Cleaver as an improvised guillotine?

K

kaizo

Joined
Oct 17, 2014
Messages
798
Hi everyone quick question. Has anybody tried using a cleaver as an improvised leather guillotine? I'm currently looking for a better way of cutting stacks of leather. Right now a rotary cutter is doing the job one layer at a time. But I think the edges might look a bit more uniform if I cut them in one cut...

I haven't used round knives before but would this be a better tool for the job?

Thabks for your help everyone :)
 
Stop!…..before you screw up a bunch of good leather. The thickness of a cleaver blade is not right for cutting leather or any precision cut. Your best best is to buy a clicker or obtain the services os someone who does have a clicker.

Cutting many multiple layers of leather with any knife is not a good idea. It takes increasing pressure to make the cut, and as pressure increases accuracy decreases.

Paul
 
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No, no. Work with leather closely, it requires precision. What you propose to do will produce a lot of wasted leather. Use a sharp leather knife along with copious amounts of time and patience, the end result will be the judge.
 
It sounds like your trying to even up your sheath edges correct?

Your best bet is to cut each layer as accurately as possible, then use sandpaper, or if you have a powered sander even better.

Many years ago I finally broke down and bought a disk/belt sander from Lowe's, best hundred bucks I ever spent. My sheath edges went from mediocre to nice 90 degree angles and so much smoother. Sanding by hand can be a trial in patience and strength, but very rewarding when it comes out well.
 
Thank you everyone I think you just saved me a lot of money and potential pain!

Yup right now the edges are slightly angled and I am trying to even those out. I've never tried a clicker and sander so I'll go invest in that.

Thank you everyone :)
 
As Paul mentioned in another thread using a roundknife will give you very square 90degree cuts.
 
Horsewright said:
As Paul mentioned in another thread using a roundknife will give you very square 90degree cuts.
Click to expand...

Ah thanks I must have missed that! I don't really know how to use a roundknife properly... Time for me to do some homework I think!

Thanks for letting me know :)
 
kaizo, a clicker is hyper expensive and the dies to cut the patterns are pretty pricey too, so unless you are doing the same pattern over and over and over, owning a clicker would not be a sensible move. If edges on your sheath patterns is the major concern, then I'd say invest in a round knife and learn to use it. Once you do, you will never go back to a pull cut knife.

Paul
 
I like to leave the bottom side of just about any project over sized:

cEr4dg6.jpg


Then using the top as a guide trim it off with the roundknife. Gets it very square. Just a little sanding and its darn near done, edge and rub and you are.

FmIrBVF.jpg
 
Thanks for the top tip Dave! I was so obsessed about trying to cut all the pieces in the same shape I didn't think about adjusting the bottom layer to the one above.

Thank you Paul after reading a bit up on round knives its something that I definitely need to learn so I think I would buy one. My supplier has one by Al Stohlman so I think I'll get that. That and a bit of elbow grease with the sandpaper (or sander is budget permits). Hopefully that will get me the 90 degree edge I need. :)

BTW to get that crisp edge I'm currently using a metal ruler against my scalpel/rotary cutter but should I stop this and go free hand with the round knife or can I still use my ruler to guide my cuts?

Sorry for the repeated questions.
 
I find it funny how so many people use so many different methods with good results. The only thing I cut an oversize back panel on is belts, it makes life easier there for me. Stitching is my last step before molding, I have edges evened and burnished so that my stitch lines do not vary in distance from the edge if I have to sand a flaw out.

Cutting a front and back panel to same size takes practice and a steady hand, round knife helps a lot with that too. Even with a round knife a lot of times I still use a 6" ruler on straights for patterns as those are the areas I use to line things up when gluing.

If your in a relative hurry for a round knife I'd suggest one from Terry @ knip knives, I've heard mixed reviews about the Stohlman blade but can speak highly of Terry's mini french design. Dave also makes those round knives at a reasonable price but with a longer turn around. The correct answer for me is buy both :)
 
Frugal tip: a good round knife will cost you about the same as a decent disk/belt sander and you get more uses out of that sander to make it worthwhile. Even these guys have a sander on hand, trust me.

Buy your tools in a logical timeline and you'll be happier in the long run.

I'm going to be the stubborn one and say that I've used a Stanley utility knife since the early 90's and been happy even after trying a round knife. I aint going to change anytime soon, I'll probably break down eventually, but not right now. :p

Sharpen those utility blades often and watch how smooth they glide through the leather.

Not a slight on the other fellows, promise, I just dont see a need to fix something that aint broke.
 
Thanks for the advices guys

I'll give my next project a go using the round knife. :)

EDIT: Hi sorry leatherman I just reread your post. I think it's a good idea for me to go with the round knife this time aroubd since I need some experience with it. I'm genuinely thankful for your advice, thank you very much for your help :)
 
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Guys, I want it understood that this post in no way is intended to be confrontational. I hope it oozes brotherly love.

