Bread knife design

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Skiller1nc

Joined
Jun 27, 2016
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I've read through all the bread knife forums, I've listened to the knife talk podcast discussions, I've watched countless YouTube videos.

I still can't make up my mind. Have we as a community decided what the best way to make a bread knife is?

Is it drilling holes and then grinding half the circle away and then grinding a single bevel? A double bevel?

Grinding a single or double bevel then using a file taped to a rod to file scallops into the edge?

Just making a regular knife and sharpening at like 80 grit to get a toothy edge?

Something else?

I'm about to make a few Damascus offset bread knives and I want to get it correct from the start, any advice or experience would he greatly appreciate. I am also curious about hardness. Being slicing knives I assume I can run the a point or 2 higher, say 63-64 Rockwell for something like aebl or z-wear and maybe 61-62 for 1080/15n20 damascus.
 
I have a delightful Robinson Artifex bread knife (chefknivestogo.com) that has pretty large scallops that their large ceramic rod fits close. I don't know if it was intentional or coincidental but it works out perfectly. Modeling scallops to available sharpening tools like ceramic rods or slips may well be a valid design paramter.

Just a thought as you proceed. Good luck with 'em.
 
One of the first knives I made back in 2005 was a (tactical) bread knife.
I made a complex pattern of serrations that has small scallops bracketing a larger one, but then each recurrence of those scallops is separated by two square teeth.
It cuts bread extremely well with little pressure and I prefer it to simple patterns of equally sized scallops.
It is pretty tedious to index and file all the serrations, but it has lasted more than 15 years so I claim it was worth it.
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thats simple/easy ... put o rings on your contact wheel ... like 1 big -2 small-1 big
make the pattern so you can feel the first grove and slowly push into it ..
 
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Pinoy Knife said:
thats simple/easy ... put o rings on your contact wheel ... like 1 big -2 small-1 big
make the pattern so you can feel the first grove and slowly push into it ..
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So.....have you done this?🤔
 
Skiller1nc said:
Even something more long term like making a shaped wheel on the lathe. Genius if it works
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I'm sure this would. Just a bit of playing around to figure out the right mechanics/dimensions, flexible enough belt, etc....
 
The Ultimate bread knife, is the thinnest sharpest nice long knife, doesn't need serrations. I've seen some lovely antique victorian era bread knives, none of them had serrated edges, they were all just like really long narrow butchers knives but extra thin behind the edge, zero ground with no secondary bevel (Except what post production "service sharpening" the old owners gave them)
You don't see them made like that anymore, I wonder if modern chefs and cooks would even want one now.
 
weo said:
Unfortunately, I don't think this is true and universal. It's my understanding (and experience) that the serrations are very important when cutting certain breads that are freshly baked, when you have a hard, dry crust surrounding a soft interior.
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How did people in pre victorian era slice their crusty bread then?
I have no trouble slicing bread with plain edge knives I sharpen myself.
 
Londinium Armoury said:
I have no trouble slicing bread with plain edge knives I sharpen myself.
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I'm not being argumentative, but I do wonder if this is true with a loaf of bread with a hard crust right out of the oven? Every baker I've ever talked to about this has responded that you need some sort of serrations/scalloping to cut freshly baked bread without crushing it, and I've had this conversation with more than a few of them.
 
weo said:
I'm not being argumentative, but I do wonder if this is true with a loaf of bread with a hard crust right out of the oven? Every baker I've ever talked to about this has responded that you need some sort of serrations/scalloping to cut freshly baked bread without crushing it, and I've had this conversation with more than a few of them.
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I think maybe bakers are not the most experienced fine edge sharpeners. If I remember correctly the evolution of the bread knife happened in multiple places in multiple continents with overlaps in technology and development inspiration and leaking from neighbouring states. Serrations are a more later adaption, in the western part of Europe bread knives evolved from plain edge zero serrations, then a flamberge wavy edge emerged, and fromt hen the wavy edge got smaller until serrations as we know them today started to come around 100-200 years ago.
It is 100% possible to cut freshly baked bread with a non serrated knife. type "Antique bread knife" into google images and see the dates and periods and look at the edge style, wavy straight and serrated. The ones with the very small serrations are more modern in the past 200 years, most western European antique bread knives found in England do not have the modern serrated edges.
 
just got home
yes it works well .. the best thing is you can move the spacing of the serrations around .. yes a flex belt is required
 
Londinium Armoury said:
I think maybe bakers are not the most experienced fine edge sharpeners. If I remember correctly the evolution of the bread knife happened in multiple places in multiple continents with overlaps in technology and development inspiration and leaking from neighbouring states. Serrations are a more later adaption, in the western part of Europe bread knives evolved from plain edge zero serrations, then a flamberge wavy edge emerged, and fromt hen the wavy edge got smaller until serrations as we know them today started to come around 100-200 years ago.
It is 100% possible to cut freshly baked bread with a non serrated knife. type "Antique bread knife" into google images and see the dates and periods and look at the edge style, wavy straight and serrated. The ones with the very small serrations are more modern in the past 200 years, most western European antique bread knives found in England do not have the modern serrated edges.
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you said it
 
Londinium Armoury said:
I think maybe bakers are not the most experienced fine edge sharpeners
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Fair enough and thanks for the detailed reply. :thumbsup:
I wonder if the style/type of loaf matters, though, One of my favorite breads, when fresh and warm out of the oven, has a thick, crunchy crust, and any pressure downward when cutting, will crush the soft interior. Thus the serrations for a sawing motion so as not to need any more pressure towards the cutting board than the weight of the blade... 🤔
 
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weo said:
Fair enough and thanks for the detailed reply. :thumbsup:
I wonder if the style/type of loaf matters, though, One of my favorite breads, when fresh and warm out of the oven, has a thick, crunchy crust, and any pressure downward when cutting, will crush the soft interior. Thus the serrations for a sawing motion so as not to need any more pressure towards the cutting board than the weight of the blade... 🤔
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I’m with L Londinium Armoury on this one. I’ll take a thin sharp knife snd it works perfectly on pain siegle which I love here in France.

I would venture to say serrations are for end users who don’t sharpen their knives

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