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Belt sanders.
- Thread starter jep
- Start date
- Joined
- Oct 5, 1998
- Messages
- 243
As far as I'm concerned, wide belt machines are unsuitable for knifemaking (other than swords). There are just too many jobs that require you to get into small areas where the wide belt will not fit.
I started out with 6X48 with a 1/2 hp motor. It was a real pain - way underpowered, and the belt selection was poor. It is hard to use the wide belts because you cannot generate enough pressure to cut steel efficiently, and the width gets in the way for many, many jobs.
I switched to a 1X42 with a 1/2 hp motor and was much happier. I could find good belts in 2X42 locally and split them. This was still slightly underpowered. Bob Engnath recommended 3/4hp per inch of belt width, but 1/2 will do it if you are patient. Even today, I use a 1hp 2X72 which still only gives me 1/2hp per inch. I still have the 1 X 42 as well, it's just handier for some jobs.
Matt
http://www.planet.eon.net/~matth
I started out with 6X48 with a 1/2 hp motor. It was a real pain - way underpowered, and the belt selection was poor. It is hard to use the wide belts because you cannot generate enough pressure to cut steel efficiently, and the width gets in the way for many, many jobs.
I switched to a 1X42 with a 1/2 hp motor and was much happier. I could find good belts in 2X42 locally and split them. This was still slightly underpowered. Bob Engnath recommended 3/4hp per inch of belt width, but 1/2 will do it if you are patient. Even today, I use a 1hp 2X72 which still only gives me 1/2hp per inch. I still have the 1 X 42 as well, it's just handier for some jobs.
Matt
http://www.planet.eon.net/~matth
- Joined
- Oct 3, 1998
- Messages
- 4
I believe I replied to your(?) post on rec.knives. In case you don't see it there, I'll paste it in here:
ALERT: You might want to recheck into the Craftsman line of belt sander/grinders, they have two that are *considerably* more powerful than the ones you are quoting.
Craftsman has a 2" x 42" belt with an 8" disc sander/grinder, with a full *one horse power* motor. This unit will also take a 1" x 42" belt. It has a rmovable platen, for slack belt/contouring work. The cost on these (in the store, as opposed to the catelog) is just over $200, and I would add about 10% for the extended warrantee.
Also, if you're looking at the larger belt set-up, Craftsman has a 6" x 48" belt with a 9" disc sander/grinder, with a *one and a half horse power* motor. This unit does *not* have a removable platen, but is recommended by sword smith Randal Graham as a decent starting grinder for sword making (due to its power and ability to do flat grinding). Cost on these is a bit over $300, and again, I would add on the warrantee.
The 2" x 42" model is posted on the Sears/Craftsman web site. The 6" x 48", which I *have* seen in stores and in the catelog, was not viewable online last time I checked (about a month or two ago).
If I were doing mostly knives, I would probably go for the 2" x 42" version (which is probably what I will do). It seems to be a bit more versitile, and the belts are much cheaper to replace. And while I may be very wrong about this, in my hallucinations, I find the 6" wide belt cumbersome on smaller (knife sized) blades.
However, if I were going to mostly swords (which I would love to if I had all the heat treating equipment for such large blades), then I would probably go for the more powerful 6" x 48" grinder. Especially since most of the bevels would be flat and/or convex grinds anyway. Plus, if used correctly, a 6" x 48" belt offers a hell of a
lot more "real estate" on the belt.
Just a few thoughts -- information is power!
Marty
ALERT: You might want to recheck into the Craftsman line of belt sander/grinders, they have two that are *considerably* more powerful than the ones you are quoting.
Craftsman has a 2" x 42" belt with an 8" disc sander/grinder, with a full *one horse power* motor. This unit will also take a 1" x 42" belt. It has a rmovable platen, for slack belt/contouring work. The cost on these (in the store, as opposed to the catelog) is just over $200, and I would add about 10% for the extended warrantee.
Also, if you're looking at the larger belt set-up, Craftsman has a 6" x 48" belt with a 9" disc sander/grinder, with a *one and a half horse power* motor. This unit does *not* have a removable platen, but is recommended by sword smith Randal Graham as a decent starting grinder for sword making (due to its power and ability to do flat grinding). Cost on these is a bit over $300, and again, I would add on the warrantee.
The 2" x 42" model is posted on the Sears/Craftsman web site. The 6" x 48", which I *have* seen in stores and in the catelog, was not viewable online last time I checked (about a month or two ago).
If I were doing mostly knives, I would probably go for the 2" x 42" version (which is probably what I will do). It seems to be a bit more versitile, and the belts are much cheaper to replace. And while I may be very wrong about this, in my hallucinations, I find the 6" wide belt cumbersome on smaller (knife sized) blades.
However, if I were going to mostly swords (which I would love to if I had all the heat treating equipment for such large blades), then I would probably go for the more powerful 6" x 48" grinder. Especially since most of the bevels would be flat and/or convex grinds anyway. Plus, if used correctly, a 6" x 48" belt offers a hell of a
lot more "real estate" on the belt.
