Chris Reeve Knives - Facts

[Chris Reeve Knives]

"It appears that Les Robertson has found it necessary to make regular posts in which he questions my integrity and the validity of my knives. It is time now to state some facts.

Early in the LDC project, Robertson had a number of the LDC range of Sebenzas black coated. This was contrary to my wishes and the work resulted in the locks of some of the knives not fitting correctly. These knives were sold "as new" even though they had been modified after sale and such modifications void our warranty. (There are all kinds of safety and liability issues involved.) I was obliged to have my attorney send him a letter telling them to stop this activity and to inform them of the liability issues. He has not purchased a knife from us in well over a year although it seems he does trade in the second hand market on our knives.

In posts on the Blade Forum, Robertson has questioned my integrity. I believe he is confusing custom, hand made and sole-authorship knives and is using this to imply that I have been remiss in representing my product. The vast majority of our one piece fixed blade and Sebenza folding knives have never been true custom knives (custom as defined by one man making one knife at a time, under his name). For 15 years, I have had people help me in my shop and Robertson has known this for at least the close to 10 years that I have known him. There have been photographs of some of my staff in my brochure for several years.

I used to finish grind and sharpen every knife that left my shop. I would do most of the final assembly and the final quality control/inspection. I trained my staff to do the preliminary work but I would do all the final work. Four years ago, Scott Cook, came to work for me. Scott is a knife maker in his own right and Robertson has purchased knives from him. Scott quickly adapted to my way of grinding, he contributed many ideas related to how we make the knives and within a year, he was doing all the blade grinding himself. This enabled me to concentrate my energies and talents in other areas to build my business. This collaboration has resulted in the knives consistently improving in quality.

Our knives are, however, by no means production knives as Robertson indicates and we all take exception to his implication that the work is in any way inferior. There is a considerable amount of hand work in our knives, both in the fit and the finish. The blades are ground free hand, one by one. We have no blade grinding machines - only the same kind of belt grinders that the custom makers have. Scott now has three understudies and they are learning to perfect the blade grinding process as well as the other aspects of the whole operation. None of this has never been a secret. Scott and our next most senior person, Bryan Baker, have both been to knife shows with me and have been introduced to customers.

Our doors are open to any person who would like to tour our facility in Boise. We are available on the telephone and at shows. Scott and Bryan will be at the show in Eugene, OR in April; Scott handled the show in Seattle last November and will do so again this year.

We have no secrets at Chris Reeve Knives - just old fashioned elbow grease.

Chris Reeve
Chris Reeve Knives
www.chrisreeve.com"

 

[Les Robertson]

Chris

Obviously you are confused.

Fact: 100 LDC Sebenza type knives were made. Only one was ever coated in black by LDC.

Fact, the one knife that was sold and the subsequent Sebenza's that were sold were done after they were purchased from you.

Fact: each person who requested this coating or bought a knife that was coated was told"
1 This has been done without Chris Reeves approval

2 This does void the warranty that Chris sends with each knife.

So a disclaimer was given with each knife.

Fact: with this in mind I told every person who purchased one of these knives that because Chris feels this way, contact me first if there is a problem with the knife. To date I have never been contacted by an owner of a coated Sebenza that I sold.

Fact: only 18 knives total were done by either myself or Bob Neal. Five of those knives are still in stock.

Fact: You posted in the fall of last year in Knifefourms that you had received several of these coated Sebenza's back. No Chris you did not. Please provide me with the names of these individuals and I will contact them to find out what the problem is or was.

Fact: your knives are now considered to be a "benchmade" type item. The fact you no longer do any of the work on these knives is why you were not allowed to display any of the Sebenza's, Umfaan's or fixed blade knives on your table at the United States Knife Makers Guild Show this past July in Las Vegas.

Fact: sole authorship never entered into my discussion of your work. It is true that I have known that you had others helping you on these knives. To include Scott Cook, who is a very fine knifemaker in his own right.

Fact: I have never disputed that the Sebenza was a fine knife. When the Sebenza was listed on my site earlier this year I commented that it was possibly the best utilty folder made.
So no one is questioning your shops ability to turn out a quality product.

