Better steel for SOG Bowie's ?

K

kwackster

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Dec 23, 2005
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I posted this also on the SOG forum, but not much response, so i will try again here:
When is SOG going to implement the higher quality steels into their knives ?
To be precise; the SOG 1 Bowie which steel is SK-5 now, shouldn't this be CPM3V ?
And the Trident 2, now made in AUS 8, maybe use ZDP189, or at least S30V ?
Why keep sending out those wonderfull blades with middle- or even lower class steels ?
Ofcourse i understand the increased pricelevels, but i think that for these specific top models people would be willing to pay a premium.
The name and the design are already there, so what about it ?:confuse
I think it would be better to follow the same road as Spyderco and even Benchmade, especially the first one is always on top with using the best steels available.
 
It's a Bowie.. Not a fillet or letter opener.
What's the problem with that steel ?
 
Isn´t SK-5 the japanese declaration of american A2?

How do you think A2 is middle class?

I guess SK-5 is the original steel and hope SOG will not start hypesurfing.
 
I'd love SOG to use more SK-5. I do wish they would upgrade from AUS-6 to at least AUS-8. Having them go with ATS-34 or 154CM would be even better.
 
This subject has been brought up with SOG and Spencer Frazer and, unhappily, there was no interest in upgrading steels. I agree that they should be using better steels for the price point they are at. I would like to see fewer serrated edges as well. Just my $0.02.
 
I was always under the assumption that AUS8 is the Japanese equivalent to 440C which is a good, if not great, steel.
 
SK5 is a low alloy carbon steel, not A2, closer to W1 or O1 :

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1369009&postcount=4

It is a fine steel for a large working knife, though on paper 3V looks much better. ZDP189 would be a poor choice for a large heavy use blade, I would not want S30V there either, however the tactical community in general promotes it strongly as an upgrade.

I think in general you can argue that lower alloy steels are better choices for large blades which move away from pure cutting tools and into utility applications, but you should also then see a reduction in price because the base materials are much cheaper and it the heat treatment is less demanding and they are much easier to grind and finish.

-Cliff
 
I'd just like to see them go back to making the Tigershark in SK-5, it's now gone to AUS-6. In SK-5 it was a nice piece at a decent price point.

That said, IF stainless-ness is important to you, AUS-6 is not horrible for a beat-it-up big field knife - edge holding is only barely acceptable, but it is one of the tougher stainless steels, in terms of prying or snapping.
 
The steel SOG uses is okay, the point I was making is that at the price point they're at, they should be made from better materials. Stainless-440C is better than AUS.6 or 8. Carbon- 1095. It's cheap, available, sturdy, been around for 150 years, easy to work with.
 
kwackster said:
And the Trident 2, now made in AUS 8, maybe use ZDP189, or at least S30V ?
Click to expand...

That's like saying the military should replace their Humvees with Ferraris because Ferraris are just so much faster...

Why would they want to downgrade an 11" OAL fixed blade from a tough steel like AUS-8 to a much brittler one like ZDP-189?
 
We don't know yet if ZDP is going to be that brittle, but if it does SOG could still take S30V over AUS8.
If Chris Reeve is using it for his Green Beret, than it certainly is good enough for SOG.;)
 
kwackster said:
We don't know yet if ZDP is going to be that brittle, but if it does SOG could still take S30V over AUS8.
If Chris Reeve is using it for his Green Beret, than it certainly is good enough for SOG.;)
Click to expand...

the difference in toughness between aus8 and s30v is probably not worth the extra cost between them.

if ZDP is still an unknown in toughness then why use it?
 
Could it be that at the thickness the SOG 2 Bowie comes in, 6 mm, thoughness shouldn't be a problem ?
 
Although thickness helps in making a knife stronger, toughness is more a measurement of how the steel reacts to impacts. Blade geometry will have a hand in this as well, but ultimately if the steel has a low toughness rating there is only so much you can do to make it better. Good heat treat and geometry help any steel out. I would rather have a 440A knife HT'd by Paul bos than a S30V made in Taiwan or China.

Having said that, a lot of Sogs stuff is now made in Taiwan and hopefully the mfg process is up to par. Their old stuff was made in Seki Japan which is known for being very good. A good example is their old Trident Fixed blades. The old ones were 0.27 inch thick and made in Seki Japan. The new ones are 0.21 inch thick and made in Taiwan. There is a $100 retail difference in them as well, but I would rather have the old one. Steel is reportedly the same, but that means nothing as HT is everything.
 
I have the Trident II in AUS8 from Taiwan, as well as the SOG Bowie in SK-5 from Seki City.
On the Trident II, although it's not from Seki anymore, you can still find the Navy Seal logo.
Did that group really use this knife with the AUS8 steel ?
I also see a big diffence in geometry between the Bowie from Seki City and the Trident from Taiwan in that the Bowie is much thicker overall than the Trident.
Could this be another way to cut corners with the knives from Taiwan ?
 
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