Best Flexible saw?

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Jul 4, 2002
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I'm looking to include a saw in my BOB. I've decided that I like the design of the flexible ones. One, for their small carry, and two, for their large capacity.

So I would like to hear your guys opinion on the variety of flexible saws that you've have had any experience with.

Lunumbra
 
Their large capacity is highly overated as they are *slow* and you don't need to cut down 10" trees for shelter or firewood. Unless you have some kind of extreme packing senario (need to fit a saw in a altoids tin), then get a quality folding saw with a coarse japanese tooth pattern.

-Cliff
 
Cliff Stamp said:
Their large capacity is highly overated as they are *slow*

?!?

The Pocket Chainsaw certainly has shortcomings and limits -- requires two hands (not ideal for survival), inconvenient to roll apart (teeth can stick together), can't always wrap around wood or secure good leverage, overkill on anything less than 2" dia., not the cleanest cut -- but speed is not one of them. In fact, esp. in thicker wood wet or dry I can't see how any other human-powered saw comes close to its speed. (It also doesn't bind easily and is pretty tough.)

Perhaps I'm missing something, but in what sense is it slow?

As for Lunumbra's question: I don't have much experience with the Swedish style collapsible frame saws, bow saws and the like, but am also interested to hear responses.

Glen
 
It is slow meaning it takes much longer than the saws I mentioned, slow and fast are relative descriptors, they have no absolute defination. The lower efficiency is mainly due to method of use, as well as intrinsic aggression of teeth, plus considerations of body mechanics and application of force.

-Cliff
 
I have one of the folding chain saws. Once it gets going, it removes a lot of wood. BUT when I consider its greater weight and time it takes to find a proper piece of wood for a bow, I have ended up backpacking one of a couple of folding prunning saws. They will easily handle anything up to 6". I save the FCS for times when heavy trail mantenance is in the program - removing large downed trees - and bring along a perfect bow.
 
Cliff,
While I agree to some extent regarding the tooth layout. I disagree that the Pocket Chainsaw is slow due to the muscles used to operate it. If you were to build a shleter and had the toggles set up at the right length for your arms you would be rattling through timber because you are using your back, biceps and rear delts to apply pressure, as opposed to one hand with the little saw. Another thing to consider is the condition of the wood. If its still quite wet inside you als have to fight that and the posibility that the blade may bind (more work) or get bent when in use because of binding
 
Yes, you can bring more of your body into the pull, I should have clearified what I mean. The folding saws are more efficient because they don't require your shoulders or back. You can attempt to bring these into play by pushing down hard on the blade but the increase in performance usually isn't worth it (depends on who you are of course), as they are designed to run very light as the teeth are set at very acute angles and they cut very aggressive with little to no draw load. For example cut through a seasoned 2x6 in < 10 s, and this is with little force, ie. you can do this at pretty much any body position.

For example yesterday I spent an hour trimming some Alder bushes, the main sticks were 1-2 inches thick and the stalks up to 1" thick. With a #60 Felco, it was as simple as using one hand to move the other sticks out of the way and giving a couple of pulls on the saw and then flicking the stick over the shoulder with the free hand and then repeating the process.

As I had one free hand, and a saw with took up very little space it was trivial to work in a very heavy ingrowth situation, here a large bow saw would have been useless. The chain saw blades styles would have been much less efficient as the small wood was flexible and would have just bent under heavy pulls and the time it took to actually loop the saw under and around them would have had it cut already with the Japanese saw (which also cuts, plastics, ropes, fabrics, cardboard, etc.) .

Consider limbing, felling and bucking a small tree, 4-6" with both types of saws.

The bow saw excells at felling (once you make room), and bucking (but you have to have a way to make the log stable), and is crappy at limbing.

The japanese saw will keep up with the bow saw at felling, but will fall behind if you cut high on the tree and thus can bring your upper body into it. However at bucking, if you have to hold the log still, the japanese blade will easily keep pace, and requires less effort to use. At limbing there is no contest, trying to start a cut on a small diamter branch with a swede saw blade is difficult as it manuvering the saw around the branches.

The small chain saw blades require less space in that they are much thinner, but require *much* more force to drive than either of the above two patterns, you are also constrained to two hands unless you make a bow, and in this case you are now using a really inefficient bow saw. At limbing, better than a bow saw, but many times slower than the folding saw which just zips from branch to branch.

For any kind of survival / emergency situation you want a tool which needs the least from you to work, and thus one handed with light effort. I recently split my index finger on my left hand open from the first knuckle to the third (eight stitches), I could still easily use my folding saws, trying to use a two handed one would have been very difficult.

Consider shoulder, back or other hand injuries. For you to not be able to use a Japanese saw you would need to be so weak you could not lift a can of pepsi, but the others are more readily disabled.

They have their uses though, I like a bow saw for serious bucking (though I have not tried any of the large japanese pruners), and the small chain saw blades are very packable so you can even carry them in your pocket in a small tin.

-Cliff
 
Some good points Cliff.

In fact you would be in Hog Heaven here in Japan if you like their saw blades :)

Of course its the right tool for the right job and I admit that the folding saw would most likely be the best cutting tool in a situation where the target material was of small diameter or a possible injury.

One thing to remember about the effort for the chain saws though is that you get more teeth in action that with a straight blade, but I do agree that in a Survival situation then if you need the PCS then you are in a lot of trouble :D

However, you totally miss the point. This is the gadget and gear forum, who says you actually have to have a legitimate need for it? :D :D
 
I am all for gadgets, I have more knives, saws, axes than I could ever wear out. They all have strong points and experience is key to optimal use. Someone very experienced with a chain saw blade type tool would be much better off than trying to use a japanese blade if they were a novice with it (I cracked one off readily at first, and bent another). Whatever you decide on, get out and get familiar with it in as many situations as you can. DO you still for example have the ability to maintain control over the saw when its really hot and you are sweating heavily, how about when its so cold that you have to wear heavy mits or else you will get frostbite with almost immediate exposure.

-Cliff
 
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