Fact: My problem with you Chris is that you do not understand the fact that once you sell the knife, you no longer own it. Therefore, you no longer have the right to tell anyone what to do with the knife. You do have the option to not sell me any more knives, which you did not execise (For the record, myself and Bob Neal stopped buying knives from you).
You also have the option to not do any work on the knife if it is returned to you with a voided warranty or to charge for any work that is done. YOU DO NOT HAVE THE RIGHT TO TELL PEOPLE WHAT TO DO WITH A KNIFE AFTER YOU HAVE TAKEN THE MONEY!!!!!!

Fact: Integrity is an issue. You did not inform myself or Bob Neal that you had ceased doing any work on your knvies prior to us finding this out at the Guild Show last July.

Chris, because you are such a well known knifmaker it is imperative that when you no longer have anything to do with the making of a knife, you inform the buying public immediatley.

It would appear at this time that you are no longer a custom knife maker and your knives are no longer (in any way shape or form) made by you. This is not to say that you will not maker knives in the future. Im sure as do I, that others hope you come out with new custom knives. As you are a very talented knife maker.

Chris, as you stated to both Bob and I friend ship is friendship, but Business is Business.

You were so right, this is why we stopped doing business with you. Additionally, we feel compelled to let potential custom knife buyers, that your knives are now of the non-custom variety. The facts are the facts.



------------------
Les Robertson
Robertson's Custom Cutlery
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com


[This message has been edited by Les Robertson (edited 11 January 1999).]

 

[Les Robertson]

Chris,

A couple more points of clarity to help unconfuse you.

Fact: I do not buy knives from you, nor (as you imply) do I sell them in the aftermarket.
I was doing a favor for a person and took on consignment what I thought was a handmade Sebenza. Unfortunatley, it was P6 (P for production). This knife was sold to a collector for $250.00.

Fact: The remaining knives I do have of yours , I am selling for 15% off of your retail as to move them as quickly as possible. I was chastized by others on this forum that I did in fact carry factory knives, yours!

Also, other fourm members need not comment on this either way. Chris will be allowed a rebuttal and then the thread will be closed.

I dont want to get in trouble from the moderator!

------------------
Les Robertson
Robertson's Custom Cutlery
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com

 

[Spark]

BladeForums.com was created to encourage the free flow of knife information to the various aspects of the knife industry.

As such, from time to time, controversial information and topics arise.

We want to do our best to have the correct, honest information being spread, and to that end we welcome all discussions as long as they are conducted in a rational and calm manner.

Chris Reeves, or any of his representatives will always be welcome here to share their information, knowledge, or opinions.

This post is simply a statement that we expect *everyone* to follow the established guidelines.

Spark

------------------
Kevin Jon Schlossberg
SysOp and Administrator for BladeForums.com

Insert witty quip here

 

[Mike Turber]

My only rule to allow this thread to continue is no personal attacks. The open exchange is welcome and anyone is more than welcome to defend their stance on this issue. Just keep it clean.

My personal stance on the issue is simple. If it is not a custom knife, Les has the right to limit the discussion in here to the subject that this forum is intended to discuss. Should you wish to discuss other knives feel free to post in the general forum. There is however some confusion over the definition of what constitutes a custom knife.

My thoughts are this:
A custom knife is one which all work, other than some particulars like laser cutting, screws and minor stuff, is done by the person who puts their name on the knife. Now how much work is to be done is up for debate but if none of the work is done, then IMHO, the knife is not custom.

I liken Chris Reeve knives to that of Microtech and others who have gone on to using machinery and other labor to fashion knives. This is not to imply the work is of any less quality at all. It is just to clarify how one would define the type of knife they are selling. The fact that Chris Reeve knives are of the extreme high quality that they are not only speaks volumes of Chris's ability to make or design a knife, it also says much about his ability to teach others. I only wish I had the time to learn from such a man.

