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Best frame lock folder....opinions please??
- Thread starter Kelt
- Start date
- Joined
- Oct 9, 1998
- Messages
- 1,767
I know some people are going to burst in any second now and say Sebenza.
The only framelocks I have really used is the S&W ones (not very good), BM 750 Pinnacle, and the little CRKT ones (KISS and PECK).
Pinnacle is a very solid knife. I'm very sure it would be worth the money you'd pay for it. The KISS and PECK are a little different because they are so small and were designed to have different uses than most knives.
-Chang, Asian Janitorial Apparatus
The only framelocks I have really used is the S&W ones (not very good), BM 750 Pinnacle, and the little CRKT ones (KISS and PECK).
Pinnacle is a very solid knife. I'm very sure it would be worth the money you'd pay for it. The KISS and PECK are a little different because they are so small and were designed to have different uses than most knives.
-Chang, Asian Janitorial Apparatus
Prepare to be overwhelmed by the Sebenzanistas (sp?).
I don't have any experience with any. I have looked at gun shows for the CRKT S-2 but it seems to be very rare. I have seen Sebenzas. I don't care for the feel of the smaller ones but the large one is sweet. The problem is it is the price of a good revolver, and often too pretty to use much. (Enjoy them if you've got 'em!)
I don't have any experience with any. I have looked at gun shows for the CRKT S-2 but it seems to be very rare. I have seen Sebenzas. I don't care for the feel of the smaller ones but the large one is sweet. The problem is it is the price of a good revolver, and often too pretty to use much. (Enjoy them if you've got 'em!)
- Joined
- Oct 16, 1998
- Messages
- 2,395
The best one is the Darrel Ralph Apogee, in my humble opinion. It is bigger than the Sebenza, comes with 420V steel, is a little more ergonomic, and is a lot purttier. The Sebenza is an excellent knife, but I am not sure that I wouldn't go with the Benchmade Pinnacle for second best. I like the Pinnacles ergonomics and blade shape better, plus the price is a lot lower. The CRK&T S-2 is a good knife, such as it is, but I never liked the blade length to handle length ratio of that design. Also, I have been disappointed in CRK&T's ATS-34 heat treat in the past. But, hey, that's just me!
- Joined
- Mar 19, 2000
- Messages
- 238
Okay, As expected, you will be seeing this alot: SEBENZA which is my personal favorite right now. I own two, a large tanto and a small wood inlay.
Having said that...
I have never actually seen one of Darrell Ralphs Apogees in person, but I read and hear great things about them. The small Apogee is currently at the top of my wish list, and I hope to get one soon.
The Elishewitz Frame(mono) and Bolster locks are really nice. I have handled an Elishewitz Diablo, and am very impressed by it's quality and craftmanship. An Elishewitz Persian,or maybe a Djinn, is right up there on my wish list with the Apogee.
Joe
[This message has been edited by Joe Cop (edited 06-26-2000).]
I have never actually seen one of Darrell Ralphs Apogees in person, but I read and hear great things about them. The small Apogee is currently at the top of my wish list, and I hope to get one soon.
The Elishewitz Frame(mono) and Bolster locks are really nice. I have handled an Elishewitz Diablo, and am very impressed by it's quality and craftmanship. An Elishewitz Persian,or maybe a Djinn, is right up there on my wish list with the Apogee.
Joe
[This message has been edited by Joe Cop (edited 06-26-2000).]
- Joined
- May 9, 2000
- Messages
- 29,205
Depending on the price you want to pay the already mentioned Sebenza and apogee are both great. If you are looking for what looks to be a great knife for a very reasonable price check out the Darrell Ralph Paragee in the whats new section of makers/mfgrs. forum. You will have to go subjects from the last 10 days.
- Joined
- Aug 4, 1999
- Messages
- 2,596
Reese Weiland Wasp!!
