Buck Knives Factory Tour Report
September 22, 2004.
My friend and I drove down to El Cajon from LA, a trip of about about 2
hours (Thankfully, we could use the carpool lane on 405). We found the
factory no problem, but were over an hour early for our registered tour
time (noon) so we stopped in and checked out the factory store for a
bit before taking off for some lunch and then coming back for our tour
later. El Cajon is hot and sunny, and probably much too warm for my
tastes. Typical southern California weather, although the surrounding
hills looked nice and I bet there is some great hiking to be done
there. There did not seem to be much around, business-wise, other than
Buck, but then again we didn't explore much. There is a driving range
right down the road, though, so you could always unwind by hitting some
golf balls after grinding or stamping knives all day.
Turns out the tours are started at and run from the factory store
anyway, so we got to chat with our tour guide a little early as we
perused the offerings at the Buck Factory Shoppe (Why it is spelled
like that I don't know). We checked out the knives and other stuff for
sale (there is a clothing sale going on right now). They are clearly
unloading old crap in anticipation of the move to Idaho, since they
were also getting rid of some red velvet and wood display cases, big
ones, too, going for $40 each. Lots of smaller displays cases on sale,
too. Posters are only $3.23 each. Get two, they're small. They had good
deals on some knives also: brand new model 751 Approaches were only 25
bucks each, so I picked up a couple. My buddy picked up a brand new 112
Ranger and some smaller stuff for his girlfriend (a newt, a 425). This
is the only place they sell their factory "blemish" knives too, but
they didn't have anything in particular that caught my eye. Blemish
knives were in general, about half of retail, maybe a little cheaper.
Buck's also getting rid of some custom knives they appear to have
extras of as well, so if you're looking for that NRA-etched Alpha
Hunter, head on down.
They had two big tubs of sheathes for sale, one of $2.00 sheathes and
one of $5.00 sheathes. A lot of the $5.00 sheathes were for weird stuff
like the Buck Saw, and bigger fixed-blades, so I poked around in the
other one and I got a bunch of the velcro-closing bucklite sheathes in
black and black/orange camo for two bucks a pop. Not too bad. I have
lots of circa 1980s bucklites, and many need sheathes.
Weird thing about the store: I wanted to buy an 882 Police Knife (which
they had, but not in the display case and I didn't catch the price
either) but they said they can only sell them to law enforcement. But,
sitting right there in the case, with a pretty good price (IIRC, $180
or so) was an 888 Strider Solution, which is quite a bit bigger and
nastier-looking. Why is that knife OK for the public to buy, but not
the 882? Seems like a silly distinction to me. The lady behind the
counter offered no reason, just said it was the rule. When stopping
back after running out for lunch, though, we pulled in right next to a
San Diego City Police car, and said SDCP officer came out with a
bulging bag from the store and pulled away shortly after we pulled back
in (with, no doubt, a bunch of 882s in that bag!). Whatever. I can get
one for less than $100 on eBay, so I will. no big deal. Just a silly
thing to me.
Some thoughts on the Buck factory: You can tell this place was built
over 20 years ago. The outside is nice enough, and I kind of understand
the "hunting lodge" theme they went for on the road-facing side of the
factory, but the rest of the place has definitely seen better days.
Now, I did remind myself that this was a working knife production
factory, so I knew it wasn't going to be all gleaming and white, but I
was a little surprised to see unfixed holes that had been bashed in the
walls in a number of areas, grimy employee lockers lining the main
hallway, plastic bag-covered broken toilets in the men's room, and a
little too much dirty wood paneling in the cafeteria (of which the
store is more or less a part). I know, I know, it's a factory, not an
office building, I'm just saying is all. Here's hoping that the factory
in Idaho is brand new and shiny; it will be a nicer place for their
customers to visit. How many will make the trek to Idaho, however, is
another question. We did hear from our tour guide, however, that of
around 220 employees, about 65 will be making the move to Idaho to keep
making knives. We figured 25% retention of a primarily manufacturing
company is not bad. I'm sure the lowest wage blade grinders or riveters
will probably stay. We did not get a break down on how many of the 65
are management and how many labor. Makes you wonder.
One other weird thing. Right outside the factory store in the cafeteria
is a drinking fountain, and on the wall above the drinking fountain is
a hand-lettered sign saying "DO NOT DUMP FOOD IN FOUNTAIN!" I'm curious
as to whether this was put up because of a customer-related incident or
an employee-related incident. I'm hoping it was a customer. You don't
want that kind of person working with sharp metal objects. Certainly
not making them.
OK, on with the tour: it starts, oddly enough, with step TWO in the
making of a Buck Knife: The double-sided grinding of the blade blank.
