Carrying knives makes me less confrontational

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Jun 14, 2017
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402
the premise here is that i live in a city that is very strict about carrying knives, ridiculously strict using abstract interpretations of archaic vaguely worded knife laws. nonetheless, gotta carry. so, 90% of the time, i carry a knife that no cop would arrest/cite me for because the judge would laugh at the knife in court.

e.g., here's my carry today (this one is pretty extreme... others currently in rotation are northwoods slips, benchmade 210tk, CRK Mnandi, etc.)
XUMh4iK.jpg


story time: every once in a while, I carry something a liiittle more "questionable". A couple days ago I had a spyderco native 5 in black g10 clipped in my bag. It fails the new york city "gravity test" (SWINGING the blade while holding the handle), and with a little wrist action can also be spydie flicked open. on top of that, black handles tend to look "tactical".

During my commute home yesterday, some random asshole made some racist comments at me because i didn't respond to his request for subway pass swipe (basically panhandling for free subway fair). all i did was give him a bit of a look, and he started going off. no longer just racist comments, escalated to straight up confrontational using slurs (racial and bigoted) that probably offended half of the population walking by. In other situations, i may have been inclined to respond, but in a split second of judgement, i remembered the knife in my bag and had to just walked the hell away. i'll admit, i was fuming when i got home and even ashamed that i had to walk away from a situation like that. But let's be real, there was a lot more to lose than gain in that situation and i'm happy that's the end of the story.

sorry for the wall of text, TLDR: i've come a realization that carrying a knife causes me to be less confrontational due to the legality of carrying in my neighborhood

*edit: a couple of clarifications. He wasn't a homeless man haha, just a trashy dude trying to solicit a free fare. It NEVER crossed my mind to pull the knife on him, what went through my mind was the possibility of police getting involved and then finding the Spyderco Native on me.
 
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You've learned something that many people never learn. Never, ever. That is to keep your mouth shut so things don't escalate.

Those that don't learn wonder why they are always getting in fights and have had two or three brushes with the law.
 
Good for you for going with your better judgement. Glad you're considering the knife in those situations, but I agree with danbot. You should treat those confrontations the same way regardless.

What I wonder about is how you have the Native 5 G10 opening by swinging and holding just by the handle. I have a Native 5 G10 also (great knife to carry to avoid worry by others about flippers, murdery look, etc.), but I can't open it unless I use the hole on the blade. I have the pivot adjusted so it will partly fall shut when I depress the lockbar, but no way I can open by "gravity". Do you have the pivot really loose?
 
Good story, and thoughtful post. Underscores the same idea that every serious citizen needs to keep in mind when we exercise our constitutional rights to protect our lives and carry a legal, concealed weapon of any type: it's a serious responsibility, and you need to be a mature, responsible citizen to exercise that right with restraint and decency and respect for others. "Restraint" in this case means not lashing out and drawing a concealed weapon on someone who was being nasty, even though you would be tempted to, because your life was not really at stake. There are so many cases like this where a street or bar argument goes wrong, and people pull concealed weapons when it was totally unnecessary, nobody's life was at stake, they were not seriously going to rob you or assault you. Good job keeping your cool and not responding to the jerk in-kind.

Not to overdo it bringing my Christianity into it here, but I think "turn the other cheek" is a great guiding principle here for responsible concealed carry folks, even if you're not a Christian. If someone is threatening your life or your loved one's lives, absolutely even in the Bible as well as our constitution, you have the right to protect innocent life including your own. But if someone is just being nasty, insulting, etc., I work to try and keep my cool, not respond in kind, not try to get revenge or shout the other person down. And definitely don't even consider ever drawing a concealed carry just over someone being rude or insulting or "mildly threatening" (as with aggressive panhandlers, I've experienced that too), when I'm not in any real danger.
 
This makes a lot of sense.

The knife laws where I live are far less restrictive than, say, in NYC, but I would still avoid physical confrontation as far as possible. I would only get physical if there were an imminent danger from the other person and I had no other choice. Racial threats and taunts alone, without actual physical threat is not an imminent danger. I've almost always tried to avoid trouble, but there were times in my past where, in similar circumstances, I chose to escalate it and got physical. In one instance, the other guy was out cold for over a minute. For the first several seconds I thought he might be dead, because he was winded to the point that it took him a while to take a deep, shaky breath.

Believe me, it isn't worth it, if it's in any way avoidable. In that instance, I chose to fight when I could have walked away, even though he started it. TBH, back then as a young guy, I hadn't cared about the other guy's well-being, but it wasn't worth the surge of fear I felt that I might have killed someone, and the worry of legal consequences. Luckily, he was able to eventually get up and stumble away, and nothing ever came of it. But for sometime afterwards, I was still feeling very paranoid.

Nowadays, you never know if the other guy(s) is/are packing a gun. Life isn't the UFC. If they are from your area, they may come looking for you afterwards even if you 'win'.

In any area with restrictive knife laws, it always pays to carry knives that fall within the general legally 'acceptable' categories. IMO. At least that's my policy. Where I am now, I carry pretty much whatever I want, but very few of my knives would be considered very 'tacticool' on the forums. I do still sometimes carry a Spyderco Military, but not as a weapon.

Jim
 
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Good for you for going with your better judgement. Glad you're considering the knife in those situations, but I agree with danbot. You should treat those confrontations the same way regardless.