------------------
Best Regards,
Mike Turber
BladeForums Site Owner and Administrator
Do it! Do it right! Do it right NOW!
www.wowinc.com

 

[Kevin Wilkins]

I'm glad to see Chris Reeve personally make a reply to this topic which comes up on these forums pretty often and where Chris seems to take the most heat.

It always has to do with what's a "custom" knife and what's a "production" knife. And because Chris Reeve Knives has employees and Chris makes no secret of this, his knives often get slagged off as " not custom knives." Chris states in his reply, his knives have never really been "custom" knives in the sense of him sitting alone and making every part himself one at a time. So it's not like that has changed.

Mr. Robertson says that Chris doesn't do any work on Chris Reeve Knives! Come on. Chris CREATES the knives. He designed 'em and he's constantly working on improving the product. Traditionally artists and chraftsmen have always maintained a workshop with apprentices and employees who worked under the direction of the Master to produce his designs or artworks. I think it's fair to say no knife leaves Chris' shop without it meeting his approvall and whereon he doesn't take pride. It's also clear Chris stands behind every knife he makes. Period. Chris generously gives credit to his workers. What's wrong with that?

Additionally, Chris isn't the only knifemaker out there who has people working for him or who takes advantage of modern production technology to make a better product at lower price. I've read articles stating Bud Nealy has somebody working for him, I think Mad Dog has employees and these aren't the only ones: what's the problem? If the master stands behind the work, then it's his work. There's hardly a successful artist today - and by that I mean one who derives his / her livelyhood from their artwork - who doesn't have at least one if not more helpers who do everything from mixing paint to actually painting parts of works. One reason for this is that it's just about impossible for one person working along to survive financially and take care of every aspect of creating, making and selling any product. There just aren't that many hours in a day.

Another issue brought up here is the after- sale modification of Chris' knives. Mr. Robertson takes acception to being told what he can modify and what he can't, his line of reasoning being once he's paid for it, he'll do with it what he likes. Well this is fine I guess. He could throw them in the sea if meets his fancy. On the other hand Chris is clearly concerned about what happens to the knives he makes. A lot of work and thought go into the making of a Sebenza and I guess Chris feels he makes the knives the way they are for a reason and if he wanted them coated with something he'd coat 'em himself. That doesn't sound like the concerns of a man who has nothing to do with the knives he sells. I know I'd feel disappointed if someone bought one of my knives and started modifing it. I mean taken to the extreme, you don't buy a Jackson Pollack and say, "I like it but it needed few more drips so I used housepaint added 'em myself." Pollack, if he were still alive, would probobly come round your house an urinate in your front yard.

A further concern is clearly a legal one and I can understand Chris wanting to distance himself legally from a product for which he was no longer responsible.

For me the fact is that Chris Reeve designed one of simpliest, strongest and most elegant locking systems ever developed for a folding knife is already cause for admiration. That he put it into production on a scale over which he can maintain an overview and feed his family is also quite an acomplishment. He didn't take the production overseas. He didn't sell the whole thing to "Big Business" and sit back and count the money. And also don't forget that should Chris find himself without any employees, he's got the skill and experience to sit down and make every part that goes into one of his knives himself. What Chris' employees do, he can do too and has done. I understand why Chris Reeve is proud of his products and of his employees and why he's concerned with what happens with his knives after he sells them. I'd be proud too.

Carry on Chris!

------------------
www.wilkins-knives.com

 

[Les Robertson]

Spark and Mike,

Thanks for posting to try keep things straight.

The reason I said I was going to close the thread after Chris had a chance to reply is keep this from getting personal. Fact is its already personal, so Im trying to keep it professional. I felt it was fair to give Chris a chance to reply to my post. Specifically Id like the names of those who returned the knives I had coated.

The other reason I wanted to limit the posts on this subject so we can move on. I talked to Chris face to face in Las egas this past July, Chris had a post on knifeforum similar
to this last year. I did not respond to it because I had already talked to Chris. Then at the New York Custom Knife Show this past November, my partner in LDC Custom Knives talked to Chris. This conversation ended up with Bob maturely walking away and Chris yelling at him. This yelling was loud enough to stop conversations and turn lots of heads.