Never saw one?? Email me and I will be glad to send you a picture! I'm working on my website right now so I can't go through all the BS to upload the pic or I would post it
By the way......I'm a hawkbill NUT and you said opinion!!
Neil
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Talonite, new pics, knives in stock!
blackwoodknives.com
Never saw one?? Email me and I will be glad to send you a picture! I'm working on my website right now so I can't go through all the BS to upload the pic or I would post it
By the way......I'm a hawkbill NUT and you said opinion!!
Neil
------------------
Talonite, new pics, knives in stock!
blackwoodknives.com
stjames
Sebenzanista
- Joined
- Oct 26, 1998
- Messages
- 6,465
I own the BM 750, three sizes of the Ralph Apogee, and Elishewitz Bolster and Mono lock knives. All fine pieces, with the customs bordering on art.
But the knife I reach for every time I have real work to do is the Sebenza.
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James Segura
San Francisco, CA
But the knife I reach for every time I have real work to do is the Sebenza.
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James Segura
San Francisco, CA
Sal Glesser
Moderator
- Joined
- Dec 27, 1998
- Messages
- 11,691
I believe that the "Frame Lock" is the name that Pat Crawford is using (and has been for years) referring to his "lock back" that has the lock & spring as part of the frame. AG Russell also used this name when making and selling Pat's design.
I think what you are referring to I have heard referenced as "Integral lock".
With that said, Chris has been making these types of locks for a long time. He has the intelligence to figure out what will work well, the skill & tenacity to make it work and the integrity to avoid compromise. Hard to beat...IMO.
Compare the interface between the spring and the tang on tghe different names you are interested in. Do not expect to get a $10 knife for $5...it doesn't happen! It only looks like it happens by people skilled in making things look that way. There is a reason that people like Chris and Darrel have to charge more.
We have not had an opportunity to break test the models mentioned, except for the Sebenza, whose lock tested extremely strong.
sal
I think what you are referring to I have heard referenced as "Integral lock".
With that said, Chris has been making these types of locks for a long time. He has the intelligence to figure out what will work well, the skill & tenacity to make it work and the integrity to avoid compromise. Hard to beat...IMO.
Compare the interface between the spring and the tang on tghe different names you are interested in. Do not expect to get a $10 knife for $5...it doesn't happen! It only looks like it happens by people skilled in making things look that way. There is a reason that people like Chris and Darrel have to charge more.
We have not had an opportunity to break test the models mentioned, except for the Sebenza, whose lock tested extremely strong.
sal
The "BEST" could be easily answered by "The one I own" people will be biased and mention the knife they own. I like the apogee but if it's possible for you to attend a good knife show and see them for yourself to make your decision you're likely to be happier.
They all look good in the pictures. You have to hold them and see which has the feel and quality that appeals to you. It's best to use the opinions posted here as a tip on which knives you should look at but you have to make the decision on the one that appeals the most to you which can be difficult without holding them.
They all look good in the pictures. You have to hold them and see which has the feel and quality that appeals to you. It's best to use the opinions posted here as a tip on which knives you should look at but you have to make the decision on the one that appeals the most to you which can be difficult without holding them.
- Joined
- Nov 25, 1999
- Messages
- 1,499
KELT34, CRKT S-2 is really hard to beat speaking about quality in relation to price! It is very well made knife which utilizes premium materials and very well-thought-out design. It comes in two sizes, with blade length 7,3 cm and 6,4 cm. This moment I'm playing with larger one and I'm going to share my impressions here a bit later. I'm grieving that they have discontinued even larger model with 9,2-cm long blade
Another knife utilizing the same premium materials and a very similar (basically the same) locking mechanism is BENCHMADE Pinnacle. It is pretty large utility/tactical knife with 9,2-cm long blade, very strong and comfortable to hold. It could be a close competitor for largest CRKT S-2 if they would continue its production.
You can't to go wrong with each of these knives.
