Case 47 (three spring stockman)

[Maximumbob54]

I will have to dig out the two models I have later but my question is why does a three blade knife not more commonly have three springs? It seems like it would speed up assembly by eliminating the need to tweak the two opposing blades and really cut back blade rub.

Or is there something obvious I'm missing? I can't imagine the extra part (spring) is so expensive that the increase in throughput wouldn't negate the cost. Then factor in returns for blades rubbing or sticking. And yet it's not common.

What gives?

 

[Carboniferous]

Keeps the knife thinner and lighter mainly I figure. love a single spring muskrat, harder to completely avoid all hints of blade rub but it's worth it imo. Arguably more likely to break the spring I guess but that doesn't seem like a common problem these days.

 

[yablanowitz]

Three springs means either thinner blades or a thicker handle, if not both. Thinner blades are perceived as less durable in a working tool, and a thicker handle, while it may feel better in hand is less comfortable in the pocket. Blade rub on a working tool is of little consequence, but for pocket jewelry that you just look at instead of using, I can see how it would be annoying.

 

[Maximumbob54]

I didn't consider the weight difference. I have a medium stockman but it feels slightly smaller end to end than the 47. I'll have to set them side by side later.

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

For what it's worth, Case's 3-spring version of the '47 pattern still can have issues with blade rub. There's often a misconception that it'll minimize or eliminate the rub issues, but that doesn't really hold true in this example. They do a pretty good job keeping the pattern nearly as thin as the older 2-spring version (I have one of each of them, older and newer). But in keeping the 3-spring version relatively trim, the clearances between the 3 adjacent blades are VERY narrow and the blades and springs are noticably thinner than on their 2-spring designs of similar size and blade configuration. The thinner blades will flex more during opening, in pressing laterally into the nail nick. And with that flex, and the space between the blades being so narrow, blade rub still happens. I've noticed it on my 3-spring '47 and also on Buck's 3-spring 301 stockman (which has thicker blade grinds and springs, BTW). Both of them have rub marks because the spacing between the blades is very close and won't really tolerate any flexing or deflection to the side without rubbing.

The upside to those thinner blades on Case's newer '47 is that thinner ALWAYS makes for better cutting and easier sharpening. So I view Case's 3-spring design as a good thing, but maybe not for the reason most would assume.

 

[Maximumbob54]

Now I'm going to have to add a sowbelly stockman to the line up. I like that one specifically because of the thinner blades being so much better at slicing and cutting in general. Now I have to see which one has thinner blades.

It's funny to me to think of these "medium" size knives as a real worker knife. Never tried an actual small stockman as I can't personally think of a use for three tiny blades. Not knocking them, just not for me. I wish there was a slightly scaled down from the large sized stockman option. As I hit post, it occurs to me that would be the 47...

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

Now I'm going to have to add a sowbelly stockman to the line up. I like that one specifically because of the thinner blades being so much better at slicing and cutting in general. Now I have to see which one has thinner blades.

It's funny to me to think of these "medium" size knives as a real worker knife. Never tried an actual small stockman as I can't personally think of a use for three tiny blades. Not knocking them, just not for me. I wish there was a slightly scaled down from the large sized stockman option. As I hit post, it occurs to me that would be the 47...

I'm comparing my Case Sowbelly (seen pictured in my avatar, BTW) to my 3-spring '47 right now. The '47 still has thinner blades overall. But the nice thing about the Sowbelly is, Case used what I think might be called differential grinds on the sides of blades closely adjacent to each other, giving them a little more room in between and also thinning the blades somewhat. Having said that, I can still see some rub marks on the sheepfoot blade and on the spey, both of which are directly opposite one another in the frame and lightly rub against one another when the spey is opened. Still pretty close spacing between them.

 

[black mamba]

I don't believe any of their sowbelly stockman knives are 3-spring, just 2-springers.

 

[Modoc ED]

Case does not consider "blade rub" to be a defect and will not accept a knife for repair or replacement because of it.

David Obsessed with Edges said above; "The thinner blades will flex more during opening, in pressing laterally into the nail nick. And with that flex, and the space between the blades being so narrow, blade rub still happens."