As you can see, Bob and I have tried to put this behind us. It appears Chris does not want to. I felt obligated to respond since Chris came into this room and made his post.

Kevin Wilkins:

I did not say that Chris doesnt make his knives CHRIS SAID THIS. To his credit he admitted last July that he did not do any of the work on his knives. The United States Knifemakers Guild agreed with him. Consequently, he was not allowed to display any of the knives in his current catalog.

Yes, we all know that Chris and others have help. The Guild says that is ok, but that the maker has do grind, polish and sharpend the blade and do the final fit and finish.
Chris, by his own admission has not done this for over 18 months. Kevin, dont take my word for it, call Chris.

Kevin, what you are missing is two things.

First, because Chris is so well known he does have an impact on the market. There fore like it or not he is impacting the profession in a negative way when he does not come clean as to exactly who and how everything is being done. Yes, there are others who need to do this as well. This is why I give Chris points for courage, but take them back for lack of integrity. Personal integrity, not anyting to do with the integrity of his knives or the people who work for him.

Second. Because you were not privy to our conversations you really dont know what went on. Only, Chris, Bob and I really do. This is why I have tried to put this behind us. So any comments you have as to what went on between us is moot.

Saftey Issue, probable, but not likely. Give a call to Benchmade, Spyderco, Emerson Knives, Allen Elishewitz, etc. Ask them how many of their black coated knives have failed. Kevin there has been well over 100,000 knives coated with several different types of black coatings. I have yet to hear of a lock faliure that was directly attributed to the coating. If this is truly a concern I have the solution to this problem. Ill let you in on a secret. You take a little piece of sand paper and sand the face of the lock and remove the coating.
Should take less than a minute. So much for the safety issue.

Kevin, legal issues are not a concern either. Do you know why you cannot win a suit brought against either a company or a individual knifemaker if you cut yourself with one of their knives? Because knives are viewed as inherently dangerous items. Consequently, the user assumse a large amount of risk just by using the knife.

Kevin, I salute your admiration and loyalty. Chris is fortunate to have such a customer. The great thing about America is you can have an opinion and express it.

Oh Kevin one more thing, dont let the hero worship go to far. Yes, in fact Chris was working on a deal with Columbia River Knife and Tool to sell them his Sebenza! The deal fell through as according to Chris, they could not meet his standards (or words to that effect, yes this is from Chris's mouth to my ears).

However, I understand he and CRKT are working on some type of deal for the fixed blades. This is not from Chris, just rumor mill.



------------------
Les Robertson
Robertson's Custom Cutlery
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com

 

[Cliff Stamp]

One comment and that is on the modification of knives as that has come up again and again with regards to a number of makers.

It is understandable why no one would want it done. No matter how careful you are to insure that the person buying it knows they are not getting it straight from the maker, the fact remains that misinformation will be spread. For example, if I bought a coated Sebenza from you Les, while I would know the specifics of it, I doubt that I would tell everyone I showed it to the full story, and I know even if I did they would not in the retelling. Chris of course knows that and becuase he has no control over the quality of the work being done he would much prefer the knives to be left exactly as they are as if the work is not up to his specs it could lead to misconceptions about the quality of his work and the Sebenza in general.

However that being said, its not like Chris has any right to tell me what to do with my Sebenza once I own one. If I want to have it coated, reprofiled or even drill holes in it, I will. It is my knife. All he can do is make it clear that all such actions void the warrenty and if he wants to be more extreem stop selling his knives to people who do this.

-Cliff

 

[Kevin Wilkins]

I'd like to make a couple of points to Les Roberstons last post:

I wasn't making any comments on private conversations between Les Roberson and Chris Reeve. I have no knowledge of such conversations. I was commenting on Chris' and Les' posts to this forum.

Mr. Robertson posted to this forum that,
"The fact you ( Chris Reeve) no longer do any of the work on these knives is why you were not allowed to display any of the Sebenza's, Umfaan's or fixed blade knives on your table at the United States Knife Makers Guild Show this past July in Las Vegas."

My point is that I don't think Chris has ever said that he doesn't do any of the work on his knives, in the sense that he has nothing to do with making his knives, which is how I read the above comment.