Simply enough thing: Giant Pizza-looking metal disc with cut-out shapes
for each blade style is mounted in grinder, and a guy places the
non-ground blanks in as the wheel slowly spins and they go through the
grinder; they then drop out on the other side all ground. I would hate
this job, and the guy doing it was grooving on his walkman while he did
it. I think I would too. It was neat seeing all the different blank
holders they have though. Some are for big blades, some small, etc.
Each wheel was probably 3 or 4 feet across and they must have had 30 or
40 of them staked up on the side.
Step ONE was next on the tour, which is where the huge rolls of steel
from ohio are fed into a massive stamping machine which can hold any
one of a number of dies (one for each model blade). The dies themselves
must weigh hundred of pounds, because they move them around with a
forklift. Different thicknesses and widths of steel are fed by roll
into the machine, which then stamps out about one blank every second.
It was not running as we walked through, but must make a hell of a
racket.
For those blades that can't be stamped out this way, they have two
carbon-dioxide laser cutters. These are used for ATS-34 steel and
anything too thick to be punched out with the normal stamper. This was
way cool to see, and they were cutting blanks on one of the rigs as we
walked around. They also use the laser cutters for the special edition
knives with the designed carved out of the blade (like the deer antler
one with the fancy "hole" in the blade itself). Our tour guide handed
us some examples of the type of work the laser cutters are used for,
and we passed them around (our two group was me, my friend, and a nice
grey-haired man and his father). All around at this point in the
factory are plastic trays totally FILLED with blade blanks. Most marked
by model number, date of manufacture, if they had been heat treated
yet, etc.
Here's where our story gets interesting. One of the laser-cut blank
blades passed around (the only things we were ever allowed to touch)
was "the thickest steel we've ever used." This was a full-tang
Tanto-style blank with a blade of about 7.5 or 8 inches. Overall length
was probably a foot. This thing must have been a quarter of an inch
thick (ok, maybe 3/8 of an inch) and makes the BuckMaster look like a
110 Hunter. This thing is huge. After we got to the heat-treat
department, I saw a whole bunch more of these, and asked "Is this a
current product?" because I for sure had never seen it in the catalog
or web site. "No, that's for a new knife," was the answer. I'll say,
and one that is no doubt a Strider collaboration. I checked one closely
and saw no model number stamped, just BUCK USA. These ones by the
heat-treat section were further along in the finishing process, with
the blade edges more or less fully ground, but what was interesting is
that the top side of the blade had a groove cut-out of about 2.5 inches
long (maybe 3 inches from the tip) that looked like a blood groove, but
ran right off the top edge of the blade. I'm not sure what this was, so
I guessed it is some sort of blood groove or they would be adding
serrations later on in this area of the blade, and these just had not
been ground in yet. Either way, my comment is that this if this new
knife is not public knowledge, it is now, and Buck should either drape
stuff when conducting tours, or require people to sign non-disclosure
agreements. The concept of secret R&D is not limited to just the
technology industry.
Heat treating is next, and we didn't get too close to these machines,
but the short story is that they bake in the oven up 1600 degrees, then
plunge into the freezer to 120 below zero. Then they are brought back
up to between 600 and 900 degrees depending on the steel and type of
blade, they they are ready to go and nice and shiny. The whole process
takes about 15 hours.
Assembly was next, and the knives (or folders, at least, which is what
we saw) are put together by groups of workers in what are called
"clusters" 8 or 10 people will work on putting together, say, the 110.
One guy take the blades, the parts for the handle and internals and
puts them together. The next guy (or gal) then rivets the thing
together. Next person then checks that everything looks good and sticks
it in a machine that holds it by the blade and runs it into a magic
"finishing" room (called the Black Hole) where the handle is all coated
with some sort of waxy solvent and every thing but the blade is ground
down and smoothed out. I imagine the inside of the Black Hole to look
something like the cloth car wash from hell. They then come out again,
get cleaned up, and a guy puts the final edge on them in 3 or 4 passes
of the blade against a belt sander. This is done by hand. Another guy
then grinds smooth the rivets or any last rough spots, and they go into
a big tray of finished knives for final quality check. We also got to
see the cluster where they were putting together little 425s and the
one where they make the silver and blue handle rush models. Very cool.
Each cluster can assemble between 800 and 1200 knives a day, and with
all 7 cluster running, Buck can crank out between 5000 and 8000 knives
in one day. Not too shabby. It was nice to see lots of hand-finished
aspects to the production of a Buck knife, but it is clearly monotonous
factory work, and practically everyone had a walkman or something
plugged into their ear protection so they can have something
interesting to listen to while working.
Our tour guide gave their final day in El Cajon as December 23rd, so if
you want to see this particular part of the American manufacturing
industry (and the home base of one of the world's best known knive
brands, you better get down there.
I, for one, am very glad I went. I doubt I'll ever make it to Idaho.
