Buy decision: CS Trailmaster 01 steel vs Down Under The Outback

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Seriousbladeno1

Joined
Sep 11, 2014
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Hello guys

After some time, I am coming back to forum,I wish to hear your opinion - what is worth better for somebody who loves Bowie large knifes, made to last and to perform at their best....After review of my budget it boils down to two models CS O1 Trailmaster VS Down Under Knifes (The Outback)... I am very familiar with both models,but it's hard decision to make...CS is cheaper and smaller,but very high quality well balanced blade,trusted by many...The Outback is fantastic well heat treated and quality reproduction of Crocodile Dundee knife (at least the closest thing)-and is larger and thicker than CS Trailmaster....Both are clearly performers in their class, which one you d give preference and for what reason guys????

Thanks
 
I'm not really a fan of Cold Steel, but in this comparison I would choose the trailmaster 100% of the time.

If you search around here you'll find that Down Under knives has a really long and somewhat bad history here (they were banned from this site, and are actually based in Finland, but are produced in China from what I understand), and in general.

So yeah, while I'm not a fan of Cold Steels marketing, or company tactics, they at least make good products.

Anyway, good luck making a choice, and finding something that works for you :).
 
ocnLogan said:
I'm not really a fan of Cold Steel, but in this comparison I would choose the trailmaster 100% of the time.

If you search around here you'll find that Down Under knives has a really long and somewhat bad history here (they were banned from this site, and are actually based in Finland, but are produced in China from what I understand), and in general.

So yeah, while I'm not a fan of Cold Steels marketing, or company tactics, they at least make good products.

Anyway, good luck making a choice, and finding something that works for you :).
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Many thanks Ocnlogan for your thoughts.

When it comes to reputation I see people who done purchase of The Outback model are extremely happy with its outstanding quality (talking knife-not the sheath),,,tons of videos out there with guys mesmerised by this blade,,,,but so as CS Trailmaster....Both knifes are also introduced in knife fails (Trailmaster snapped in half,The Outback's pommel snapped),,,I still believe both are very good competitors and value for money,,,,it's just hard to decide,more facts about pro's and cons (those hidden ones) would help me to select....I myself do not like much CS marketing too,but believe they have good products, not saying unbeatable but solid quality yes...On the other hand Down Under is newcomer in business and each of their product is of top notch quality and they release new model once or max twice per year,but it's always a nice, well crafted model that people are more than happy with...Tough decision :)
 
I've held and fondled both, I would say it comes down to what you want out of the knife. If you want a presentation Bowie that won't get used much, go for the Outback: it looks great, feels really solid, and is more true to the Bowie-style blade. If you want a knife to use, go with the trailmaster: not as flashy, more usable, tougher steel, more comfortable handle when in use.
 
KingMC said:
I've held and fondled both, I would say it comes down to what you want out of the knife. If you want a presentation Bowie that won't get used much, go for the Outback: it looks great, feels really solid, and is more true to the Bowie-style blade. If you want a knife to use, go with the trailmaster: not as flashy, more usable, tougher steel, more comfortable handle when in use.
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I'd say you know exactly what you are talking about,if you handled both knifes and I think you are right with description of differences....Is The Outback really so tough as on its videos? I mean it's dually heat treated 440C, highly polished,,,,CS O1 is high carbon oil quenched (I d prefer higher carbon Steels over stainless for sure,but The Outback have some specially finished steel, making real difference
 
I never actually used the outback for anything major, since I wasn't the one who owned it at the time. I got to examine it closely and wield it, but never put it to any good use. I can't say for sure which would be better, but in theory a higher-carbon steel like O1 will have more tensile flex and thus be less susceptible to breaking from lateral stress. 440C is not the most brittle of stainless, but by nature it will be less flexible if it's the same thickness as the O1.

Honestly, the biggest difference would be the blade shape: the outback is much more curved but has a less-pointy tip due to the saber grind and clipped point, while the trailmaster has a straighter and simpler point but the blade is ultimately a bit thinner due to the full flat grind on it. Comparing blade shapes I'd say the Outback is a tougher design, but the trailmaster is going to be way more useful for actual knife duties.

The blade steel isn't as big of an issue when the blades are so darn thick.
 
Thanks KingMC

I love all the large fix CS classic Blades such as Laredo, Natchez,Trailmaster those are all solid quality knifes I d say,from all CS I think Trailmaster would be the most usable multipurpose fixed blade,not too small,not too large,blade with perfect shapes for variety of use,not too heavy but still thick chunk of metal to do the heavy but also lighter work..
I love the Kraton handle and full guard-safest possible option for most solid grip.... I d love leather sheath on it (not sure if this is optional in some retailers). I know the kydex is more practical for keeping blade safe from soaking in wet environment but leather on the other hand is not noisy in wilderness,is very friendly to touch and remind the old bond between knife and hunter....The man.
 
If you want an awesome bowie knife and in your post you said you're fine with a Kraton handle, I would really suggest looking at the Kabar heavy Bowie
 
Just a thought, but if you like classic bowie shapes, have you looked at the Svord Von Tempsky bowie? Its another big bruiser of a classic bowie shape, and personally I think it looks fantastic.

From the reading I've done of the Down Under Bowie, it does sound like the handle is a weak point, however depending on how you use it, that may or may not be a problem.

But I stand by my original statement, that I'd prefer the trailmaster between the two. I like my outdoor blades to be carbon steel, I tend to like flat grinds, and drop points, among all of the other reasons I already talked about.

