Ceramic Rods

Sando

Sando

Knife Maker
Joined
Jul 4, 2002
Messages
1,148
Maybe I'm the only one that didn't know this, but did you know that ceramic sharpening sticks don't really have a grit? What I mean is: materially they are all the same. You can make them any grit you want with sandpaper.

Story:

I got a BIG ceramic rod for touching up blades. I called the seller and said the rod is great but too coarse for me. He explained that ceramic is ceramic. All I have to do is pick the grit I want and sand it down with that paper.

I used a 15 micron micro finish belt. Smoothed it out too much, actually. So now I'm gonna rough it back up a bit.

This was news to me.

Steve
 
Nosmo, if it doesn't work I'm sunk. I definately smoothed the rod to 15 microns, but that was too much. Next chance I get I'm going to rough it back up.



HammerFall, This guy: http://www.handamerican.com/

the rod is really nice. It's the size of those large sharpening steels. Great for the kitchen. Shaving sharp in a hurry. There is a nice leather cover that I use for final smoothing.

Steve
 
Pretty cool Steve!

Hey Mike, I was flipping through the latest Smokey Mountain Knifeworks catalog and they had 8" ceramic rods also. 6 for $3.00.
 
The guys in the powerhouse will think I've flipped when I chuck my old crock sticks in the drill press and get out a selection of wet or dry. Nice find Steve.

Shalom,
Mark
 
Don'tknow if that is necessarily true about the ceramic all being the same. I have two ceramic stones one is a medium great the other is fine. The structure of each stone is consistant through out its total thickness. A different partical size. Just my observation.

Michael

P.S. I use a ceramic stick to kill the edge of my sand paper discs.
 
Hey Guys,

Never ever believe me! It could be that he was only talking about the stick I have. (Although it didn't sound like it.)

I the waterstones I get from Shapton are 'ceramic' and like Micheal said are consistent grit thru out.

So, I should have qualified my original post to the 'stick' I have.

If any of you others sand down your sticks let me know if you saw what I did.

J. I'm gonna have to get some of those! At that price it might make a nice 'gift' for people who order knives.

Steve
 
Ceramics can be manufactured to chosen grit sizes. We had an active ceramic lathe-bit research program at VR/Wesson many years ago, and made ceramic finishing bits in a variety of grits. There are also a range of hardnesses available by varying the chemical composition.

It is interesting you mention this, Steve, about grinding it. I have a pair of Crock Stick brand that I took to the grinding belt a couple weeks ago trying to clean up and the belt wouldn't touch them. You are speaking of having used a 3M micron belt, right? Out of curiosity, is this stick of yours bright white, or more of an off-white in color? Thanks.
 
Fitzo,

Good question about color. I was afraid to mention it, because I didn't know if color was significant to the material or only cosmetic.

Mine is bright white.

It left a pretty deep scratch pattern in the edge. So I took to rubbing it down with the 3m Micron belt. It polished up and became smooth. Not smooth like glass. The high spots were gone and polished - not the entire stick. Know what I mean?

I knew Michael uses them to take grit right off belts, so I was suprised when the vendor told me this.

What I have to do - hopefully tonight after I finish a Christmas knife - is work an edge with it now and check with a microscope. Then rough it up, use it, and check with the microscope again.

I'll report back. Especially since my original post might be bad information.

Steve

PS Isn't it true that SC is second only to diamonds (OK there's other stuff, but in our world). So what's the 'active ingredient' in ceramic?
 
"Ceramics" is a chemical "class" term used to describe a variety of compounds including silicon carbide, silicon dioxide, aluminum oxide, etc. there is a whole field of them. Often, they are actually inorganic polymers. I "think" the important characteristic is that they are fire-formed to create the bonding that attaches the crystals to each other, as in "sintering".

Here's an interesting link:

http://www.ceramics.nist.gov/srd/summary/advmatdb.htm

As for the color, I am more intruiged, now. I have been a crock stick "nut" for sharpening since they came out. I found less expensive, softer formulations to be a more off-white color, and those were the ones I could actually get a "bite" on with a belt. they also had a tendency to be rougher, often with aggravating little bunps. The smooth, high-priced, "bright-white" color I have never been able to get back to pristine without the use of diamond paste.

Interesting thread. There are definitely varying qualities of ceramic honing sticks available. Thanks.
 
I meant to try this today but got sidetracked making ugly cutting tools:o

A year or so ago when I was making knives that would get through metal detectors I ground one from a chipped ceramic slip stone I had. It seems that it was pretty much the same grit all the way through....I'll have to dig it out and look at it again.
 
So what's the 'active ingredient' in ceramic?
Click to expand...

The zip-lock sleeve that my old Crock Sticks came in says "alumina ceramic", if that's of any help.

Shalom,
Mark
 
Thanks Mark, what color is it?

To recap: The stick as provided created deep scratches. After rubbing with a 15 micron belt it became very smooth, almost had no effect on the knife. Then I took 320 grit SC paper to it and it did indeed change the scratch pattern it creates on the knife and is more aggressive.

I'm gonna guess it'll be just right, for me, with 600 grit.

So, based on what I learned from you guys and the links, not all ceramic sticks are the same. However, you can 'adjust' the effective grit on the fine ones.

Steve
 
It's a bit off-white. After sanding it looks almost like it has a clear coating over it.

Shalom,
Mark
 
Well I have not been so lucky.
I have three ceramic sticks, one a junker and the other two made by Coors in Montana and 700 and 1200 grit.

Both these have been shortened by an inch and the cut ( with 0.012 thou Diamond cut off saw )

All three seem to my untrained eye to have a different grain structure
and none of them are touched by any of my assorted abrasive belts of papers.

I was rather looking forward to being able to adjust the smoothness as needed.
 
Seems to me we are talking about 3 seperate things.

The Japanese stones like Shaptons, are made of particles, loosely bonded, for want of a better word. When you sharpen on them, they are supposed to break down readily, exposing new material, which will all have the characteristics of the particular grit. Shaptons are hard within the family of this type of stone, and if you rubbed a 600 on the 12000, you would furrow it, but it would still pretty much remain a very fine finishing stone, and the stone would probably break down, long before it ground tracks into the surface of any metal you attacked with it.

Second, we have AC rods and stone. I have some of these which appear to be in different gritps, Smiths sells them, and probably many others. The colour seems dofferent, and someof the older ones I bought wheren't flat. when flattened they still had the same differenciation of grit, however, the white one became very fine/smooth, indicating that:

Third, it may have particle size below the "grit" size, and you can score it to create a finer cutting tool. I got tired cleaning them with soap, or cleanser, and just snooth them with SC paper. to get rid of the galling. I guess it would be imprtant what grit to use in light of the new info.

I'm sure if we alerted the Spyderco guys, they could set up straight.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top