-Steve
September 22, 2004.
My friend and I drove down to El Cajon from LA, a trip of about about 2
hours (Thankfully, we could use the carpool lane on 405). We found the
factory no problem, but were over an hour early for our registered tour
time (noon) so we stopped in and checked out the factory store for a
bit before taking off for some lunch and then coming back for our tour
later. El Cajon is hot and sunny, and probably much too warm for my
tastes. Typical southern California weather, although the surrounding
hills looked nice and I bet there is some great hiking to be done
there. There did not seem to be much around, business-wise, other than
Buck, but then again we didn't explore much. There is a driving range
right down the road, though, so you could always unwind by hitting some
golf balls after grinding or stamping knives all day.
Turns out the tours are started at and run from the factory store
anyway, so we got to chat with our tour guide a little early as we
perused the offerings at the Buck Factory Shoppe (Why it is spelled
like that I don't know). We checked out the knives and other stuff for
sale (there is a clothing sale going on right now). They are clearly
unloading old crap in anticipation of the move to Idaho, since they
were also getting rid of some red velvet and wood display cases, big
ones, too, going for $40 each. Lots of smaller displays cases on sale,
too. Posters are only $3.23 each. Get two, they're small. They had good
deals on some knives also: brand new model 751 Approaches were only 25
bucks each, so I picked up a couple. My buddy picked up a brand new 112
Ranger and some smaller stuff for his girlfriend (a newt, a 425). This
is the only place they sell their factory "blemish" knives too, but
they didn't have anything in particular that caught my eye. Blemish
knives were in general, about half of retail, maybe a little cheaper.
Buck's also getting rid of some custom knives they appear to have
extras of as well, so if you're looking for that NRA-etched Alpha
Hunter, head on down.
They had two big tubs of sheathes for sale, one of $2.00 sheathes and
one of $5.00 sheathes. A lot of the $5.00 sheathes were for weird stuff
like the Buck Saw, and bigger fixed-blades, so I poked around in the
other one and I got a bunch of the velcro-closing bucklite sheathes in
black and black/orange camo for two bucks a pop. Not too bad. I have
lots of circa 1980s bucklites, and many need sheathes.
Weird thing about the store: I wanted to buy an 882 Police Knife (which
they had, but not in the display case and I didn't catch the price
either) but they said they can only sell them to law enforcement. But,
sitting right there in the case, with a pretty good price (IIRC, $180
or so) was an 888 Strider Solution, which is quite a bit bigger and
nastier-looking. Why is that knife OK for the public to buy, but not
the 882? Seems like a silly distinction to me. The lady behind the
counter offered no reason, just said it was the rule. When stopping
back after running out for lunch, though, we pulled in right next to a
San Diego City Police car, and said SDCP officer came out with a
bulging bag from the store and pulled away shortly after we pulled back
in (with, no doubt, a bunch of 882s in that bag!). Whatever. I can get
one for less than $100 on eBay, so I will. no big deal. Just a silly
thing to me.
Some thoughts on the Buck factory: You can tell this place was built
over 20 years ago. The outside is nice enough, and I kind of understand
the "hunting lodge" theme they went for on the road-facing side of the
factory, but the rest of the place has definitely seen better days.
Now, I did remind myself that this was a working knife production
factory, so I knew it wasn't going to be all gleaming and white, but I
was a little surprised to see unfixed holes that had been bashed in the
walls in a number of areas, grimy employee lockers lining the main
hallway, plastic bag-covered broken toilets in the men's room, and a
little too much dirty wood paneling in the cafeteria (of which the
store is more or less a part). I know, I know, it's a factory, not an
office building, I'm just saying is all. Here's hoping that the factory
in Idaho is brand new and shiny; it will be a nicer place for their
customers to visit. How many will make the trek to Idaho, however, is
another question. We did hear from our tour guide, however, that of
around 220 employees, about 65 will be making the move to Idaho to keep
making knives. We figured 25% retention of a primarily manufacturing
company is not bad. I'm sure the lowest wage blade grinders or riveters
will probably stay. We did not get a break down on how many of the 65
are management and how many labor. Makes you wonder.
One other weird thing. Right outside the factory store in the cafeteria
is a drinking fountain, and on the wall above the drinking fountain is
a hand-lettered sign saying "DO NOT DUMP FOOD IN FOUNTAIN!" I'm curious
as to whether this was put up because of a customer-related incident or
an employee-related incident. I'm hoping it was a customer. You don't
want that kind of person working with sharp metal objects. Certainly
not making them.
OK, on with the tour: it starts, oddly enough, with step TWO in the
making of a Buck Knife: The double-sided grinding of the blade blank.
