best steel for an EDC folder

what do you think of the steel ats-34? i have heard from others that it might be too hard of a steel for an edc knife.
 
ATS-34 is an excellent steel. It's hard but tough. Can be hard to sharpen due to high wear resistance, but it's excellent.

On this forum you'll probably find most are particularly fond of "traditional" steels like the two mentioned so far i.e. Case CV and 1095. Those are my favorites too by the way, with CV edging out 1095 by a hair.

As stainless steels go, I really like 440C for the combination of corrosion resistance, toughness, edge holding, and sharpenability.
 
Cool thanks for replys, very helpfull. I have only recently gotten more involved in the hobby, and was trying to find if there was such a thing as a “best steel” for an all purpose knife. But I am starting to learn they all have their pros and cons and its all about preferance.

I recently got a sog folder called the x-ray vision and its blade it ats- 34. was wondering others opinions of it and other comprable steels for an all purpose blade.
 
There is nothing wrong with ATS-34 - I have a couple that have that. It's harder to sharpen than carbon CV or 1095, but I would expect it to hold an edge longer. If I were using a knife all day for work, say packing and shipping boxes, I would probably rather have ATS-34 or D2 or VG10 because they are apt to hold up longer under severe use. But since I usually just carry a knife for general light use, I like to have one I can touch up quickly so that it is always razor sharp. And a thin ground CV or 1095 blade will get VEEERRRRY sharp.

Plus I enjoy sharpening. I usually sharpen everyone's knives at the camp & so forth.
 
I have been carrying ATS-34 blades every day for a dozen years, and I really have a soft spot in my heart for the steel. Overall, though, blade shape, size and edge geometry have more influence on how I use a knife than the steel it is made of.
 
Here's what I've EDC'd so far:
VG-10
154CM/ATS-34
D2
INOX
420HC
1095
CV

If you already have a good edge on them, they are all easy to sharpen.
What's hard is when you want to reprofile them or sharpen them when
they are really dull. D2 is really difficult and 1095/CV and INOX are the easiest (of course those are the only one's I've re-profiled.)

Personally, I'm more concerned about blade and edge geometries
then blade steel alone since that determines how well a knife
will cut. The how long it will cut usually isn't as important
since all of the above will usually last long enough for most tasks.

If I had to choose only one I would choose VG-10.
It won't outlast D2 but it also has higher stain resistence and
the edge won't break down if wet. D2's edge will dull faster
if exposed to water while cutting. (say wet carpet)

That being said I'm EDCing a Vic Soldier (INOX) right now. :-)
Like I said before for me it's mainly about the geometries. As
long as you have a decent steel (any of the above) you should be fine for every day use.
 
I have 1095 and D2 blades. D2 suffered some extreme pit and 1095 some good rust due to failure to fully wipe things off or because in the summer I'm a sweathog. For a knife, I like to "set it and forget it" and IMHO there are too many good stainless steels to stick with straight carbon steels. I have some carbon for fun and because it's there :) but for all-around use, I prefer stainless. I have custom and production knives for EDC in ATS34, 154M and 440C. They all give good service and hold an edge as long as carbon steel. 440C seems a little more rust resistant and a little less hard than the other two. Performance for these steels varies from maker to maker as well as the hardness, but overall I've had no complaints.

I have production knives in VG10 and AUS8A. VG10 is as good as ATS34 etc. and seems to be as rust free as 440C. AUS8A is very rust resistant but doesn't hold an edge as well as the others. However AUS8A can take a lot of abuse without chipping and take some good prying. It is very easy to sharpen and repair when abused. My garden knife is a cold steel lockback in aus8a and it takes a beating (I dig with it and baton it through stakes with a brick) but it still sharpens up nice.
 
While I think the obsession with the latest and greatest hyped steel of the month can be overdone, I will admit stainless can be nice under some circumstances. Maybe.

