- Joined
- May 18, 1999
- Messages
- 1,708
I was fortunate enough to get in on a 585 and 890 pass around on another forum, so here is my attempt at a knife review (with pics!).
Other than the AO feature, a head-to-head comparison isn't really fair since they are different sized knives. I'll compare some things about the knives that are comparable, such as blade steel, handle shape, the AO, but the rest will be comparisons of the knives against other BM knives that I own that are similar to each of them. I had the opportunity to hit the local B&M that has a 580 Barrage and compared the 890 to the 580, so my thoughts on that are included as well.
585 vs. mini-Grip, mini-Ambush
I know that the mini-Barrage is not in the same league as the mini-Grip or mini-Ambush, but they are the knives I own that are similar in size, so I'll compare the 585 to them. The mini-Ambush is a very nice red-class knife, and since I have managed to get it away from my son for this review, I'm finding that the rolling lock is growing on me. It still isn't an Axis, though, and the 585 definitely shines in that regard. The steel in the 585 is definitely better than the AUS-8 of the mini-Ambush, and the belly sweeps more gently on the 585. The 10210 looks as if it's trying to be a rounded tanto style. The grip is made of the same material as the 10210, but is definitely beefier and fills the hand better than the mini-Ambush. Obviously, I would pick the 585.
The mini-Grip has the same blade steel as the mini-Barrage, so that is a wash. I am torn as to whether I like the modified sheepsfoot blade or the drop point spear of the 585 more, but blade shape is basically a user preference. I am a fan of the round hole over thumb studs, so the 555HG wins there, along with the thumb ridges on the spine. The mini-Barrage is considerably thicker than the mini-Grip. In fact, even my 710 is thinner! For a knife that is going to be a workhorse knife, the handle fills out my hand better than the mini-Grip. For carrying edc, however, I think I prefer the mini-Grip (and I used to think it was almost too fat). The 580/585 would really benefit from thinner scales before it became my edc, and clip screws that thread into the steel liners. I do like the feel of the Valox on the 585 over the Noryl of the 555HG.
890 Torrent vs. mini-AFCK and 710
My mini-AFCK is my absolute favorite knife, even though it is a liner lock. The ergonomics of the handle and blade is nearly perfect, imo, and the size is just right for a short guy like me with smallish hands. The belly has a nice sweep to it, but is not too curved, with a nice point. Mine is a left-handed mini-AFCK, since the power-that-be at BM did not deem it a worthy enough knife to offer with an Axis lock as they did the 806. To this day, I consider that a big mistake on BM's part, so please keep that bias in mind as I compare the 890 to my mini-AFCK and my 710.
The Torrent is slightly larger than the 812, with thicker scales and, it appears, thicker liners. The belly of the blade is more rounded and doesn't come to as sharp of a point, but the 800 and 812 were designed as a self-defense knife, where the 890 was not. The scales, as mentioned, are too smooth, but the pattern is nicer than the utilitarian look of the mini-AFCK's G10. They just need to have a rougher texture. The blade steel is comparable, as my 812 has ATS-34 steel. Blade size is comparable 3.6 vs. 3.25 and the blade geometry on both is very good. The mini-AFCK sits more comfortably in my pocket, largely due to being thinner, but the Torrent sits a lot lower, with only the clip being visible. Both are tip-down carry. As it is now, the mini-AFCK still stays my favorite. If the Torrent came in a lefty version, I would consider getting one.
Compared to the 710, the Torrent is smaller, but still thicker. The 710 is about maximum size for my hands, and the Torrent is definitely more comfortable and more attractive. The G-10 of the Torrent has a nicer pattern to it, but still needs to be rougher for better gripping. Steel is comparable in my 710, as it has the older ATS-34 blade instead of the newer D2 blades (that may change this summer). The belly is more rounded in the Torrent, and I prefer straight blades over recurved blades, like the 710. The thumb serrations on the 710 is a plus, and I really wish the folks at BM (or maybe Ken Steigerwalt) had included them on the Torrent. Of course the Axis lock is my preference over the liner lock, but if they made the Torrent in a lefty version, it would most likely replace my 710, smooth scales and all.
Other than the AO feature, a head-to-head comparison isn't really fair since they are different sized knives. I'll compare some things about the knives that are comparable, such as blade steel, handle shape, the AO, but the rest will be comparisons of the knives against other BM knives that I own that are similar to each of them. I had the opportunity to hit the local B&M that has a 580 Barrage and compared the 890 to the 580, so my thoughts on that are included as well.
- Both have same steel for the blade: 154CM is a good choice in steel.
- Assisted opening: The 890's action is slower than the 585's. I think this is partially due to the Torrent having a larger blade thus having more mass to get moving, but mostly due to the design of the Nitrous vs. the Axis Assist. The Nitrous torsion bars lose contact with the tang of the blade when the blade is at less than a 90deg angle. The Axis assist has a coil spring that applies tension the entire length of travel, making for a stronger and faster opening. The additional lock for the 585 is an added plus. That being said, I have no problem with the speed of the Nitrous system on the 890. The AO on the 580 is slower than the 585, confirming my theory that the extra mass of the larger blade also contributes to slowing the Torrent down.