As to much more expensive production knives like Sebenza or customs like Apogee. I have never had an opportunity to handle Sebenza, but I handled David Bloch's personal Apogee at IWA'2000 gun show in Nuremberg. Really nice piece and could be a pearl in each knife collection but for real world daily use is not as many times better than BM or CRKT knives as many times more expensive.
For daily use good production knife always is winner in competition "quality/price".
Just my opinion
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Sergiusz Mitin
gunwriter
Lodz, Poland
Another knife utilizing the same premium materials and a very similar (basically the same) locking mechanism is BENCHMADE Pinnacle. It is pretty large utility/tactical knife with 9,2-cm long blade, very strong and comfortable to hold. It could be a close competitor for largest CRKT S-2 if they would continue its production.
You can't to go wrong with each of these knives.
As to much more expensive production knives like Sebenza or customs like Apogee. I have never had an opportunity to handle Sebenza, but I handled David Bloch's personal Apogee at IWA'2000 gun show in Nuremberg. Really nice piece and could be a pearl in each knife collection but for real world daily use is not as many times better than BM or CRKT knives as many times more expensive.
For daily use good production knife always is winner in competition "quality/price".
Just my opinion
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Sergiusz Mitin
gunwriter
Lodz, Poland
Here's my opinion of the S2 vs the Pinnacle. I would have to go with the Pinnacle by a long shot. The S2 I handled felt all wrong in my hand. The lock bar was not rounded and it was uncomfortable when I put my thumb there to release the lock. The lock bar went all the way over to the right hitting the right liner. While there was only a little vertical play, this will surely increase as time goes on. The only thing the S2 has over the Pinnacle in my opinion is it looks better.
-Johnny
-Johnny
- Joined
- Nov 25, 1999
- Messages
- 1,499
Johnny, what edition S-2 do you have? I have the latest, here is mine directly from flatbed scanner.
Please note the teeth at the area where you should press to disengage lock. They make this edge securer to engage with the finger and at the same time more comfortable to work with. I haven't experienced any unpleasant effects playing with mine.
And here are the photos directly from CRKT photo CD for 2000.
Please note the lack of these teeth. Maybe these teeth are the newest improvement?
However I'm very pleasured with fit and finish of mine. I need some time to know it better, when I'll share my impressions here. So far I can tell that at this moment I found fit, finish and general execution quality very closely comparable with my Pinnacle. I can not claim certainly which is executed better.
As to design option comparison BM Pinnacle vs. CRKT S-2, I would be very curious to put them one against other, think it would be very interesting material for reviewing. But it would be justified only with older edition large S-2 with dimensions comparable with Pinnacle. But the newest edition with blade length 7,3 cm falls completely into another knife category, so the comparison is not justified.
As to look - I agree with you completely, S-2 looks prettier and more elegant.
Gentleman's knife?
Please note the teeth at the area where you should press to disengage lock. They make this edge securer to engage with the finger and at the same time more comfortable to work with. I haven't experienced any unpleasant effects playing with mine.
And here are the photos directly from CRKT photo CD for 2000.
Please note the lack of these teeth. Maybe these teeth are the newest improvement?
However I'm very pleasured with fit and finish of mine. I need some time to know it better, when I'll share my impressions here. So far I can tell that at this moment I found fit, finish and general execution quality very closely comparable with my Pinnacle. I can not claim certainly which is executed better.
As to design option comparison BM Pinnacle vs. CRKT S-2, I would be very curious to put them one against other, think it would be very interesting material for reviewing. But it would be justified only with older edition large S-2 with dimensions comparable with Pinnacle. But the newest edition with blade length 7,3 cm falls completely into another knife category, so the comparison is not justified.
As to look - I agree with you completely, S-2 looks prettier and more elegant.
Gentleman's knife?
Sergiusz, I do not own an S2, I merely handled one at a knife show. Looking at those pictures I can tell the handle has been rounded off more. The lock bar also looks like it has been rounded off some. Looks like I need to handle one of the more recent ones and redraw my conclusion.
-Johnny
-Johnny