Blade geometry, wondering about cutting ability between ESEE and Fallkniven

T

texasrimfirenut

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Oct 13, 2013
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Guys I am trying to understand something. I love my ESEEs and would not give them up but I noticed when I was cutting on a piece of wood the ESEE was cutting great but then picked up the Fallkniven F1 and started using it. It just seemed to flow better through the wood, seemingly cutting easier and more productively.

Both knives were very shaving sharp so why the difference?

Is it because of the knives, the steel being used or is it because of the convex edge on the fallkniven?

If its the convex edge will convexing my ESEEs make them cut like the fallkniven?

In reverse if I was to just simply start sharpening my Fallkniven on my spyderco sharpmaker and loose the convex grind, will it still cut as smooth as it did with the convex grind?

Thanks for helping me understand the differences. I like my ESEE 3 better than the fallkniven f1 but can tell a distinct difference between the two in cutting, like when shaving a pieces off of a stick.
 
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Ok so it will cut just as well if i sharpen it up on my spyderco and loose the convex grind then.

Could just be me but I also think the F1 cuts better than my A1. Could that be?
 
Given that You will be able to put on the same convex edge on both the Fällkniven and the ESEE, they will both cut very well but the Fällkniven will hold the edge longer!
This is due to the better alloy and the harder HRC.
To my knowledge ESEE is around HRC 57 and Fällkniven VG-10 is HRC 59.

When the Cross-Sectional edgegeometry is right for the material You cut, the cutting resistance will decrease compared to a more " rough" geometry.

A convex edge like the one You have on Your F1 is handmade and varies from one F1 to another.
Sometimes they are towards the thinner end, or they come with a very thick edge that needs to be thinned.

I set my edges by freehand, using a stone or a beltsander.
I never measure the angle of the edge.
If the knife cuts well with low resistance and with good edge holding, I'm satisfied.
If the knife doesn't perform, I keep on setting the geometry until the knife cuts as I want it to do.

I think You will increase the performance of Your ESEE by working on the geometry, but for cutting wood it will never outcut the F1! :cool:
This is of course because of the more alloyed steel in the F1.


Regards
Mikael
 
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Don't quote me on this but I believe I read somewhere that Fallkniven use a convex edge because in their trials it works better at cutting through wood. I have to say though I love both Esee and Fallkniven and I hope in the future to have a good collection of both :D
 
Given equal sharpness, I suspect the biggest difference is the bar steel thickness and perhaps the resistance caused by the coating on the ESEE's. Convex edges seem to cut better, but for me are harder to sharpen free hand.
 
texasrimfirenut said:
Ok so it will cut just as well if i sharpen it up on my spyderco and loose the convex grind then.
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I think so, IF you can maintain a vee grind edge as well as a convex grind edge. Which I cant.

I'll tell you what I'd do with that Fallkniven. Every once in a while, hit it with the Sharpmaker for a few stokes. Its gonna keep it nice and sharp, and that you are doing "semi-freehand" sharpening with that Sharpmaker, the angle you use will vary slightly each time.

That is going to create a series of microbevels, i.e., a very-close-to-convex edge.

You know, if you look at the sharpening tool Fallkniven offers, what is it? A flat stone, just like your sharpmaker rods.
 
Maybe its just me but my ESEE 3 would out cut my old F1. Then again my 3 has a stripped blade, the ESEE powder coat is pretty thick and does cause drag when cutting wood.
 
PatrickKnight said:
Maybe its just me but my ESEE 3 would out cut my old F1. Then again my 3 has a stripped blade, the ESEE powder coat is pretty thick and does cause drag when cutting wood.
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That could be it. When I refer to the F1 cutting smoother that is in no way faulting the ESEE 3. My ESEE 3 is my favorite knife. Just couldnt help but notice how that f1 was moving through that wood.
 
texasrimfirenut said:
Thats a very good point and I have the dc4
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Well there you go! Put the DC4 to it! I like touching up my convex blades with the white rods on the Sharpmaker. Works very nice and its easy. Maybe 5 light strokes per side after use.

The DC4 handheld is going to create even more angle variation/convexing than the Sharpmaker. Its perfect!
 
IME flat ground edges tend to dig more when doing things like feathersticks where a slight convex just tends to glide down the side. So maybe you just prefer convex. They both work but they both feel different. If so, all you need to do is to sharpen your 3 on a wooden backed strop with sand paper on top. It'll give it just enough convexing to give you that glide. This is how I sharpen all of my knives. Also, the higher the polish, the less "gritty" the knife feels as it's moving through wood. If you look at a new knife from just about any manufacturer you can clearly see the grind marks as they only sharpen to 100-300 grit. If you polish that edge up to 2000+ those ridges become smaller and it gives the knife less of a bumpy ride. I had a 3 and didn't notice it lacking in any way so maybe yours just needs a tune up.
 
I think you're feeling the difference of a better knife, pure and simple. You sure your 3 is still your favorite? :)
 
Some knives just work better as cutting tools that others...

EDIT:
I was thinking this over and wanted to point out that the F1 has a full convex blade, not just the edge. This may contribute to the "flow" you are feeling.
A full convex blade will steer through material with more control and have a different feel than a flat, even if that flat has a convex edge.

You could thin and convex the edge of your ESEE to improve performance but it may never match the smooth feel of the F1.
 
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I have both and love and use them both. My son and nephew and myself took a 600 mile bicycle tour through the UP of Michigan. We carried everything we needed with us on our bikes I used both knives for fire making food prep and shelter building and the Falkniven won hands down every time when it came to using it on wood. But I'm not sure why I have other convex edged knives and they don't cut wood as well as my Falkniven???
 
Do your other convex edged knives have full convex blades?
 
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said it before and I'll say it again. there's something about the fallkniven f1 that is just outstanding! I've carried mine for a long while and its one of my absolute favorite knives for the bush. small, sharp and well thought out.
 
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