Good luck deciding though :).
 
No question I'd choose the Cold Steel trailmaster. It comes in O-1 carbon steel (Taiwan) or San Mai III stainless (Japan). Both should be much tougher than the Outback's 440C. Carbon steels in general are much tougher than plain stainless. The San Mai version is a three layer sandwich stainless, which is also much tougher than 440C. Any youtube videos aside, would you trust a Down Under knife, when they don't even specify where it is made? It's true that some custom makers do use 440C, but I'm sure the Outback's heat treat is nowhere near as good as a custom job.
 
KingMC said:
I've held and fondled both, I would say it comes down to what you want out of the knife. If you want a presentation Bowie that won't get used much, go for the Outback: it looks great, feels really solid, and is more true to the Bowie-style blade. If you want a knife to use, go with the trailmaster: not as flashy, more usable, tougher steel, more comfortable handle when in use.
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GrReaper said:
No question I'd choose the Cold Steel trailmaster. It comes in O-1 carbon steel (Taiwan) or San Mai III stainless (Japan). Both should be much tougher than the Outback's 440C. Carbon steels in general are much tougher than plain stainless. The San Mai version is a three layer sandwich stainless, which is also much tougher than 440C. Any youtube videos aside, would you trust a Down Under knife, when they don't even specify where it is made? It's true that some custom makers do use 440C, but I'm sure the Outback's heat treat is nowhere near as good as a custom job.
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Thanks for your thoughts all of you guys! Appreciate every reply! GrReaper-i believe blades are not affected in any way by the country of origin,what they are really affected is poor or excellent QC-(Quality Control) by manufacturer...Speaking of many productions are based in China,Taiwan,Korea ,etc.CS is made in Taiwan-also Asian country-is this affecting quality of their products? Up to everyone to judge,(according to me,they have excellent QC) and these guys are not interested in releasing any faulty products anywhere,as it would very quickly spread the bad name and so as others like Down Under Knifes - having factories in Asia.So, where the knifes are made doesn't really guarantee anything just my opinion.I d prefer O1 steel over San Mai
 
but in theory a higher-carbon steel like O1 will have more tensile flex and thus be less susceptible to breaking from lateral stress. 440C is not the most brittle of stainless, but by nature it will be less flexible if it's the same thickness as the O1.
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Indeed 440C is one of the most brittle ( at the edge where it counts) of the stainless steels and stainless steels are pretty far behind non stainless alloys like O-1.That is according to performance charts put out by steel foundries. Compare it to S30V and S35VN both of which have better wear resistance yet grind and sharpen easier due to the powder processing. It makes one wonder why 440C is even being considered. To make 440C passably tough one needs to lower hardness and thicken the blade and angles which certainly affects cutting and slicing ability.

I really doubt that bowie is real 440C anyways. The Chinese steel & knife manufacturers are well known for that.

So, O-1 Trailmaster for using and the big stainless bowie for wall hanging. Of course for that you can get similar quality Chinese bowies for the $30-$50 range. Myself? I have no use for knife like objects even if given to me for free. I have limited space and would end up giving it away as in all honesty I couldn't put my reputation on the line for selling one of those unless it was comparable in price to the chinese schrades and similar quality knives.

Taiwan is not in the same category as Chinese or Pakistan made knives. The Spyderco made ones are best quality and better than many American and Japanese production knives. The Taiwan Cold steel knives I have a very well made. They now Mar Temper the O-1 trailmaster and Recon scout knives like they had begun doing with the SK 5 models which I found pretty darn nice too.

All in all for me there really isn't a reason I would pay more, or the same for that stainless PRC made knife when I had the option of the O-1 ( or earlier SK5) Cold steel. Now comparing them to some other knives like the BK9, RD9, Browning Crowell Barker Competition and some of the Svord models like the Von Tempsky is where it gets more difficult to decide.
 
@The Mastiff, yep, I agree with you 100%. I have the SK5 trailmaster and the laredo bowie in both Sk5 and O-1. All excellent knives. BTW, do you know what exactly the Mar Tempering process is? I've tried to understand it but Cold Steel's explanations of it aren't really comprehensible to me. How is it better than the regular heat treat that such knives would get? Whatever they do, it's obviously great because the quality is excellent but I'd love to know exactly what Mar Tempering is.
 
Hey Grim Reaper, Mar temper is usually done in different temp. salt tanks. http://www.bodycote.com/en/services/heat-treatment/harden-and-temper/martempering-marquenching.aspx Essentially it lowers the risk of probability of failure from stress built up during the quench. It does some other stuff too but this is usually why cutlery is Mar Tempered.

Camillus did the "Carbon V" knives like this. A.G.Russell has started a line of knives in DM-1 steel set up by Dan Maragni that are done like this as well. Very nice stuff! http://www.agrussell.com/a-g-russell-sandbox-bowie/p/RUhhhU712BKOD/

joe
 
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I agree with KingMc. I own both and love the look of the Outback (I've had it for about 6 years) but the area below the pommel is HOLLOW with nothing but a rattail floating in there with the pommel screwed on; I would hesitate to use it for any really hard task or any chopping. The Trailmaster, on the other hand, has been my go to outdoors, hard use knife for about twenty years (mine is Carbon V); it has NEVER failed me in any way. So, looks-Outback :cool:; function-Trailmaster :thumbup:
 
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