Blade steel Ranking?

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SuzukiGS750EZ

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Dec 30, 2008
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Ok, so here are the knives I keep out at all times. Benchmade Griptilian 551S(154CM), Victorinox Centurion & Swisstool (Don't know the steel), Buck 110 (440HC) and Kershaw Blur (Sandvik 13C26). Can you put these steels in order from best steel to worst. What i consider (best) is edge retention. I'm trying to figure out which to use for what situation:confused:. I know a lot about knives but little about blade steel composition. I know 154cm is way up there so i'm not totally numb to it. Thanks in advance!:thumbup:
 
Wow. This should spark some debate. The best steel for one situation isn't going to be the best for another.

154cm is a pretty good general purpose steel, takes a good edge with relative ease, holds it fairly well and is moderately tough.

The steel that Victorinox uses is best for slicing. Food, cutting something out of the news paper, string. Takes a great edge, doesn't hold it very long but sharpens up extremely easily.

The same can be said about Buck's 420HC, except it's about as tough as you can get. Takes a wicked edge, holds it fairly well (not like the super steels) and sharpens easily.

I don't know much about the Sandvik steels, so I won't comment there.
 
uh oh... i see a debate in the future.
well in my opinion/experience i like 154cm, then 13c26, then victorinox steel (i dunno what it is either). ive never owned a buck so i wont comment.
 
I tried to not make it debatable by specifying edge retention. I figured there was no debate there... maybe I was wrong?
 
Asking which is the best steel, is like asking which is the best color. It is completely application dependent and subjective from a personal standpoint. All steel has it's good points and bad. Personally, I like SG2, BG-42, S90V and ZDP-189. Do I think that other steel is junk? Not at all. Some of the carbon steels make fantastic fixed blades and some of the softer (and tougher) stainless such as 420HC has been used in many folders.

Do some research and check out some articles and you can join the rest of us in the search for the mythical 'perfect' steel. ;)
 
"I want to ay something.. If you like it you can take it, if you don't.. throw it right back"

1. 154CM
2. 420HC
3. whatever is in Vic. SAKs
4. Sandvik (just because I've never used it)

the SAK steel and Bucks 420HC are very very very very close in edge retention imo.

FIGHT!
 
154cm
13c26
Vic Inox
420HC
but that is just based on use and the objective data given for each steel.
 
SuzukiGS750EZ said:
I tried to not make it debatable by specifying edge retention. I figured there was no debate there... maybe I was wrong?
Click to expand...

And by edge retention you mean...what? Wear resistance? If so it's:
154CM
13C26
BUCK and SAK

If you by edge retention also mean edge stability which is resistance to chipping, tear-outs and rolling I would never put 154CM first.

What you cut and how also make a huge difference. Cutting cardboard boxes would favor wear resistance (154CM) and cutting wood would favor edge stability like 13C26.

Also hardness plays a major part. 13C26 works well up to 62. SAK and 420HC would never reach that and 154CM at 62 would be brittle.
 
Relative wear resistance:
154CM
SAK
13C26
420HC

My preference based on sharpness and toughness:
13C26
420HC
SAK
154CM
 
sandvik is surgical steel so therefore adequate but nothing expensive or superior, its about the same as a vic stainless. good rust resistance and decent toughness.

420hc holds about the same edge but it holds a better edge on a buck because of their good heat treat. its really tough steel but still fairly low edge retention

154cm is even tougher, holds a much better edge, and is almost as rust resistant. it is more brittle, however
 
So what does all of this mean as far as heat treat and stuff? Edge Retention to me is how well a blade can hold an edge through use. So the tougher the steel the more brittle is it?
 
154CM is one of the best knife steels available and the newer version , CPM 154 is even better. Performs very well for many uses .CPM 154 has become a favorite of many custom makers.
 
Sanvik 13C26 has been shown to be more wear resistant than VG-10. It is an awesome steel.