So true David. The cause of many frowns on the faces of many multiple blade Case knife owners.

 

[screened porch]

My three-spring 47s are thinner than my 3-springer.

 

[knarfeng]

For what it's worth, Case's 3-spring version of the '47 pattern still can have issues with blade rub. There's often a misconception that it'll minimize or eliminate the rub issues, but that doesn't really hold true in this example. They do a pretty good job keeping the pattern nearly as thin as the older 2-spring version (I have one of each of them, older and newer). But in keeping the 3-spring version relatively trim, the clearances between the 3 adjacent blades are VERY narrow and the blades and springs are noticably thinner than on their 2-spring designs of similar size and blade configuration. The thinner blades will flex more during opening, in pressing laterally into the nail nick. And with that flex, and the space between the blades being so narrow, blade rub still happens. I've noticed it on my 3-spring '47 and also on Buck's 3-spring 301 stockman (which has thicker blade grinds and springs, BTW). Both of them have rub marks because the spacing between the blades is very close and won't really tolerate any flexing or deflection to the side without rubbing.

The upside to those thinner blades on Case's newer '47 is that thinner ALWAYS makes for better cutting and easier sharpening. So I view Case's 3-spring design as a good thing, but maybe not for the reason most would assume.

Also, Case softens the tangs of blades prior to assembly. They use an induction heater to do that. That leaves the blades with a bit more flex to them. Camillus used to do that also. I don't know about Schrade. It allows for easier stamping of ID and it allows them to crink the blades as necessary. I measured the hardness of a Camillus stockman tang and it came up as being in the mid 40's. The edge was considerably harder based on usage experience. Have not measured a Case tang. But the I would expect the hardness to be about the same.

Buck does not soften the blade tangs on the 301 and 303. (The topic came up in a discussion thread in the Buck forum about 15 years ago. Chuck Buck discussed it with us.)

Note: I have a three spring 47 and it does have blade rub.

 

[Modoc ED]

• https://www.bladeforums.com/posts/22443012/bookmark

2002 Vintage Bone Sowbelly - Top

2020 6.5 Bone Stag Sowbelly - Bottom

The first version of the Case/Bose collaboration knives were sent to the Case vault in July of 2008. When they came out of the vault in July 2011, the blade configuration above had been changed to what is on the Case Sowbelly today.

Notice how the nail nick on the Sheepfoot blade of the knives has been reversed. On the early 2002 Sowbelly, the nail nick is on the pile side while on the later 2020 Sowbelly, the nail nick is on the mark side. The Sheepfoot blade on the 2002 Sowbelly has a very severe, crinked blade while the Sheepfoot blade on the 2020 Sowbelly is less so. I believe this was done because on the early Sowbelly knives, the clip blade was heavily scratched when opened by contact between the Clip blade and Sheepfoot blade.

 

[Maximumbob54]

Time to finally go picture crazy:

Trying to show size difference on the 47, Sowbelly, and medium

Same line up thickness, is delrin always thicker?

Showing how much main blade you get

Just a glam shot

Large, 47, Sowbelly, medium blade thickness

Final glam shot

About that blade thickness, I need to yet again replace my digital caliper battery. I'm sure there's a difference but until I added the large stockman I didn't see a very dramatic difference on the spine. The bigger difference is where the thickness is behind the edge. Judging only by feel I'd say the Sowbelly and 47 are the thinnest, then the medium, and then of course the large. And also of course my digital scale battery is also dead every single time I go to use it. Probably the medium, then either the 47 or Sowbelly, and then the eternal pocket lump that is the large. My current favorite Case to carry has for years now been that Sowbelly. I have to say that fiddling with all these the 47 grew yet again on me. I may start alternating between that Sowbelly and a 47.

I'm supposed to be carrying that medium and it's now really irritating me.

 

[Modoc ED]

Sowbelly tops the 47 but the 47 is a very capable knife.