Simply enough thing: Giant Pizza-looking metal disc with cut-out shapes
for each blade style is mounted in grinder, and a guy places the
non-ground blanks in as the wheel slowly spins and they go through the
grinder; they then drop out on the other side all ground. I would hate
this job, and the guy doing it was grooving on his walkman while he did
it. I think I would too. It was neat seeing all the different blank
holders they have though. Some are for big blades, some small, etc.
Each wheel was probably 3 or 4 feet across and they must have had 30 or
40 of them staked up on the side.
Step ONE was next on the tour, which is where the huge rolls of steel
from ohio are fed into a massive stamping machine which can hold any
one of a number of dies (one for each model blade). The dies themselves
must weigh hundred of pounds, because they move them around with a
forklift. Different thicknesses and widths of steel are fed by roll
into the machine, which then stamps out about one blank every second.
It was not running as we walked through, but must make a hell of a
racket.
For those blades that can't be stamped out this way, they have two
carbon-dioxide laser cutters. These are used for ATS-34 steel and
anything too thick to be punched out with the normal stamper. This was
way cool to see, and they were cutting blanks on one of the rigs as we
walked around. They also use the laser cutters for the special edition
knives with the designed carved out of the blade (like the deer antler
one with the fancy "hole" in the blade itself). Our tour guide handed
us some examples of the type of work the laser cutters are used for,
and we passed them around (our two group was me, my friend, and a nice
grey-haired man and his father). All around at this point in the
factory are plastic trays totally FILLED with blade blanks. Most marked
by model number, date of manufacture, if they had been heat treated
yet, etc.
Here's where our story gets interesting. One of the laser-cut blank
blades passed around (the only things we were ever allowed to touch)
was "the thickest steel we've ever used." This was a full-tang
Tanto-style blank with a blade of about 7.5 or 8 inches. Overall length
was probably a foot. This thing must have been a quarter of an inch
thick (ok, maybe 3/8 of an inch) and makes the BuckMaster look like a
110 Hunter. This thing is huge. After we got to the heat-treat
department, I saw a whole bunch more of these, and asked "Is this a
current product?" because I for sure had never seen it in the catalog
or web site. "No, that's for a new knife," was the answer. I'll say,
and one that is no doubt a Strider collaboration. I checked one closely
and saw no model number stamped, just BUCK USA. These ones by the
heat-treat section were further along in the finishing process, with
the blade edges more or less fully ground, but what was interesting is
that the top side of the blade had a groove cut-out of about 2.5 inches
long (maybe 3 inches from the tip) that looked like a blood groove, but
ran right off the top edge of the blade. I'm not sure what this was, so
I guessed it is some sort of blood groove or they would be adding
serrations later on in this area of the blade, and these just had not
been ground in yet. Either way, my comment is that this if this new
knife is not public knowledge, it is now, and Buck should either drape
stuff when conducting tours, or require people to sign non-disclosure
agreements. The concept of secret R&D is not limited to just the
technology industry.
Heat treating is next, and we didn't get too close to these machines,
but the short story is that they bake in the oven up 1600 degrees, then
plunge into the freezer to 120 below zero. Then they are brought back
up to between 600 and 900 degrees depending on the steel and type of
blade, they they are ready to go and nice and shiny. The whole process
takes about 15 hours.
Assembly was next, and the knives (or folders, at least, which is what
we saw) are put together by groups of workers in what are called
"clusters" 8 or 10 people will work on putting together, say, the 110.
One guy take the blades, the parts for the handle and internals and
puts them together. The next guy (or gal) then rivets the thing
together. Next person then checks that everything looks good and sticks
it in a machine that holds it by the blade and runs it into a magic
"finishing" room (called the Black Hole) where the handle is all coated
with some sort of waxy solvent and every thing but the blade is ground
down and smoothed out. I imagine the inside of the Black Hole to look
something like the cloth car wash from hell. They then come out again,
get cleaned up, and a guy puts the final edge on them in 3 or 4 passes
of the blade against a belt sander. This is done by hand. Another guy
then grinds smooth the rivets or any last rough spots, and they go into
a big tray of finished knives for final quality check. We also got to
see the cluster where they were putting together little 425s and the
one where they make the silver and blue handle rush models. Very cool.
Each cluster can assemble between 800 and 1200 knives a day, and with
all 7 cluster running, Buck can crank out between 5000 and 8000 knives
in one day. Not too shabby. It was nice to see lots of hand-finished
aspects to the production of a Buck knife, but it is clearly monotonous
factory work, and practically everyone had a walkman or something
plugged into their ear protection so they can have something
interesting to listen to while working.
Our tour guide gave their final day in El Cajon as December 23rd, so if
you want to see this particular part of the American manufacturing
industry (and the home base of one of the world's best known knive
brands, you better get down there.
I, for one, am very glad I went. I doubt I'll ever make it to Idaho.
-Steve
