Broken tap and not on a shoe

B

BRTOKC

Joined
Sep 18, 2000
Messages
12
Hello everyone, I have a problem that I hope someone can give me some ideas about. I was tapping a pommel (brass) and as I was backing the tap out there was a ping, and the tap broke. It broke unfortunately right at the base of the pommel, nothing to grab on to. Does anyone have any ideas about getting that sucker out?????? Believe me there were some choice words flying around the shop. No pommel flying though. Any help is greatly appreciated as always.
B. Tomberlin
 
Melt it down, that'll get it right out!
wink.gif


Seriously though, somtimes you can super-glue a piece of stock to it well enough to turn it out, but that usually doesn't work on big taps.

About the only thing I know to do is take a dremel and work a little ring around it that you can grap onto with needle-nose vice-grips.

Nick
 
Try taking a dremel with a small diamond tipped cutting wheel, scribing a line into the center of the tap and turn out the tap with a screwdriver.

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C.O.'s-"It takes balls to work behind the walls "
 
If you've got a lot of time or money tied up in the pommel, I'd recommend taking it to a machine shop that has an ELOX or EDM machine. They could burn it out with no damage to the part. A variation on the diamond tipped Dremel bit would be to cut the slot with a Dremel cut off wheel. If it's a through hole, clamping the part securely in a drill press and lowering a slow turning piece of mild steel against the broken end of the tap may spin it out the other side. Just make sure the piece of steel is smaller than the tap drill size.
 
If you are carefull, a lot of times you can stick a flat head screwdriver between the flutes and back it out. I use carbon steel taps if I think I may break one, then you can break them up with a center punch.
 
I feel your pain. Sometimes this works, depending on the size of the tap and the pommel. With a very small tip on the oxy-cetylene rig, heat the tap to just under melting and quench in icey salt water. With a small pin punch you can shatter the tap. Most times the threads will stay in good shape. The over heat and quench ruins the grain structure on the tap. Not quite two cents worth, hope it helps.
 
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by m l williams:
I feel your pain./</font>
Click to expand...


Yep....I've done this too, but the last time it was in a blade for a folder. I was trying to tap a hole for a thumb disc and the tap snapped off in the blade, had to finally grind it flush and put an odd shaped disc on, using a hole tapped next to the first one...

....I guess I'm trying to say, you might have to hide it. Not the best solution, but if you can't get it out like suggested in previous posts...what else can you do (other than starting over)

 
I have broken taps in titanium a few times. I drop the ti in ferric cloride and it desolves the hi-speed steel with no damage to the ti. I think it will discolor the brass but only on the surface and will sand out very easily. Try a test piece first but I dont think it will ruin the brass. My thoughts on the matter, Bruce
 
do what bruce said....if its a big tap it will take a day or two.......radio shack carries it as archer etchant solution.
 
NO!! do NOT use ferric cloride on brass!!!!

It will eat the brass WAY faster than the tap!!

Ferric chlodide is used to etch the copper off from circuit boards, being brass is composed of quite a bit of copper it EATS it very fast and agressive!!

For once, don't listen to Tom or Bruce!!!

Alan...



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If a Man talks in the forest, and there is no Woman around to hear him, is he still wrong?
 
Thanks for all the replies. I am going to try and see what happens with the foredom and a cutoff wheel to grind a slot and then go from there. I will let you know how I made out. Again thanks for all the help and suggestions. It is great to have a forum like this to draw on the experience of others.
 
Ok I tried ferric cloride on brass. I used 1 to 3 parts ferric to water mix and left it in all night. It took .005" off the diameter of the .750" brass rod. That is a .0025" from the surface deep. I dont beleive that is enough to harm the pommel. I still think the tap will disolve faster than the brass or at least enough to easily remove it. Over night is too long. It did leave the ferric cloride a nice shade of deep green. Bruce
 
Allen is right! Try the ferric for a short time to loosen the tap and remove it. It will eat the brass in a hurry. RESIST the whole pomel with nail polish first twice so it dont ruin it.
It shouldnt take but a few mins. Then do what Rob said with the screwdriver.
Just put a few drops in the tapped hole.
On ti you can just submerge the part without worry and save it . The ferric wont damage it.
OR do the elox trick burn it out. Expensive!

Or take a diamond and drill a small hole down into it and an easy out to get it.

I always tap in the beginning, that way if you screw up you can just get another piece of brass.
Brass Bronze and ti like to have a fresh tap that has not been used on another type of steel or material. Then just reserve that tap for that material. Saw blades are the same way . These materials just cut better with blades that are used on them only . The life of the tap or blade will go up ...


Hope it works !

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Web Site At www.darrelralph.com
Happy Holidays!

[This message has been edited by Darrel Ralph (edited 12-22-2000).]
 
Hi - get some "music" wire or spring steel of a diameter that will slide into the flutes of the tap. Use either 3 or 4 pieces (whatever the tap is). Get them as far in as you can and leave about an inch sticking out so you can grip the 3 or 4 with a pair of pliers. Chances are the tap had a nice curl chip forming and once you break that loose and get the pieces of brass out, you should be able to use the wiggle technique on the tap to back it out. There use to be a company that made a tool that had 3 or 4 sliding pieces that you'd insert like I described. They were made for different size taps - you might be able to find them in some kind of machinist tool catalog for future use - not sure if they're still around or not.

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Fran (CT)
 
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