Cinquedea tang?

PocketKnifeJimmy

PocketKnifeJimmy

Joined
Aug 4, 2013
Messages
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So, I have wondered about the construction of Cold Steel's Cinquedea tang. I was hoping to find a picture of one of these knife's handles disassembled to see how exactly it's done. I have heard it has a threaded end and that the exposed little knob at the end is the retaining nut, but nothing beats a visual, (a pic), of these components disassembled to really grasp how the tang assembly is on this knife.
I imagine if there is no gluing involved during it's construction, then there is likely a good chance that someone has taken one apart to see what's all under that handle, not only for curiosity' sake, but maybe for an inspection to see if any corrosion is found under that handle to be cleaned up prior to reassembly, (rust not being unheard of on brand new carbon steel knives imported from India).
Anyhow, if someone here has in fact disassembled their own specimen, I would love to know your thoughts on what you found under there.
Much thanks in advance :)
 
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if I'm reading right, you're saying you think its setup like a randall model 1? tang wise I mean?
 
I have only read one statement from a person posting about his CS Cinquedea... He mentioned that the end piece after the pommel, was a nut that held the entire assembly together. I do know that would not be something unheard of in knife making, and that some Randall knives use that method as well. But, as to what the Cinquedea's bare tang actually looks like, (and innards of the pommel and wood handle look like), I don't know, since no pictures were shared of the disassembled knife.
Hoping somebody here pops up that has done just that, disassemble their own and maybe share a glimpse of what it all looks like in it's naked disassembled form :)
 
The Cinquedea [Ching-kwi-dey-uh] has held a long fascination for us here at Cold Steel. It gained popularity as the sidearm of choice for noblemen walking through the narrow alleyways and walled cities of Italy. A blade worn exclusively for civilian self-defense, it was essentially the precursor to the civilian side sword and the rapier and yet, this instrument of personal protection seems to have owed much of its design to fashion as it did to the cut and thrust of mortal combat! Surviving examples of these unusual short handled and steeply tapered blades are often highly embellished and ornate. With etched or gilded blades and deep multiple fullers that border on jewelry rather than weaponry but beneath the romanticisms of high renaissance fashion lay a tool made with purpose. A wide, stiff cut and thrust blade that could be brought into play in confined spaces, and deliver a mortal wound! Our interpretation of the Cinquedea is made from expertly heat treated 1055 Carbon steel with a highly engraved guard and pommel, and a hand-carved rosewood grip. The Cinquedea is sold complete with a leather scabbard with engraved steel throat and chape.
Weight:

28.7oz

Blade Length:

14-1/2"

Blade Steel:

1065 Carbon

Handle Length/Material:

6"

Overall Length:

20-1/2"

Additional Features:

Leather Scabbard with Engraved Steel Fittings


 
The Cinquedea seems universally out of stock at the online vendors I usually look to for purchasing Cold Steel items. So, I am hoping to get some good input from current owners on how they like their specimens.
Reviews are out there, but the disassembled handle pics would be the one thing that I would love to see being shared in some photos. One thing that the one review I read about the Cinquedea and him having dissembled it, was that there was some rust on some of the internal areas of the blade handle. He mentioned the pommel being hollow, having a collet over the end of the tang that slid into the hollow pommel. It was a review that would have benefited from having some photos of what he was describing.
What is said about pictures?... That they are worth a thousand words. The visuals would have really helped in his description of his findings.
I have been scouring the web for such pics... Nothing yet. But, I feel somebody out there has these pics in hand and will be willing to share them :)
 
From the HEMA gurus I follow the general feeling is these were primarily designed as a high status fashion accessory with little practical value.

I was once extremely fascinated by their aesthetic and the intricate art work found on many.
 
I went searching for that review where the person described what he encountered with his Cold Steel Cinquedea.

Here is most of it...

"it's blade though sharp begins with 1 inch of a tang for the 1st 1/4 inch then abruptly is cut down to 5/8's inch and immediately begins to narrow for about 3 3/4 inches down to just a 1/4 inch that then proceeds for another 1 1/2 to 1 5/8 inches ending with 1/2 inch protruding from the handle. This handle ending has a 1/2 long X 5/8 inch sleeve which slides into a hollow and fully contaminated with rust pommel ( Being hollow it ads not nearly enough counterbalance).
When first examining this knife, mine was completely cockeyed with the guard and after just a couple of tries I was able to align the blade with the guard which had given me reason to remove the pommel in the first place to do so giving me all the evidence I needed to quote the aforementioned figures. Though you must take care to use the scabbard (Which had a fully covered in rust along the top edge of the bottom metal toe) as I had as at least the scabbard seems otherwise well made and a nice tight firm fit for this Dagger or something else that will allow a decent firm hold on the fairly but not razor sharp blade if yours also needs adjusting or if you can replace Pommel as I am looking forward to doing with one that is solid even if different in shape and heavy enough to move the counter ballance from over 1 1/2 inches in front of the deepest curve of the guard to somewhere in the curve of the guard or the center of the 5/16 inch in length which tapers to about 1/8 inch at the end of each side of its 5 inches X 2 cm. The last inch of the blade is not sharp at all and is about 3 1/2 inch wide at its widest point where there is about 1/8 inch in each direction around it of space that is free of touching the guard. this guards endpoints that look solid are only about 5/8 inches in length but just may be solid but could also be slightly hollow, I have no way of confirming nor denying this but by a finger click it at times sounds just a little bit of a hollow.
I would not use this Dagger in any way that I would use my Randall #12-11 Smithsonian Bowie Knife though this Cinquedea is 3.5 in longer bladed it would most likely shatter the blade or break the guard if it ever countered a sturdier blade, especially if using alone or even as a second blade instead of a shield if you were in an actual fight.
This dagger may be good as protection in scaring off would be attackers that are not armed with anything of fighting quality or for a most definite kill if shoved fully through an abdomen with such width & length of it's blade if you got close enough to use before being countered.
I will attest that the (I believe is not supposed to be leather covered, as CS Italian and bastard hand and half Sword and Dagger) but am not sure just what if a light wood studded with little metal. I do know it is split in 2 pieces at the center ring & the grip feels nice in my hand, but as I have not hit it against anything I can not attest to how well it will feel upon impact with another object."