What Chris has said openly - he states it again in his post here - is that he does not physically and personally make each knife that carries the Chris Reeve trademark. I don't believe Chris Reeve has ever tried to deceive anyone into thinking he sat there in his shop and individually makes every knife. The onetime I meet Chris Reeve last year he talked quite openly about his shop, his employees and how he's able to devote time to improving and refining his products as well as working on new ideas. Where and who has he tried to deceive? I don't see an integrity problem here.

I also have no problem with the Guild's rules. They can make whatever rules the members are happy with. Did Chris try and deceive the Guild in any way?

The legal and the safety issue are one and the same. There are many ways to blacken a knife blade - starting with paint and going on up the line. I can totally understand why Chris Reeve - or almost any other knifemaker - might have a problem with a DEALER making modifications to his / her product. You can sue knife companies - or try to. If you sell Fords the Ford Motor Co. won't like the idea of you puting Honda engines in and selling them. Doesn't mean you can't do though but I can understand Chris taking exception to this.

Regarding the CRKT deal: I don't really know much about it. I've heard the rumor on it though. Maybe Chris can comment further. I doubt if any deal would have included him giving up his US production and I'm certain he wouldn't have represented the Taiwan knives as "Custom."

Hero Worship? I think that's taking it a bit too far. Like I said, I've met Chris Reeve onetime and own one of his fixed bladed knives. That's all. Chris impressed me a man of integrity who spoke honestly and openly about his work and products. And it is certainly true these are human characteristics I admire...

Mr. Robertson, please don't take my comments as an attack on you. You and I have never meet and I mean in no way to impune your honesty or integrity.

------------------
www.wilkins-knives.com

 

Les, Mark et al.,

Regarding "custom knives":

So, Randall made knives are not custom knives? Does it matter that Gary Randall probably doesn't even look at alot of the knives that leave the shop. Alot of people would acknowledge that they are the best known custom knives in the world. Also, was Bo Randall supposed to have let everyone know when HE stopped making the knives himself? He was definitely a well known knifemaker who had an impact on the industry.

Bernie

 

[drshame]

Questioning quality, origins, customer service, and manufactorers representations are good things which will lead to better products, and smarter consumers.

The debate between Les and Chris is clearly between both gentlemen at this point, where it should remain.

I applaud Mike T and Spark for allowing this discussion to remain open to everyone who's interested in contributing.

Discussion is good....cutting-off valid discussion is bad.

On the issue of open-access and a place to discuss common concerns, this website has proven we are all winners!

No Shame on You!

 

[Les Robertson]

Bernie,

You bring home my point on custom knives with more clarity than you know. Did you know that Bo Randall made very few knives after 1939. He was a respected business man with many diversified endeavors. Including a papermill in Michigan, Orange Groves, Cattle and land ventures in Florida.

You are correct that he was a excellent maker and possible the best known in the world in the 40's and 50's. Interstingly enough, he was not involved in the actual day by day production of Randall Knives. Yes, he should have let people know he was no longer involved in the business. But he was Randall Knives and was used to market those knives. Just like Col. Sanders who for years after he sold of KFC was their spokesman. He has been dead for years and now they are using a cartoon Col. Sanders to hype the product. The point to the KFC reference is that it was know that Col. Sanders did not make all the chicken, so no one would have held it against KFC.

The word custom has to stand for something and should not just be bantered around.

I was on Ebay auctions, under custom knives, there were listed Custom Spyderco Jot Khalasa. To my knowledge, Jot designed the knife and Spyderco produced it. This is not a custom knife. They also had in that catagory a custom knife from Case (its not) a Robeson Custom knife (it's not) and a couple others.

My point here is that the flagrant use of the words custom and knife together in the above instances are being used to decieve potential buyers. This borders on fraud.

Chris Reeve is a custom knife maker, the knives currently coming out of his shop are not custom knives. This seperation is determined by the rules of the United States Knifemakers Guild, not Les Robertson.

