Buck's Use of DuPont Delrin?

Codger_64

Codger_64

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I posted this question in BRL's forum and the silence is deafening. Since my original post I have only come across one reference to first use of Delrin by another maker, Case in 1967, but it was only a reference on another forum posted without evidence. So when did Buck first use Delrin as a handle material? Was it when they had knives made for them by Schrade and Camillus, or earlier?

Codger_64 said:
A few years ago I did some research on the invention of DuPon't's Delrin plastic production and it's early use by the cutlery companies under the direction of Albert Baer.

In reviewing that research, I began to wonder how quickly other knife makers adopted the material for their own knives.

Did some of them make use of Delrin as a handle material at the same time as Baer, or earlier?

Did most of them wait a few years to see if it was actually a viable material for production?

Did many/most/all follow Baer's lead and invent snappy trade names for their Delrin handle material?

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=439751&highlight=Dupont+Delrin
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(Codger listening for crickets) :p
 
Codger_64 said:
I posted this question in BRL's forum and the silence is deafening. Since my original post I have only come across one reference to first use of Delrin by another maker, Case in 1967, but it was only a reference on another forum posted without evidence. So when did Buck first use Delrin as a handle material? Was it when they had knives made for them by Schrade and Camillus, or earlier?



(Codger listening for crickets) :p
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my money is on 300 bucks or Bear Claw Chris Lappe:thumbup: They oughta be along sometime
 
Hi, Codger_64...I have no idea about Delrin and Buck's useage of it...but hope that some of the really knowledgeable folks here will give it some thought. You certainly would over there on the Schrade forum.

I'll bet that Joe Houser will be able to give you some answers...if not on this forum then I would email him at Buck. Preston
 
C,

First let me say thanks for the Delrin info of the past, I try to save all info you publish that applies to Buck slipjoints.

I can say that my knowledge is not anywhere near gospel, Joe Houser will be needed for that. The only early slipjoints widely discussed in Buck collector circles are the surplus life raft knives that were bought in military surplus sales after WW2 back when Buck was a 'shed' business and converted them with Buck forged blades. They generally are maked with just BUCK stamped on the tang of the single blade.

But that is not what Mr. Houser will tell you. He has said to me that some slipjoints of a few other types were hand-made during that early era also. That life raft knife is commonly listed as a 117 model. The life raft knife generally appears to be wood scaled. So any early Delrin use will be very special.

My personal answer to your question will be that the first Delrin scale production folding knife was a Schrade Contracted 301 size 3 blade stockman with grooved bolsters. Only made by Schrade for Buck during 1966 and 67, I call it the "First Model". After that there pivot arrangement fell out of favor with Buck and the contract was switched to Camillus. Micarta seems to be a scale material of favor for Buck early factory made folding knives.

Maybe Joe or someone else with real knowledge will check this thread and provide a new tidbit of information. I was 13 in 1966, wish I had used my paper route money to order several of those raft knife conversions from the ads in the outdoor magazines.......would have been way ahead today....
300Bucks
 
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Thanks guys! If Joe doesn't drop by in the next few days, I will email him.
 
I don't think there were any knives labeled "Buck" that had Delrin handles until Schrade made the first 300 series knives in the early 70's. I remember phenolic and wood on the knives made in-house prior to that. IIRC the first 500 series knives in-house in 440C had Micarta handles. Beyond that, I do not know.

If I were a betting man, I would bet that the first in-house Buck Delrin handles were on the 300 series when Buck brought it back from Camillus. But I'm just guessing.
 
knarfeng said:
I don't think there were any knives labeled "Buck" that had Delrin handles until Schrade made the first 300 series knives in the early 70's. I remember phenolic and wood on the knives made in-house prior to that. IIRC the first 500 series knives in-house in 440C had Micarta handles. Beyond that, I do not know.

If I were a betting man, I would bet that the first in-house Buck Delrin handles were on the 300 series when Buck brought it back from Camillus. But I'm just guessing.
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ok,why did buck need those other companies to make their knives for them?I've always wondered that..
 
Razor,
Till a company person says, I will stick my foot in my mouth on the 300series aspect.
So here you are its the 60s, your company is growing as the countries economic outlook expands, but your factory is full to walls with production of your classic 100 fixed blades and your famous and in demand 110. Yet people ask why not a slipjoint folder. You look to other cutlery companies and see them having product made by companies with higher capicity. So why not try that till your place in the market is assured and your production ability is increased by facility expansion. (That still is occurring with several knife brands today.)
You contract with a company that has a record in quality production, you add the slipjoints to your catalog line and work your way into the slipjoint market using the good name of your homemade high quality classics you have become famous for.
Sounds simple but bet it wasn't, blood sweat and tears made in happen, no doubt.
300Bucks
 
300Bucks said:
Razor,
Till a company person says, I will stick my foot in my mouth on the 300series aspect.
So here you are its the 60s, your company is growing as the countries economic outlook expands, but your factory is full to walls with production of your classic 100 fixed blades and your famous and in demand 110. Yet people ask why not a slipjoint folder. You look to other cutlery companies and see them having product made by companies with higher capicity. So why not try that till your place in the market is assured and your production ability is increased by facility expansion. (That still is occurring with several knife brands today.)
You contract with a company that has a record in quality production, you add the slipjoints to your catalog line and work your way into the slipjoint market using the good name of your homemade high quality classics you have become famous for.
Sounds simple but bet it wasn't, blood sweat and tears made in happen, no doubt.
300Bucks
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I would agree with this reasoning and add in the cost factor for the tooling and cutlers needed to produce an entirely different knife. Schrade was already set up for it and was well known for producing quality pocket knives at a very attractive SFO price. The handle scale molds and injection machines, the bolster stamping dies, and all of the blade dies add up to a pretty sum. So Buck contracted them out until they had the space and equipment required to make them themselves.

Oh, and the reason production was switched from the Schrade Ellenville plant to Camillus (Albert Baer's "other factory") was because Schrade used the Swinden patent keyhole bolsters which made disassembly for repair more difficult than the standard thru-the-bolster pivot pins used in the Camillus factory.

21lj1fs.jpg
 
Thanks for the information 300 bucks,i can definately see why they needed the extra help,wish it was like that today,things will boom again,i hope.
 
Casares said:
hey,

thanks for the pic of the 897 exploded parts

:)
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:) Send an example of the 300 made by Schrade and I will take it apart to show you the same keyhole construction. And send me one made by Camillus and I will show you how it was made with pins instead of keyholes! All parts returned in ziplocks!:D
 
Wow! You really put some blood, sweat and knives into that research! :thumbup:

Well done!! :)

Now help me find out who else was using Delrin in 1958-60? :confused:
 
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