Just a few thoughts -- information is power!
Marty
- Joined
- Dec 14, 1998
- Messages
- 4,870
You may want to go with a 2x48 . They have these available without a motor. Then buy a 1 hp and add it.. Makes a nice inexpensive grinder. Koval has this set up 1 614 855 0777
Try to buy once and buy equiptment that can be used later when the bug gets so strong that you have to have a 2x72..
------------------
Darrel Ralph / Bladesmith
Web www.infinet.com/~browzer
Take a look!!!!
Try to buy once and buy equiptment that can be used later when the bug gets so strong that you have to have a 2x72..
------------------
Darrel Ralph / Bladesmith
Web www.infinet.com/~browzer
Take a look!!!!
- Joined
- Oct 3, 1998
- Messages
- 94
You really have to watch Sears H.P. advertisements.They always list max H.P.
that is measured right before failure.
Continuous H.P. is the rateing you should
use and is always less then max.Every one
has seen their tablesaws advertised as 3
H.P. when hanging off the back is a 1.5 H.P.
motor.
that is measured right before failure.
Continuous H.P. is the rateing you should
use and is always less then max.Every one
has seen their tablesaws advertised as 3
H.P. when hanging off the back is a 1.5 H.P.
motor.
I purchased the Sears 2x42 belt sander at $195. It has 1hp motor. I like it. It works much faster than a bench grinder. However,there is no chance of using the lower wheel as a contact wheel for hollow grinding because it is entirely enclosed. The 2x42 belts are hard to find except at Sears. It can probably use a 1x42 belt which is available at most knife supply places.
I think you will you will be unhappy without more than 1/4hp. Jim
I think you will you will be unhappy without more than 1/4hp. Jim
I started with one of those sears 1x42, with disc on the side. Not sure of hp rite now. it served its purpose well for my beginning period, although if you bear down to hard you can stop the belt. It made me really appreciate the Bader that i moved up to. But the old one is still in my shop and still gets used for various applications.
- Joined
- Nov 22, 1998
- Messages
- 687
I have the Craftsman 2x42. I havn't used it to grind a blade, yet. I'd been buying pre-ground blades from Blades n Stuff (I sure miss them). I used the 2x42 grinder for doing the handles. It sure is faster than the dremel I'd been using. Now with Blades n Stuff gone (sigh) I'm going to grind my own from O-1. I'll let you all know how it goes.
------------------
Ciao
MM
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Ciao
MM
I've used both the Sears 1 x 42 and 2 x 42" models. I still use the 1 x 42 for contouring handle materials, and its been running for some ten years. The only problem with using it is that the platen is wider than the belt, so you can't get in close from the one side when grinding. The contact wheel on the bottom actually works well for 'hogging' off excess wood on a handle as long as you stick to a coarse grit belt and replace it when it gets dull or packed up. You can usually find them on sale for not much more than that 1/4 hp someone mentioned, since you need all the power of the 1/2 horse to work, and you can still stall the belt pretty easy.
I'm still using the 2 x 42 for grinding, only it now is coupled to a 2 hp tefc motor, since the original one went belly up after a year. The original motor did have more than enough power when it worked, but now its almost impossible to stall out. Nice feature is that you can remove the platen to reshape it so that the top is rounded, and it is narrowed and the edges rounded so that the belt will just curl around on the edges. Makes doing plunge cuts a lot easier, and the belt edge is less likely to dig in while you're grinding and put deep scratches or an unintentional divot in your grind!
BTW, you can order 2 x 42" belts from Supergrit, Red Hill Corp. or Industrial Abrasives for only about $1.20 a belt....about 1/3 what Sears wants. They usually advertise in Knives Illustrated and Blade. Just ask for the size and grit you want.
If I were to do it again, I would build a 2 x 72 from a kit, so I would get a sander where the contact wheel was out in the open where I could use it for stock removal, even though I don't hollow grind.
mel sorg
madpoet custom knives
I'm still using the 2 x 42 for grinding, only it now is coupled to a 2 hp tefc motor, since the original one went belly up after a year. The original motor did have more than enough power when it worked, but now its almost impossible to stall out. Nice feature is that you can remove the platen to reshape it so that the top is rounded, and it is narrowed and the edges rounded so that the belt will just curl around on the edges. Makes doing plunge cuts a lot easier, and the belt edge is less likely to dig in while you're grinding and put deep scratches or an unintentional divot in your grind!
BTW, you can order 2 x 42" belts from Supergrit, Red Hill Corp. or Industrial Abrasives for only about $1.20 a belt....about 1/3 what Sears wants. They usually advertise in Knives Illustrated and Blade. Just ask for the size and grit you want.
If I were to do it again, I would build a 2 x 72 from a kit, so I would get a sander where the contact wheel was out in the open where I could use it for stock removal, even though I don't hollow grind.
mel sorg
madpoet custom knives