cast vs forged or milled steel

T

T. J.

Joined
Jul 27, 1999
Messages
228
OK, at the risk of starting a major dogfight, I'm going to go ahead and ask this, because I haven't seen anything in past posts on the subject. Has anybody done any scientific analysis or testing on (a certain maker's) cast or "dendritic" steel blades? Any justification to the claims made for them? Maybe a magazine back issue with an objective test?
 
This could end up being a huge string. I've read a bit about forged being tougher than milled steel (if you mean straight from the steel maker). The new dendritic steels have excellent reviews for edge-holding, toughness. Then there are all these super alloys, forged from particles (I think). German Henckels kitchen kinves are made that way, I believe, and they are superb performers -- hard edge, flexible spine. So let's hear from the experts.
 
Boye Dendritic Steel (BDS) is the only cat steel I'm aware of. I believe it's cast 440C. I've only played with knives in it a little, not enoughto judge, but everyone I've heard from says the claims of amazing edge-holding and aggressive, micro-serrated edges are true. Buying a billet or two for stock-removal (forging destroys the carbide network of BDS) has been on my to-do list...

As for the Henkels knives, I don't believe they are using any of the new particle steels. It sounds as if you are discussing the displays they have of the drop-forging process. This is a method where a blade is rough-shaped (from bar or rod) not by repeated blows from a manually-controlled hammer (power or old-fashioned), but by a few huge blows from a giant power-hammer that uses a series of dies or molds getting closer and closer to the final rough shape. then, as with anll knives, it is finished by grinding. If Henkels is using one of the CPM steels, that's news to me.

-Drew
 
Ed I wouldn't mention H......ls around professional chefs. The chefs that I spoke with at the Canadian Federation of Chefs conference didn't care for them very much, too flimsy was the general consensus.

The full grind makes the knife very light but the pros would prefer a stiffer blade.

Chefs using my heavier chefs knives report that the edge holding of the 440C is much superior to that other brand and mine are stock removal.

I think that the end use of the knife and the alloy best suited for that use will determine what is the best method of manufacture.

------------------
george
www.tichbourneknives.com
sales@tichbourneknives.com

 
Thanks for the clarifications, and I'll watch myself around professional chefs. My personal favorite is an old carbon steel French chef's knife by Sabatier which I paid $7 for because the handle was cracked (uh, that was a while ago... 25 years or so). The replacement I fitted is still solid as it never goes in the dishwasher. Thought I had read somewhere in H*****l's literature that they used some kind of particle forging. They are a cut (or two) above the usual stainless steel junk you see in most kitchens.
 
I've seen some very favorable reviews from people who have Boye's dendritic cast knives -- Steve Harvey for one. I don't think he's active on this forum, but he is on the others, especially the general forum.

-Cougar Allen :{)
 
Why worry about a dog fight? Most dogs jusst growl and bark and then its over. Most drop forging is simply a one blow stamping process. It does compress somewhat
but is not all that benificial as far as forging goes. It was designed as wordage to
sell and still produce faster. Not just in
kmives but also several tools.
As far as steels go - I've heard about all
these "other" people out there that make claims that the edge holding on so and so is
great but I've never seen any independent side by side studies done by anyone that didn't have an axe to grind - you know apples to apples. One of the reasons I started making knives was the fact
I was tired of the stuff that was out there
that wouldn't hold an edge. Including custom
made hooha stateoftheart - I have a whole drawer full of them. I've tried a whole mess
of steels and am still experimenting. I'm
working on 3v, somenew tricks with d2 and
bg42 along with 420v. I know how good forged
52100 is and I'm still doing some new stuff
with that. I've never messed with dendridic.
Maybe somebody will put together an independent study. I've never worked with
ify steel before either maybe they would be
willing to send me a blade to test.

goshawk


------------------
http://www.imt.net/~goshawk The race is not always to the swift, but he who hangs loose.
Don't walk in tradition just because it feels good!!!!!
Romans 10:9,10
Psalm 91

 
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