I'm old enough to remember the days just after WW2 when there was alot of not so good stainless steel on the market. The junk stainless of those days set a barrier for the stainless to overcome, which they have. Under duress, or the influence of some strongly made toddies, I will admit to the carrying of a stainless knife, or two. When I was in the army, I carried a Buck 301 stockman, and it was a good knife. It must have been good, because I bought it in 1967 at a PX, and used it for the next 20 years. I have no recollection of it failing to cut anything. And one of the knives I carry on a regular basis these days is a little Buck Cadet, that belonged to a co-worker of mine in the 80's. His widow gave it to me after his funeral. I will admit it is a good knife, as I watched Andy dress a nice deer with that knife in the shadow of Mt. Rodgers Virginia. He did the deer without having to touch it up, so it was good enough for the job at hand.

I also own a Victorinox tinker that I carry. No matter what I carry in my right hand pants pocket that may vary daily, I will always have the sak and a small LED light like an ARCAAA, in a nylon belt pouch in back of my right hip for emergencys. I don't know what mystery Swiss steel the sak uses, but it also seems to get the job done, although I use the knife mostly for its tools. With the two sizes of flat screw drivers and phillips I've fixed things ranging from the ceiling fan in the upstairs bathroom, to the clutch cable mounting on my Vespa PX 150.

But I really do preffer a carbon steel, or lower end stainless steel if I have a choice. There's a trade off for everything in this world, and for longer edge holding, especially when it gets to obsession stage, it gets more difficult to sharpen. Its been my experiance that sooner or later your knife is going to loose its edge. Sometimes this happens at inoppertune moments with no warning. Like cutting through a cardboard box and hitting one of those copper staples you did not see. Or that small hard knot in a piece of wood on a very cold day.

I don't have a sharpmaker, or any of those other things. They don't fit in a wallet too well. I like to carry one of those little eze-lap pocket diamond things. The flat red plastic one about 6 inches long by 3/4 of an inch wide. On it is a little metal plate about an 2 inches long by 3/4 wide. I cut off the red plastic handle so it fits in my wallet. Its only about 1/8 inch think, so it fits nice and flat. I like to have a means to sharpen my knife with me.

I like a steel that is fast and easy to touch up if something happens. I don't want to take more than a couple of minutes to sharpen up my knife to a using edge. In 10 minutes I want to be able to fully sharpen and strop on the back of my belt to shaving sharpness again. With the high end stainless this is hard to do. Its the trade off factor rearing its head.

This is why I like simple carbon steels like 1095, Case CV, and whatever carbon Eye-Brand and Douk-Douk use.

I'm sure that ATS-34 and S30V make a very good knife, as does VG-10 and the rest of the wonder steels. But what am I giving up? What kind of edge brittleness am I going to find, especially at the higher RC ratings they are pushing to. ?

After almost 30 years as a machinist, working with metal every day you get a feel for some things. Some of what you learn by personal experience is not in the Machinists Handbook. On a gut level, I feel like while stainless can make a very good knife, it will not stand for long term use like a good carbon steel. Of course blade profile and grind has alot to do with it, which is why I like the traditional knife. But added to my feeling is the fact that almost all industrial tooling is carbon tool steel, in spite of the fact that sometimes a stainless tool would be very nice indeed. Like when we had to use a water based coolent stream on a job because of milspec's and procedures of production, and specs of the material being milled or otherwise machined.

I think for an edc pocket knife, a strait carbon steel knife is a better way to go, given that all else is equal. Things like blade grind and profile type. I've done alot of cutting tests over the years with hemp rope, cardboard, and newsprint as test mediums. In every case a carbon blade would win. Its an eye opening experiance to see a humble Opinel or Case CV sodbuster out cut knives costing many times more, especially when the knife that is outcut is one of the super stainless the knife magazines are saying is the best thing since flaked obsidian.

But I want to say this; many times the stainless knife was outcut not because of the steel, but the shape of the blade. When the knives were equal sharpness there was no difference. But when the knives started to loose that initial razer edge, the thick saber grind of knives like the Spyderco Delica's and the like, fell fast by the wayside with the blade binding up in the test medium, while the traditional thin blades like the sodbusters and Opinel kept cutting even though they too were getting a bit dull. It was'nt the steel, it was how they were shaped that let them down.

So in the end, I would'nt worry about the steel so much, as I would as to how the blade is shaped and profiled. A sak is a good cutting knife in spite of having a so-so mystery steel at only Rc 55, because of the shape. And I don't think that at a retail price of 8.95 an Opinel number 8 uses a high end steel. But its pretty funny when that 8.95 knife outcuts a 50 dollar knife of the latest wonder stainless because of design. Buying a knife, you should always keep in mind a knife is a cutting tool. Form should always follow function. In spite of what the knife magazines are hyping this month.
 
