Can you answer the questions I pose in my Fox Bellum dagger review?

[James0723]

Some of you may remember about a week ago when I made a thread asking if there were any new production daggers in the works. "Rick" responded telling me about the Fox Bellum dagger, and I knew I had to get one. It's made by Fox Cutlery in Maniago, Italy, has black g10 handle slabs and N690co steel, plus includes a very high quality sheath. The one thing I don't like about it is that it comes dull. I had read in Rick's review that it was dull but didn't expect it to be this dull. I'm still happy with the knife but it would have been so much better if it had come sharper.

[video=youtube;vObN7meOtis]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vObN7meOtis&feature=channel_video_title[/video]

The two questions I have is if anyone has the Extrema Ratio Suppressor dagger and, if so, does the handle have a toxic rubber smell?

Secondly, and most importantly, how should I go about sharpening a dagger like this?

 

[Appletz]

I own one. It seems like you'd have to regrind it to get any sort of edge on it-- the stock is extremely thick and fat. And you'll probably lose some of the finish. I mean, as is, it's like trying to sharpen a 90 degree angle =p

I don't own a suppressor, but from the videos I've seen it seems like the handle is more plastic than rubber. At least in one torture test (for the ADRA dagger), the handle cracked like plastic and sort of turned me off to it. G-10 seems a lot more durable.

[video=youtube;vh41QvvU6WI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vh41QvvU6WI[/video]

 

[James0723]

Thanks for the info Apletz. Didn't you find the dullness a bit disappointing? I know daggers are made for stabbing but the edge shouldn't be that dull from the factory. Someone should be able to slash with a dagger as well. Is there really no way to get this sharp without a regrind?

I believe the Extrema-Ratio Suppressor's handle is a bit different from most of their other knives which have "forprene" handles. In every description of the Suppressor I have read they never use the term forprene but instead say "textured polyamide" or "elastomer". It also looks slightly different than the regular forprene handles they have on most of their other knives.

I really wish someone would make a video about the Suppressor, talking about the handle, sharpness, etc. I wonder if the Suppressor comes as dull as the Bellum from the factory.

 

[Appletz]

I wasn't really disappointed, since I understand the limitations of the design. If the blade profile were wider like a tai-pan I would have expected a sharp edge sure. However I know that backing up the edge geometry any more on the Bellum would have compromised tip strength on such a narrow blade. As it is, the tip is like a needle. When you have such a narrow blade there are going to be compromises one way or the other. That's my view anyway.

 

[James0723]

I agree somewhat. With a design like this we can't expect it to be an ultra-sharp slicer, but I still think it should be sharper than what it is. I can take this knife, press it into my hand and slide it up and down without getting cut. I think it can be made sharper and I'm going to see what I can do.

If anyone has any advice on how I can get this knife sharp please comment. I have an edge pro sharperning system and have had success with sharpening more traditional knives that were already somewhat sharp, but with this dagger which is basically not sharp at all I don't know if I should try to put a new edge geometry on it altogether, maybe a double bevel? Any advice on certain techniques I can use, angles that would be best, etc.

 

[James0723]

I tried to sharpen it but couldn't. Though I am happier with it after doing some research into what kind of knife this is, what it is meant for, and its history. For anyone who is interested here is what Wikipedia had to say:

"A stiletto is a knife or dagger with a long slender blade and acutely-pointed tip, intended primarily as a stabbing or thrusting weapon. Its narrow cross-section and sharp, acuminated point reduces friction upon entry, allowing the blade to penetrate deeply. Although it is considered a dagger or fighting knife, most stilettos are not designed to enable cutting or slashing strokes, even with edged examples.

First developed in Italy, the stiletto dates from the late 1500s, and is thought to be a development of the rondel dagger, a needle-pointed weapon designed primarily for thrusting, though possessing cutting edges. Early stilettos normally used a one-piece cast-metal handle which was shaped and turned on a lathe. The stiletto blade was usually hammer-forged into a dense rod with a narrow, triangular cross section, without any sharpened edges. However, other examples of the period have emerged bearing round, square, or diamond cross sections.

The Italian word "stiletto" comes from the Latin stilus meaning: "a stake; a pointed instrument". The stiletto or misericorde ("mercy"), began to gain fame during the late Middle Ages, when it was the secondary weapon of knights. Designed as a purely offensive weapon, the stiletto was used to finish off a fallen or severely wounded heavily armored opponent. The needle-like blade could easily penetrate most mail or find its way through gaps in a knight's plate armor, and was narrow enough to pass through the eye slits of the helmeted knight. A severely wounded opponent, who was not expected to survive, would be given a "mercy strike" (French coup de grâce), hence the name miséricorde.

The stiletto was later adopted as the favored weapon of the assassin in medieval Italy. A silent killing tool, the stiletto was preferred because it was easily concealed, while its design allowed it to easily penetrate several layers of the heavy fabric and leather costumes of the era."

 

[Rick]

Hi James. FWIW, this little Dan Graves 5-1/8" blade dagger is sharp enough to cut paper, albeit not too cleanly, and it's almost as thick as the Bellum (2.2" stock vs. the Bellum's 2.4" thickness), but it's only a half inch wide at the tang, so it is possible to put a half-decent edge on a stiletto. Dan is a BF member, so if you're still interested in sharpening your Fox dagger, maybe he can help you out.