I now have two blades in 154CM, but have not used them as much as my sanvik knives. 154 probably has a slight edge in toughness+corrosion resistance compared with 13C26, but I bet they wear around the same for my uses.
 
First I'll qualify my statements that will follow with the fact that "I am no expert". That being said, I base my comments on my personal experience in edge retention and what I've learned over the years.

13C26 is equivalent to AUS8 from what I've read which is a step down from 154CM. My 14C28N Kershaws are supposed to be a slight improvement on 13C26 and it appears to be so. They are all good all around steels and corrosion resistant. My 154CM Mini-Grip seems to hold an edge a bit better, my 14C28N Kershaw OD-1, Zing, Barrage and AUS 8 SOG Twitch II are a bit easier to sharpen, 154Cm takes a few more strokes on my diamond hones and 14C28N takes about the same as AUS 8, all take really nice edges. The addition of nitrogen in 14C28N is meant to increase corrosion resistance.

I don't have Buck's 420HC so I can't comment there. But I do have a Kershaw Scallion in 420HC and I's say it is a step down or maybe a 1/2 step from 13C26.

My SAKs are decent steels but seem to dull relatively quick but is easy to sharpen with a decent edge. My SwissTool seems to hold an edge better for some reason. Could be my imagination :p . But I'd put my SAKs below 13C26 and 154CM.
 
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SuzukiGS750EZ said:
So what does all of this mean as far as heat treat and stuff? Edge Retention to me is how well a blade can hold an edge through use. So the tougher the steel the more brittle is it?
Click to expand...

What is your use? For most people it's cardboard, paper, plastic, in which case the most wear resistant steel would be best. If you do lots of stuff that would destroy the edge (scraping, digging, cutting open bags of cement etc...) then no steel will hold it's edge and you may as well be using a disposable blade.

Edge retention is a combination of wear resistance, fracture resistance, and resistance to plastic deformation (hardness). In some environments corrosion resistance is a factor, but not where I live:).
For chopping knives that may hit rocks or other hard things occasionally, fracture resistance is most important. For knives that cut hard, but non abrasive material (wood), resistance to deformation is best (high hardness). For knives that cut abrasive material (cardboard) you want wear resistance.
The balance between hardness and fracture resistance is most readily apparent. Take two blades, one harder one softer, and the softer one will be less likely to chip.
Wear resistance is a little more complicated. Hardness does affect wear resistance, but alloy usually plays the bigger role. If you take a low alloy steel, 420HC, and compare it with something like S30V, even at the same hardness S30V will be much more wear resistant.
To achieve high wear resistance you do have to give up some fracture reistance (420HC is much more resistant than S30V), though the new CPM steel types buck the trend a little. S30V is an extra high alloy steel, though it maintains similar fracture resistance to 154CM through the use of particle metallurgy.

It must be understood that there is an almost infinite number of variations out there, each one made for a specific purpose. Often times the rules can be "bent" a little in one way or another to suit your needs. The important thing is to find the steel type that matches your intended use.
Terms like "toughness" and "edge retention" are very loose. Both are a combination of all the attributes of the blade, combined with the attributes of the material being cut, and the methods being used to cut it. Don't underestimate the effects of edge geometry either.
 
Joshua J. has pretty well nailed it. There's been too much focus on steel composition vs steel treatment. I don't know of any knife steel that will give the longest lasting edge for all uses - which is why there are so many. While the type of steel used sets the paramaters, how it is handled and heat treated will determine the final properties. e.g. Diamond Blade Knives will reputedly skin more deer between sharpenings than just about any other steel knife but is a poor performer on hard plastic because the carbides are so fine.
 
Here's my take on what I've experienced and read....

------------------UNACCEPTABLE
420J2
420
AUS4
------------------ACCEPTABLE
AUS6
440A
------------------DECENT
440A (COLD STEEL)
420HC (BUCK)
13Cr26
AUS8, 440B
------------------VERY GOOD
440C, VG-1
------------------EXCELLENT
ATS-34/154CM
------------------STELLAR
VG-10
S30V
 
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