- Handle: as far as shape, I prefer the shape of the Torrent over the Barrage. It fits my hand more like the handle of my mini-AFCK, which is still my benchmark for ergonomic handles. However, I really dislike the smooth G10. The scales need some texture to them for better gripping, and the mini-Barrage wins in this although it could stand to be a bit more aggressive as well. The back spacer of the 890 is superior to the 580/585, being steel and extending to the end of the handle, ending in a slight point that can be used as a striking aid in self-defense situations or as a glass breaker. The 580/585 is just more plastic with an OK pattern on it. The 580 fills the hand very well providing a good solid grip. The shape is just oh-so-different, a bit better than the 585 and is more comfortable.
- Blade configuration for both is very similar, with the 585 having slightly more of a belly to it than the 890. I like them both, but I think the Torrent edges out the mini-Barrage for sleek lines. The 585's blade just looks fatter. One ding on both of them is the lack of serrations on the spine like my mini-Grip, mini-AFCK, 710, and my son's mini-Ambush have. Lacking that extra traction for the thumb is a negative thing, imo. The blade on the 580 is more similar to the 890, having less fat-ness to it and looking sleeker.
- The pocket clip of the 585 is parkerized, while the 890 is shiny. The 890 sits about as low in the pocket as it can get, which I really like it's almost invisible. The 585 sits up higher but should blend in better with your clothes.
- Lock: I am left-handed, so the Torrent is automatically disqualified for me. No lefty function, no carry. The Axis, of course, is superior. The scary thing is that if the Torrent came in a lefty version, I just might pick it over the Barrage and get better scales. If/when I get a 580, I may find someone to make some custom scales for it to thin it down.
585 vs. mini-Grip, mini-Ambush
I know that the mini-Barrage is not in the same league as the mini-Grip or mini-Ambush, but they are the knives I own that are similar in size, so I'll compare the 585 to them. The mini-Ambush is a very nice red-class knife, and since I have managed to get it away from my son for this review, I'm finding that the rolling lock is growing on me. It still isn't an Axis, though, and the 585 definitely shines in that regard. The steel in the 585 is definitely better than the AUS-8 of the mini-Ambush, and the belly sweeps more gently on the 585. The 10210 looks as if it's trying to be a rounded tanto style. The grip is made of the same material as the 10210, but is definitely beefier and fills the hand better than the mini-Ambush. Obviously, I would pick the 585.
The mini-Grip has the same blade steel as the mini-Barrage, so that is a wash. I am torn as to whether I like the modified sheepsfoot blade or the drop point spear of the 585 more, but blade shape is basically a user preference. I am a fan of the round hole over thumb studs, so the 555HG wins there, along with the thumb ridges on the spine. The mini-Barrage is considerably thicker than the mini-Grip. In fact, even my 710 is thinner! For a knife that is going to be a workhorse knife, the handle fills out my hand better than the mini-Grip. For carrying edc, however, I think I prefer the mini-Grip (and I used to think it was almost too fat). The 580/585 would really benefit from thinner scales before it became my edc, and clip screws that thread into the steel liners. I do like the feel of the Valox on the 585 over the Noryl of the 555HG.
890 Torrent vs. mini-AFCK and 710
My mini-AFCK is my absolute favorite knife, even though it is a liner lock. The ergonomics of the handle and blade is nearly perfect, imo, and the size is just right for a short guy like me with smallish hands. The belly has a nice sweep to it, but is not too curved, with a nice point. Mine is a left-handed mini-AFCK, since the power-that-be at BM did not deem it a worthy enough knife to offer with an Axis lock as they did the 806. To this day, I consider that a big mistake on BM's part, so please keep that bias in mind as I compare the 890 to my mini-AFCK and my 710.
The Torrent is slightly larger than the 812, with thicker scales and, it appears, thicker liners. The belly of the blade is more rounded and doesn't come to as sharp of a point, but the 800 and 812 were designed as a self-defense knife, where the 890 was not. The scales, as mentioned, are too smooth, but the pattern is nicer than the utilitarian look of the mini-AFCK's G10. They just need to have a rougher texture. The blade steel is comparable, as my 812 has ATS-34 steel. Blade size is comparable 3.6 vs. 3.25 and the blade geometry on both is very good. The mini-AFCK sits more comfortably in my pocket, largely due to being thinner, but the Torrent sits a lot lower, with only the clip being visible. Both are tip-down carry. As it is now, the mini-AFCK still stays my favorite. If the Torrent came in a lefty version, I would consider getting one.
Compared to the 710, the Torrent is smaller, but still thicker. The 710 is about maximum size for my hands, and the Torrent is definitely more comfortable and more attractive. The G-10 of the Torrent has a nicer pattern to it, but still needs to be rougher for better gripping. Steel is comparable in my 710, as it has the older ATS-34 blade instead of the newer D2 blades (that may change this summer). The belly is more rounded in the Torrent, and I prefer straight blades over recurved blades, like the 710. The thumb serrations on the 710 is a plus, and I really wish the folks at BM (or maybe Ken Steigerwalt) had included them on the Torrent. Of course the Axis lock is my preference over the liner lock, but if they made the Torrent in a lefty version, it would most likely replace my 710, smooth scales and all.
