both sides and I use it dry. Should I also get in to the "world of strop compounds?" -or can I continue to dry strop?

Thanks.
 
Thanks brian, I missed you post while I was on mine. I saw that chart last night and it seems to make the claim that waterstones are very close in performance to daimond. I will also look into spyderco, I remember seeing some fair prices.

If I buy another belt and get some compound, can I just use that? Also what is a reasonable price for compound -I dont need the cream of the crop, just something that works significantly better than dry stropping.

Thanks

>>>>>>>>Update<<<<<<<<< I Found a package deal for two norton waterstones 220/1k and 4k/8k and it comes with a flattening plate all for 130 bucks. This seems like a great start, no? Dimensions 8 by 3 by 1
 
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My personal choice for stones is a coarse DMT, A med. Spyderco alumina ceramic, and a fine Spyderco alumina ceramic. These stones have served me extremely well. There is nothing that can't be sharpened with them, except recurved blades. My logic is this: The coarse DMT removes steel quickly and cleanly, establishing an edge quickly, before frustration sets in. The 2 Spydercos refine and polish the edge exceptionally well, and require no lubrication. They are extremely flat and will remain so for decades to come.
 
For sharpening scandi grind knives its hard to beat a waterstone. The waterstones seem to grind the bevel more evenly than any other stone probably because you can make them very flat.

Also look here for a good stone selection http://www.highlandwoodworking.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&Category=628&Page=1

I use Ice bear stones for finishing and they work very well, I was also told that they work better on harder steels and that was another reason for getting them. They are a little smaller but they are also a good price.
http://www.woodcraft.com/Family/2021109/Ice-Bear-Water-Stones.aspx
 
Govt.,Your asking alot of the same things here.We need to put this info.somewhere and have guys just refer to it.The waterstones are messy and wear out the fastest.Next are diamond (with just a very thin film for cutting) which are costly on the initial investment.They work well but their down side is economy.Norton India and SiC stones, cut close to the speed of diamond,have a low initial investment and last longer.Then Arkansas,high investment,slow cutting and last a long time.A compound w/ your strop will greatly assist the efforts here.The green is good,chromium oxide doubles your return.Diamond paste more so but costly.Your call.DM
 
To answer your other question, Ragnar at Ragweed Forge is a fantastic guy to deal with. Great prices, and lightning fast shipping. You can't go wrong with him.
 
sodak said:
To answer your other question, Ragnar at Ragweed Forge is a fantastic guy to deal with. Great prices, and lightning fast shipping. You can't go wrong with him.
Click to expand...

I have ordered many things from Ragnar -He is awesome and I agree.

It would be nice to have a sticky thread about this info, but I would not be able to help in making one, so its not my call. Thanks for the help everyone -didnt mean to load the forum with common nube questions. I think I will be looking for waterstones now. Later on I will most likely try other things.

Again, thanks
 
The Government said:
If I buy another belt and get some compound, can I just use that? Also what is a reasonable price for compound -I dont need the cream of the crop, just something that works significantly better than dry stropping.
Click to expand...

As for belts, an unfinished leather side is what you are looking for I believe. I've stropped on smooth leather, as well as rough leather and both seemed to work to some degree. As long as the belt you want to use is *not* shiny and sealed, I would think it would work.

I only have a little experience with compound, but I'll share. I bought a $2 stick (4 oz) of green chromium oxide from Northern Tool and Supply and have rubbed that into cardboard. It produces much better and faster results that cardboard by itself, or leather by itself. I haven't used it on leather yet, but should do that soon. I'm guessing this compound isn't exactly "0.5 micron" and probably contains much larger particles. Some here would almost certainly say it is "poor quality" compound. It probably is. But I can tell you for certain that it produces results beyond what my Spyderco fine ceramic is able to. The fine Spyderco is estimated to be ~1200 grit (2000 to 3000 in water stone grit).

As for your plans to work with water stones, I can't offer any opinion, as I have no experience. I'll just say, "Good luck!" Oh, that, and plan on getting a big plastic tub to work over and soak your stones in like Murray Carter does here :)

Brian.
 
I just use sand paper. From 400 grit to 8000 grit. 600 and 1500 will do a great job, I just like to polish them a little more.
 
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