Chakma too soft? Redux

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Just wanted to update the forum on my efforts with hardening and refinishing my GH WWII chakma. Following some suggestions from HI forumites, I put the horn handled GH chakmak in a coffee can of boiling water. After about 2 minutes, the laha had softened enough to separate the blade and handle. I tried this with another (non GH) chakma, boiled the thing for 5 minutes, and it was still rock solid. I'll try boiling that one again, but some more drastic measures may be called for :(

The next step will be to polish and harden the chakma blade. I'm thinking I'll heat in a charcoal fire til it's red hot (I may go to non-magnetic, if I can get the fire that hot) and quenching in olive oil or water. Anyone know if a propane torch will get steel hot enough to harden? Any suggestions in the hardening process would be greatly appreciated.

Patrick
 
I'm watching this little project with great interest. Keep us up to speed on the good, bad and the ugly.

Dan
 
Hey Patrick, If you decide to use charcoal, try and use real charcoal, not the briquettes you buy at the grocery store (those have all kinds of nasty things in them that the steel will absorb). To get a hotter fire try and pipe some air into the fire, you can use an old hair dryer as a blower (on the lowest setting and even then you may need to put some tape over part of the intake) and jury rigged sections of metal pipe directing the air into the fire, preferably from underneath.
I have sucessfully hardened small knives using propane torches, contrary to popular opinion, it is agravating but works. You'd need some fire bricks to make a small enclosure to hold the heat better. I used two torches and heated the blade from both sides to get a more even heat. It can be done with one torch however. You'll reach non-magnetic sooner than you think so check it often with a magnet. When it becomes fully non-magnetic heat it for just a moment longer to regain the heat you lost when you checked it and quench it. I'd go with the olive oil and I'd heat it up to around 130 degrees or so before hand. It sounds like you already have some knowledge of the process so you shouldn't have much problem.
One thing I don't know is whether fire strikers are left in their fully hardened state of if they are tempered somewhat. Fully hardened steel is very brittle, but the strikers obviously have to be hard enough to work.
Hope this helped some! Let us know what happens.

Guy Thomas
 
You might find the information in this article on hardening flintlock frizzens of interest. Obviously, folks who shoot flintlocks are interested in having a striking surface that makes lots of sparks. It does indicate that it is necessary to draw the temper to reduce brittleness, even if you don't follow all of the procedure.
 
Silent:
Thanks for your reply. I wasn't sure if a striker was hardened either, but the article Berkley referenced seems to indicate that they would be. as for using real charcoal, that may be harder. Maybe I need to do a short camping trip and burn some wood!

Berkley:
Thanks for the article. I did a quick read through and the section on tempering loooks pretty good. I'll probably skip the Kasenit surface hardening, but the rest of the process looks pretty straight forward.

Patrick
 
As a quick update I wanted to mention that I read the article Berkley posted the link to, very interesting by the way. I also do not think you would need the case hardening powder. My guess is that the frizzen actually is made from mild steel so it needs to be case hardened to allow the striking face to be hard enough. Your little knife should be high carbon steel (presumably the same steel as the khukuri)and should harden nicely. (I'm a little puzzled though why they aren't as hard as they should be in the first place.)

Guy Thomas
 
Yes, this chakma hardening info is excellent, but also a real drag that we're even having this conversation at all. Who wouldn't cheerfully give a couple of extra bucks to have both accessories fully functional from the beginning?

Unfortunately, I'm at a loss to dig up a good excuse for why the karda isn't as harder than nails also. Am I the only one out there who has taken a file to one?

I feel that Gurkha and Khukuri houses have nothing to lose and everything to gain by addressing this sleeping, but serious quality control issue.

I for one would be willing to buy all new chakma and karda for my khukuris if GH would start getting them, and good ones would come with all future khukuris.

Will somebody please tell me: What's the sense in putting crappy tires on a Hummer or Land Rover?!

Sorry to be showing my butt here, but it's really getting chapped!!!

Dan
 
I'm right there with ya, Dan. I believe that Johan has chimed in on this one as well. I'd be happy to pay a bit more for harder K&C, preferably with larger handles as well. I hope this is an issue Craig will call Lalit about. In their defense, Folks on the HI forum agree that the Chakma hasn't been functional as a striker/sparker since the bic lighter hit Nepal, and it does function fine as a sharpening steel. Now the Karda, there's no excuse there, IMO.

Patrick
 
as someone who not only wants, but will cheerfully pay for, real chakmaks and kardaths
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There is ample evidence that the bishwakarmas can make good tools if someone wants them. Hello, Craig?
 
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