What I wonder about is how you have the Native 5 G10 opening by swinging and holding just by the handle. I have a Native 5 G10 also (great knife to carry to avoid worry by others about flippers, murdery look, etc.), but I can't open it unless I use the hole on the blade. I have the pivot adjusted so it will partly fall shut when I depress the lockbar, but no way I can open by "gravity". Do you have the pivot really loose?

thanks, fully agree about not escalating confrontation. i feel like i'm getting to the point where i can exercise good judgement regardless, but my south jersey/philly upbringing keeps trying to peek out :D:thumbsdown:

the nypd "gravity knife" test is to hold the handle like in the pic below, then swing it down as hard as you can, flicking your wrist downwards about 90 degrees. i know this sounds ridiculous and dangerous, but it's real life here.

NUJcTw5.jpg


on my non-flippers, the pivots are on the tighter side if anything. The native 5 is pretty hard to swing open, but it's possible because of the weight of the blade, also, i do keep my knives cleaned and lubed nicely. the reason i had the native 5 in my bag was to carry it one last time before selling it, so i can't demonstrate with the same knife... but i can swing open all of my spydies, including my Delica 4 that has a similar back lock. if you'd like a demo, i can post a video or gif later in the evening from home. this is clearly not a something i like to do with my knives, but i have to test them whenever i'm dialing in a pivot...
 
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very few things are worth fighting over. except family and life and liberty/freedom, things of that nature. name calling and other child like behaviors do not qualify imo. most confrontations are a complete waste of time and fighting accomplishes nothing.
 
Nice little story btw IIRC NY knife laws were recently reworded to be less vague and to prevent many unnecessary arrest that were clogging up their judicial system.
 
Nice little story btw IIRC NY knife laws were recently reworded to be less vague and to prevent many unnecessary arrest that were clogging up their judicial system.

last i heard it was blocked (see article below) which i was pretty pissed about... let me know if there are updates i missed. i was so hopeful before it got blocked, thought i'd get to see the day where i got to carry a flipper, or a compression lock, or an axis lock! currently those get carried on my couch and are expensive fidget toys :mad:

https://www.villagevoice.com/2017/06/15/gravity-knife-reform-appears-blocked-by-gop-in-state-senate/
 
What would you have done differently in that situation if you had not had a pocket knife on you?

I think you acted correctly by ignoring the guy and walking away. As long as it was nothing but words - vibrations in the air that vanish as quickly as they appear - who cares what some random beggar says.
 
What would you have done differently in that situation if you had not had a pocket knife on you?

I think you acted correctly by ignoring the guy and walking away. As long as it was nothing but words - vibrations in the air that vanish as quickly as they appear - who cares what some random beggar says.

haha he wasn't quite a beggar, if he was actually a beggar, i would have avoided him like the plague, I may have even ran away...

realistically, I may have exchanged some words, which only would have resulted in violence if he attacked me. I agree with what people are saying in this thread, the correct answer would have been to walk away regardless. I just noticed myself having a different reaction and chain of thoughts, than my younger self used to, and it kind of feels like a growing moment. I'm making this out to sound like i'm younger than I am haha, i guess i am a bit immature for my age... (early 30s)
 
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last i heard it was blocked (see article below) which i was pretty pissed about... let me know if there are updates i missed. i was so hopeful before it got blocked, thought i'd get to see the day where i got to carry a flipper, or a compression lock, or an axis lock! currently those get carried on my couch and are expensive fidget toys :mad:

https://www.villagevoice.com/2017/06/15/gravity-knife-reform-appears-blocked-by-gop-in-state-senate/
Interesting but note your article if from 6/15 the following is from 6/21 leads me to believe it did pass.

https://kniferights.org/legislative-update/new-york-gravity-knife-reform-bills-filed-again/
 
Whether armed or not you made the best choice possible ... even when we sometimes have to swallow our pride.

I have taught self defense classes for years and the foremost thing we try to install as your first reaction is to beware of your surroundings and avoid the bad situations ... and if unavoidable walk away if at all humanly possible ... never escalate.

I believe very strongly in a persons rights to carry and to defend themselves and family and even others if the need arises.

But de escalate and walk away any chance you have. And it does sometimes looking back feel like a turning point in our maturation to know we can do that.

Glad it turned out how it did. :thumbsup:
 
i'll admit, i was fuming when i got home and even ashamed that i had to walk away from a situation like that. But let's be real, there was a lot more to lose than gain in that situation and i'm happy that's the end of the story.

Even if you were in a "stand your ground" state that let you legally defend yourself with Rocket Propelled Grenade Launchers, the right move is always just to leave when you can. That's like rule number one of any survival or defense training. If it's come time to use physical force, that's a failure of a situation.

Also, most homeless have some form of mental health issues. I wouldn't feel too good about having to ventilate a crazy person no matter how abusive they are, so it better be extreme plan Z stuff there. Couldn't walk away, couldn't run away, couldn't talk yourself out of it, couldn't shove him and leave, etc...

Just recently went over this with the step son who just started middle school and was concerned about bullying. He's a smart kid, he's done some wrestling, and I've gone over some other basics of physical force with him. But hammered into his head that if it ever gets to a shoving match, he lost. Even if the bully ends up out cold on the ground and my kid doesn't have a scratch on him, it's a failure of a situation and no good will come of it. Use every means at your disposal to get away from physical force.
 
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