If the person would have included photos of what he was describing, it would have really helped in getting a better "picture" of what he was describing.
 
I realize this is an old thread, but I'm posting this for posterity, as the vast majority of people on sword forums are bereft of a solid grounding in the history of these kinds of weapons, a solid grounding in combat experience with these weapons and their likeness, or both. The cinquedea is a viable weapon for civilian defense or war, and I'll tell you why.

The cinquedea has the same size and proportions as the Greek xiphe, which was used effectively in warfare for an extended period. The Spartans in particular, who were among the very best warriors, preferred the shorter of these kinds of blades, and there is a very good reason for that. When engaged in combat at war, you are required to remove the enemy as quickly as possible, and repeat these actions as long as required. This required endurance, and therefore you could not afford to waste time or energy on strikes or other movements that accomplish nothing. These strikes are very common today in movies and even surviving 'modernized' martial arts.

Historic example:

Firstly, if you are not within arm's reach of an enemy, they you shouldn't be using a sword, you'd employ the much more effective spear. However when in an enclosed space, or in the press of melee caused by the need to drive the enemy or stand ground, you will be at very close quarters. You won't have the space to employ a long weapon, or even the time to draw it.

In war, you invariably faced opponents with shields, because they were the best defensive equipment you could have. Getting past a shield quickly requires a short blade that can get around or inside this defense. A xiphe with a blade in the range of 12-14" is very fast, and unlike longer blades, is less likely to bend or break when warded by something solid. The xiphe was very broad bladed not to cause a wider puncture wound as some have speculated, but to carry the kinetic energy required to deliver a cut or thrust that could remove a limb, or pass deeply enough into the body to kill. Anyone who has fought melee with shields will eventually realize the advantage of a short, heavy weapon. The Romans used the gladius for exactly the same reasons.

The CS cinquedea is a good and viable weapon. Consider the above facts with regard to your expected engagement. Far too many people nowadays are selecting hand weapons for impractical, misinformed, or fanciful reasons, and if they ever have to use them, will likely die as a consequence.
 
Fauld said:
I realize this is an old thread, but I'm posting this for posterity, as the vast majority of people on sword forums are bereft of a solid grounding in the history of these kinds of weapons, a solid grounding in combat experience with these weapons and their likeness, or both. The cinquedea is a viable weapon for civilian defense or war, and I'll tell you why.

The cinquedea has the same size and proportions as the Greek xiphe, which was used effectively in warfare for an extended period. The Spartans in particular, who were among the very best warriors, preferred the shorter of these kinds of blades, and there is a very good reason for that. When engaged in combat at war, you are required to remove the enemy as quickly as possible, and repeat these actions as long as required. This required endurance, and therefore you could not afford to waste time or energy on strikes or other movements that accomplish nothing. These strikes are very common today in movies and even surviving 'modernized' martial arts.

Historic example:

Firstly, if you are not within arm's reach of an enemy, they you shouldn't be using a sword, you'd employ the much more effective spear. However when in an enclosed space, or in the press of melee caused by the need to drive the enemy or stand ground, you will be at very close quarters. You won't have the space to employ a long weapon, or even the time to draw it.

In war, you invariably faced opponents with shields, because they were the best defensive equipment you could have. Getting past a shield quickly requires a short blade that can get around or inside this defense. A xiphe with a blade in the range of 12-14" is very fast, and unlike longer blades, is less likely to bend or break when warded by something solid. The xiphe was very broad bladed not to cause a wider puncture wound as some have speculated, but to carry the kinetic energy required to deliver a cut or thrust that could remove a limb, or pass deeply enough into the body to kill. Anyone who has fought melee with shields will eventually realize the advantage of a short, heavy weapon. The Romans used the gladius for exactly the same reasons.

The CS cinquedea is a good and viable weapon. Consider the above facts with regard to your expected engagement. Far too many people nowadays are selecting hand weapons for impractical, misinformed, or fanciful reasons, and if they ever have to use them, will likely die as a consequence.
Click to expand...
Thanks for tips, I will remember this next time I am in a melee to drive back an opposing army and I have to kill as many as possible and need the endurance to keep doing so.

Everyone should bookmark this and read it just prior to you next melee against an attacking army armed with spears, swords and shields, most likely to occur approximately...... never.

To think those dumb asses at the Pentagon are sending tanks and air defence systems to Ukraine instead of short thick swords.
 
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