 

[Maximumbob54]

Blade rub leaving rub marks is one thing. That large stockman in the pic above has rub so bad you have to open one blade to be able to open the other. I can tolerate rub marks but rub trapping no es bueno. And the medium is just a mess of one blade able to close on the other. And I'm not seeing much of a thickness despite the medium only having two springs. The main blade being a skinny thing means if it has any hollow grind to it I can't even feel it.

I did some scouring of the internets last night and fingers crossed (breaking my buy in person only policy) I may have a carbon steel 47 headed in my direction.

Maybe I hope to make the 47 more common.

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

Blade rub leaving rub marks is one thing. That large stockman in the pic above has rub so bad you have to open one blade to be able to open the other. I can tolerate rub marks but rub trapping no es bueno. And the medium is just a mess of one blade able to close on the other. And I'm not seeing much of a thickness despite the medium only having two springs. The main blade being a skinny thing means if it has any hollow grind to it I can't even feel it.

I did some scouring of the internets last night and fingers crossed (breaking my buy in person only policy) I may have a carbon steel 47 headed in my direction.

Maybe I hope to make the 47 more common.

I wouldn't tolerate that either. When I bought my Buck 301, I was able to get it locally from a sporting goods outlet in town. I asked the counter clerk if I could look at one. He pulled a box out of the display case and slid it across the counter. I opened up the blades to check everything out. When I closed the sheepfoot blade, it was obviously rubbing against the adjacent spey blade and wouldn't fully close by itself. I had to nudge it closed with my fingertip. The issue was compounded by the relatively weak spring pull for the sheepfoot on Buck's 301, which is very light. I put it back in the box and asked the clerk to see another one. The 2nd one still had very light pull for the sheepfoot. But at least it seemed to reliably close on its own. I hadn't noticed obvious rubbing at that point, but later did see the light rub marks on the adjacent spey blade after I'd taken it home. Buck's 'as ground' satin finish on their blades does a better job concealing the rub marks. They're not as obvious as seen on Case's tumbled, high polished finish. So I give Buck some credit for that anyway. I like the knife, but have always wished the closing pull was more assertive.

 

[Maximumbob54]

Buck's 'as ground' satin finish on their blades does a better job concealing the rub marks.

That makes me curious if something like a scrubbing pad or some finer grit sanding paper could work in a similar finish. Might try that later.

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

That makes me curious if something like a scrubbing pad or some finer grit sanding paper could work in a similar finish. Might try that later.

I've used either SiC sandpaper in 220-320 grit, or a green Scotch-Brite pad of the type found in the kitchen cleaning section at the grocery store for just this sort of task. The 220-320 grit sandpaper produces a satin finish that closely emulates the factory satin finish on many knives. Buck's finish is somewhat coarser I think, but still looks good on their blades. The green Scotch-Brite isn't as aggressive on hardened steel, so it'll leave a finer satin finish that still looks good on simpler steels that aren't too wear-resistant (carbon steels, 420HC, 440A, etc.). The Scotch-Brite is excellent on bolsters though, in brass, nickel or even unhardened stainless like 300-series steel.

 

[rival22]

So, before a few days ago, I didn't know that the 47 pattern existed. I've always liked the looks of the square bolster stockman pattern, so I sorta ignored the 18, and with that rounded shape, I never looked deep enough to even notice a 47 pattern. I have a 32 medium stockman that I like as a secondary knife, but in reality for me, it's just a hair too small to be that useful.

The other day, I stumbled on one of the stockman posts when shopping for a large 75, and someone brought up the 47. Shortly after that, I saw some posts about Tractor Supply's clearance prices at some stores, and yadda yadda yadda, I bought their exclusive at a store a few miles away for $39.99!

And, it's the absolute PERFECT size to carry. It fits as a secondary knife, but the main blade is long enough to accomplish most daily tasks. The sheepsfoot is decently more robust than on the 32 as well. I love unique Case shields, and this barn one is great.

I'm still in the market for a 75, but this will tide me over a bit!

And next to my mini trapper because it is Micarta Monday-

 

[black mamba]

Don't forget about the #92 pattern stockman just because it's not currently available. Shop the secondary markets. It's a square bolstered 4" beauty.



And here it is next to a #75 for reference.