Rebuttal anyone? Not here. I learned a lot in a short period of time. Very informative post. Thanks!
 
Jacknife and a few others here have hit it on the head, at least from my way of looking at it. The edge and the blade geometries make a world of difference. After that, you decide if you want something that holds an edge for a reasonable amount of use and sharpens back up quickly, or a steel that can be a mother to sharpen back up, but lasts considerably more.

I've played with EDC "rotations." I still have a wooden cigar box with my carry knives in it. Along the way I've carried a couple of Case CV yellow handled knives, Soddie Jr., Barehead Slimline Trapper, and the lil Peanut. All carried and cut great, with the qualities usually associated with CV/1095 steel. Even here in the summer in the San Antonio, Texas area, they weren't much trouble rust wise. I didn't even take that good care of them. Just a wipe down and when every so often I'd wipe the blades down with some mineral oil. In thereI also had some stainless knives, D2 and a couple of Boker's in 1095 carbon steel. All worked well. I carried the Peanut a LOT for two reasons. It in your pocket like it wasn't there and it cut like cazy and all out of proportion to its tiny size.

However... And I've repeated this a few other threads lately dealing with related stuff. I pretty much only carry one of two slippies now as my real EDC knives. Both are recent (2006) Case. Both are trappers, one full, the other a mini. Both have stainless steel. Oh, and both came ripping sharp out of the box and continue to cut like crazy to the extreme with just a bare leather stropping (a few strokes only) and not all that frequently. The edges are just right on. Blade thickness and geometery are spot on. They are also attractive knives with excellent actions so are just a pure pleasure to pull out, open, cut with, and close. The mini carries well in slacks, the full size in jeans. I would have to set to work on my other knives from a variety of makers to get them to the same point these are. Not saying my other blades aren't sharp, pleasant, or attractive. They are. It just seems these two started life cutting crazy and have kept it up, while combining fit, finish, action, and looks that just give me great pleasure every time I use them and they carry nicely. The same knives in another batch or for someone else might not work as well.

The above experience has pretty much convinced me that for my general use when everything works and the knife is a pleasure to carry and to use, I don't really care what the steel is as long as it works like a cutlery steel is supposed to. I also have learned that there are so many other factors involved in a good EDC that blanket statements don't amount to much. Oh, and I have a utility type SAK tucked in a blazer pocket for occasional use. My SAKs have always performed quite well.

Certain steels have certain qualities, certainly. (forgive the word play <g>) If I did a lot of whittling, and I hope to somewhere down the road, I would probably opt for a knife pattern that fit my way of using it and go for a carbon steel, 1095 or CV. From the various whittlers on here these two seem to be favorite picks for that type of work. Where general, everyday cutting by the average guy doesn't show up much difference between carbon and stainless. For whittling, if these guys are to be believed, and they are more often than not ;), carbon steel seems hold and work better for such things. However, I have used my old Swiss Champ quite heavy when I was making some walking sticks and it worked well. I did have to hit it on a fine stone every do often.

To make this thing even windier... I recently picked up a smaller, fantastic fixed blade knife from Shadow Knives. It is 440C, hollow ground, and Eddie White grinds such an excellent edge on it that the thing whispers through things more than it cuts. While I haven't used mine nearly as heavy as SunnyD has, I'll take his word that it holds up pretty darn good. The point? Once again, decent steel, properly heat treated, and shaped/edged well makes a real cutting tool.

However, another recent aquisition, a Marble's Fieldcraft (modern, not vintage) in 1095 Carbon Steel stands out as my first choice for a camp and wood running knife. It isn't that I have any doubts about the SK knife. I don't at all! However, the Marbles has the blade style and thickness that makes it a first class choice to use in the manner of it's name, fieldcraft. The convex edge on it is perhaps a better choice for heavier use along with the thickeness. Yet it is still light on the hip. Sharpening in the field should be simple and quick. While I've yet to give a good field trial, edge holding too should be great. Plus, with a carbon steel blade you can use it with the variations of flint and obsidian to make a fire.