I buy and sell custom knives because it has been my passion for over 15 years. I am not trying to appoint myself as the Vanguard for custom knives. However, someone has to speak out and hold people accountable. I understand this is not fashionable in our PC world right now. The sign I say every day during my Infantry trainig at FT. Benning read, Lead, Follow or get the Hell out of the way. So I do!

I view custom knives as investments. When something costs as much as they do, you have invested, more so than just spent your money. Most people would count one of the reasons they buy custom knives includes "pride in ownership". Also, many buy a particular knife because of the individual who makes it. This adds to the value of the knife in the future. However, if years down the road we come to find out that the maker, in fact did not make the knife, this negatively affects the value of the knife. It also has a negative affects that person's view of custom knives in general. This is a unwanted side affect. This causes doubt in a potential customer/investor/collectors mind and perhaps keeps them from purchasing a knife and entering into the custom knife realm. Now you know what I think about when Im sitting on the plane going to and from custom knife shows!




------------------
Les Robertson
Robertson's Custom Cutlery
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com

 

[DC]

A lot of the posts in this and other threads show exactly why Latin and Greek are used in science. To whit...definitions are immutable.

Unfortunately, in these days the same can't be said about English. Think about it

 

[dano]

There have been some good points in this thread...and i'd add the following:

firstly, It hasn't happened, yet, but has in the firearm industry: large class action civil torts against manufacturers. Ask Beretta, Winchester Ammunition, U.S.A. magazines and a whole lot of others who are being sued because they make items which can cause harm. It's completely illogical, of course,but I can see the day when a boy cuts himself, and the knife manufacturer is on the wrong end of a lawsuit because the knife was too sharp...

Are Chris Reeve Knives "Custom"? that depends...personally, I would say no. I would define custom as an article which is unique, or as Webster's Dictionary says: "made to order"...in that case, unless a knife is a unique, one of a kind example, it's not "custom"...maybe a better word should be "handmade" ?

--dan

[This message has been edited by dano (edited 14 January 1999).]

 

[Cobalt]

Ok, here are my definitions, wether incorrect or not.

Custom knife maker- One or two people who make knives by their own hand with even the same models being slightly different. Changes can be easily made to suit the customer prior to work being finished.

High quality production knife producers--This is were most of the good manufacturers fall into, such as Benchmade, Spyderco,EDI, etc., with Microtech and Chriss Reeve knives at the very top of this list.

Mass production knife producers--These are the super quantity manufacturers such as Buck, Gerber, Case, etc. Yes, sometimes these companies will produce limited production runs, such as Gerber does every so often. These limited runs may fall into the high quality production knife definition, but for the most part the producer is still a mass production company.

Cheap-ass knife producers--These are the knives made in taiwan and china that have absolutely no quality control and knife life expectancy of 1 month under hard use.

Obviously Reeves knives are at the top of the production knife world and have quality as good as any custom without the super high price tag.

These were just my interpretations of knife maker heriarchy.

 

[Doug Mason]

I saw the infamous "black" Sebenza on Les' web site a while back and when I asked him via email his first reply was to state clearly that these knives are coated without the blessing of Chris and that the usual warranty on the knives would not avail due to the post-sale coatings.

I thought that was honest and clear. I also sent a message to Anne Reeve asking if they had used coatings on the Sebenzas like the ones I had seen via Les.

They (Anne and Chris) were quite clear that do not endorse the coatings in any way shape or form. While I agree that you should be able to spray your Sebenza with Krylon, I can see where they are coming from on the subject.

Even though you own the knife, anyone that handles it doesn't see it as "Doug Mason's Knife", they see it as a "Chris Reeve Sebenza".

If the aftermarket coatings (or Krylon for that matter, in bright green) cause the fit and finish to be sloppy and stickey, that person walks away thinking "what a piece of crap". Chris is remembered by that person as making a knife that is anything but smooth.

For the record, I've bought a $750 knife from Les and was happy with the service and was given exactly what he claimed it to be.

I own all of the Sebenzas including a Damascus one, as well as a few of the fixed blades.