While stainless knives will create spark from a firesteel, as the firesteel is providing the matieral for the spark, with flint, it is the tiny particals of carbon steel that are the spark in flint and steel firemaking. Once again, back to what ya gonna do with that knife.

If you can, pick up a couple of decent knives in a few steels then carry and compare. Maybe pick up a Case Sodbuster Jr, or a Peanut in CV and one in SS and take turns using them to see how they compare for your uses. You may find that it doesn't matter much, or may find that for your situation, one works better for you than the other. That's part of the fun of it all by the way. Playing around. :D
 
I too, think the SAK's a re a good example of blade geometry cutting well regardless of what the steel is. I have a couple of Saks that are 20+ years old now, and work just fine.

They do not see as much time in my pocket, however... for a personal reason. I like the character and patina that a regularly used carbon blade takes on. It starts to show that it's been a real companion, and when I reach in the box to stick a knife in my pocket, I hardly ever grab the shiniest one.
 
Per "I'm sure that ATS-34 and S30V make a very good knife, as does VG-10 and the rest of the wonder steels. But what am I giving up? What kind of edge brittleness am I going to find, especially at the higher RC ratings they are pushing to. ?"

I don't have an S30V, but for the stainless I recommended, ATS34, 154CM, and 440C in both custom and production knives, I have had no chipping. Some blades are harder than others, but all are readily sharpened with stones, ceramic and diamond. I have one ATS34 custom that's a little on the soft side and it sharpens and holds an edge just like 1095...but it's stainless. I have a benchmade ATS34 that keeps an edge like the devil keeps his handmaiden and rarely needs a touchup. I have had chipping in dendritic 440C and CPM440Vk, that's why I did not recommended them. I've also chipped carbon steel due to either thin edge or concrete :)

I totally agree on edge geometry being important. The best steel cannot overcome poor design. That's why sharpened pry bars are just that. However too thin an edge will chip in both carbon and stainless.

Can carbon steel be taken to a thiner edge than stainless? Maybe, but stainless can give the thinnest edge you'll need. My thinest edged knife is a 440C folder flat ground by a master smith. It doesn't chip and is easily touched up, per maker's intructions, by stropping

One thing in favor of stainless is looks. If you like your shiny knives shiny, if you really appreciate a hand rubbed mirror finish (which cost you at least $30 on a custom), then you don't want carbon steel. I have one ebony and 1095 Queen that I've kept the mirror polish intact even though used as an EDC. I happily polish it with Flitz every day.
 
It's true about the cutting abilities of the Opinel using quite lowly CS out performing knives many times more expensive.Same can be said about the Case(or Böker or Kissing Cranes) sodbuster ,another simple but very effective yet timeless knife.

Mind you, I don't find Case SS as bad as many suggest,for snack preparation SS is much more practical than CS or suchlike. How about Damascus on an EDC then?
 
Damn, some excellent posts for a relative-newbie such as myself.

Especially the part about blade geometry...this really struck me, because I recently did some informal testing on cardboard, and found that the aforementioned "saber grind" rapidly became more difficult to cut.

(FYI I tried the Dozier Thumbhole folder, Soldier, Byrd Meadowlark and Case Sodbuster SS. They fared in that order, but the Vic was very close to the Dozier in capability.)

Conversely, the Vic Soldier, though rapidly dulling, gradually diminished in ability.
I thought it had something to do with blade thickness/geometry...but wasn't sure.
The surprise in my "test" was a Case Sodbuster Junior SS.
I have no idea why, but it was dead last in cutting cardboard. It could have been the size (kinda small to get leverage), blade shape or geometry...or the steel. I sharpened it on the Sharpmaker, but it was very difficult to get through thick cardboard.
I know...cardboard...I usually use a utility razor, but cutting cardboard seems to be a pretty good torture test.

Oops...I'm rambling...

Thanks for the excellent info! I can't wait to get a Queen D2, or a Case CV...or even a little Opinel.
Hmm...that Queen is PRETTY!
Heck, I am going to order an Opinel and a Mora right now!

Bob
 
wow thanks all for the great responses. as i mentioned above i only recently became more involved in the hobby, and new to the forums too. really appreciate all the help. seems like a good helpfull bunch ya'all got here.
 
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