When I bought them I didn't think of them as "custom" knives, I thought of them more as "very well made low production knives" -- not production in the sense of Cold Steel, assembly lines and Asian sweat shops, but production in the sense that it was a combination of hand work and machine work to product a product I really enjoy.

Although I was never lead to think anything else, I was somewhat saddened to hear that Chris doesn't do any work on the knives. I had thought that maybe it was his personal final grind on the blade. I was never told this, I guess I was never told otherwise and just figured that he was the one that did it. It doesn't cheapen the value of the knife, it just takes away a tad of alure.

Ah well.

--Doug

 

[Jim Smyth]

I own a Large Black bladed Sebenza. I bought it because it appealed to me. I would like to say that it functions perfectly, a testament to the fine knives that Chris puts out. I would like to say that I didn't buy it from Les and was never told when I bought it that any warranty would be voided since it had the coating on it. (not Les's fault) The coating started wearing after a month or so and even though it still looks pretty good I wish I had bought the Reeves standard finish Sebenza. I would be willing to pay to have it restored (if possible)if Chris Reeves knives would be willing to do it. Thanks!

 

[bruce]

Mr. Robertson, the claims you made about Bo Randall are not substantiated by information contained in the book, "Randall Made Knives--The History of the Man and the Blades" by Robert L. Gaddis. Gaddis claims the information in his book came from the Randall family, employees, and shop records--in addition to the fact that he had a relationship with the Randalls. From my reading, you have Bo leaving the shop a little too early in his lifetime. The statement comparing his influence on Randall Made Knives to COL Sanders seems flippant.

 

[Les Robertson]

CJ

First, let me thank you for pointing out to all those involved in this and other forums that others besides myself were selling black Sebenza's. A fact Reeve had not considered until my LDC Partner Bob Neal pointed this out to him.

I am a little confused though. Reeve claims these coatings foul up and keep his knives from operating properly because of his close tolerances (which they are). So how can this knife work perfectly???? Could it be as Chris was told that the coating is only 5 microns thick and therefore would have no affect on his tolerances. Which as you state and is obvious to all involved in this skit, that Reeve has incredible tolerances. The best found in any factory.

Also, CJ if Reeve wont bead blast the knife, send it to me and Ill have it taken care of for you. Any knifemaker can bead blast the black finish off and put the blade in a tumbler with silicon glass beads (thats what creates the "stonewash" finish).

Let me know CJ.

Also Bruce,

Dont get down on the Col. Sanders to much. He, like Bo Randall was the leader of his respective field. Col. Sanders is responsible for the fast food market. He was doing it long before Ray Kroc or Dave Thomas.

Much Like Bo was doing it way before Loveless and Moran.

Both men had the respect and admiration of both their peers and their customers.

Ok, maybe 1939 was a little early. Hell, Ill give you to 1949. He still was a little slow in letting his customers know he wasnt making the knives!

Bo, did great and wonderful things for Custom Knives. As with Scagel, Loveless, Moran, Stone, Bone, Sequine, Herron and other industry leaders. We owe all these gentlemen and their families a debt of gratitude



------------------
Les Robertson
Robertson's Custom Cutlery
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com

 

[bruce]

Les, just for the record, I am not down on COL Sanders. In fact I am well acquainted with his story, KFC's operations, as well as Ray Kroc's and Dave Thomas'. I have done business in their headquarters. I own stock in McDonald's and work for a supplier of a "major" product to all three. Does the phrase "What would you like with your fries?" ring a bell. Besides, I have purchased a number of Randalls--about 20 I think--some from the shop itself, done the museum tour and talked to Gary. Now that you are suitably impressed with my credentials, I would like to throw out my opinion. I am not a mover and shaker in the knife world. Not even a collector, just an admirer. I just want that one, and that one, and that one. I'm a user--former meat cutter, current sportsman, and a military man. I may have to go to Bosnia in the near future and I can tell you one thing! If I can only take one folding knife--it would be my Sebenza! And it isn't the only folder I own. Custom, semi-custom, limited factory, make up your own term for it--it is the "gold standard" and Chris ensures it stays that way. Thanks for listening and be assured that this is way more fun than talking about impeachment!