Having said that, I have 10 round knives and I love them all. Many, many years ago my mentor taught me the use of a round knife. He was a Master boot and saddle maker who started in the trade at the elbow of Monroe Veach at the age of 12. (about 80 years ago now, he also taught me the use of the skiving knife and he was the one who made the "chewed by a Beaver" comment about my first attempts at skiving.

There has to be a reason why all, or at least most of the professional leather crafters, use the round knife in one form or another. On occasions they have a genuine need for a pull cut utility knife also, and a dedicated made for the job skiving knife.

I appreciate the idea of frugality and admit there are circumstances beyond control where it MUST be practiced. Thank GOD I am beyond that now late in life. My whole point here is that for each individual there may be a better way to get a high quality job done (not the only way, but a better, more efficient way)…………for me that includes the use of the round knives, and yes I have several pull cut utility knives that I use frequently as well. I do use the round knives exclusively for precision cutting, and I use that custom skiving knife Dave made for me exclusively for skiving. I don't have any of the problems addressed here lately and yes, many years of experience is a factor, but also choosing the most efficient tool for the job is a greater factor. At some point from start to finish I gain some time with less effort than guys using tools made for another job just to "make do". My personal production is really pretty good for a one man shop. (about 1 1/2 sheaths a day average 365 days a year). I bet Dave beats that by a good margin. I'm pretty sure that would not be possible without the right, most efficient tools and equipment.

Any way, as I said in the beginning , this is not a challenge and not to be confrontational, but the cost of my tools, and machinery has amortized many multiple times with a pile left over. If you are happy with what you are using then by all means keep using it!…………..but when you come on this forum and ask a question or ask for advise you might find the "pros" have a different outlook on many things.

Best Regards,

Paul
 
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Paul, I'll agree whole heartily with the sentiment your pushing. When I look for a tool it needs to not only do a job but also make my life easier. When I started all that was on my bench was a box cutter and an exacto. Reluctant to pay big bucks for a quality head knife it was something that kept getting pushed further down the list. Finally I had a friend show me one of the knives I mentioned earlier and my wife bought me a mini french and a trim knife for Christmas. My cutting production went up roughly 60% in any given sitting.

Another good example of me having egg on my face is a strap cutter. I was stubborn and used a straight edge for any strap good which was not only time consuming but also led to waste whenever I'd slip and cut up a belt blank half way through. Broke down and bought one of those $20 wooden jobs and cut 140 1.5" straps the night it arrived. That would have taken me 2-3 evenings (10+ hours) to cut by straight edge with a few causalities along the way.

Same thing with the custom punch that I got made for pancake holsters - went from 10 minutes marking/cutting slots to roughly 60 seconds including the tight edge edger on the back side all for the price of two orders.

For me it boils down to how do you want to spend your time. I want to get the most production per minute working and that requires investing in tools that make my life easier. I'm quite sure people better than me made a living with a lot less.
 
Eaglestroker said:
Paul, I'll agree whole heartily with the sentiment your pushing. When I look for a tool it needs to not only do a job but also make my life easier. When I started all that was on my bench was a box cutter and an exacto. Reluctant to pay big bucks for a quality head knife it was something that kept getting pushed further down the list. Finally I had a friend show me one of the knives I mentioned earlier and my wife bought me a mini french and a trim knife for Christmas. My cutting production went up roughly 60% in any given sitting.

Another good example of me having egg on my face is a strap cutter. I was stubborn and used a straight edge for any strap good which was not only time consuming but also led to waste whenever I'd slip and cut up a belt blank half way through. Broke down and bought one of those $20 wooden jobs and cut 140 1.5" straps the night it arrived. That would have taken me 2-3 evenings (10+ hours) to cut by straight edge with a few causalities along the way.

Same thing with the custom punch that I got made for pancake holsters - went from 10 minutes marking/cutting slots to roughly 60 seconds including the tight edge edger on the back side all for the price of two orders.

For me it boils down to how do you want to spend your time. I want to get the most production per minute working and that requires investing in tools that make my life easier. I'm quite sure people better than me made a living with a lot less.
Click to expand...

sheathmaker said:
Guys, I want it understood that this post in no way is intended to be confrontational. I hope it oozes brotherly love.

Having said that, I have 10 round knives and I love them all. Many, many years ago my mentor taught me the use of a round knife. He was a Master boot and saddle maker who started in the trade at the elbow of Monroe Veach at the age of 12. (about 80 years ago now, he also taught me the use of the skiving knife and he was the one who made the "chewed by a Beaver" comment about my first attempts at skiving.

There has to be a reason why all, or at least most of the professional leather crafters, use the round knife in one form or another. On occasions they have a genuine need for a pull cut utility knife also, and a dedicated made for the job skiving knife.

I appreciate the idea of frugality and admit there are circumstances beyond control where it MUST be practiced. Thank GOD I am beyond that now late in life. My whole point here is that for each individual there may be a better way to get a high quality job done (not the only way, but a better, more efficient way)…………for me that includes the use of the round knives, and yes I have several pull cut utility knives that I use frequently as well. I do use the round knives exclusively for precision cutting, and I use that custom skiving knife Dave made for me exclusively for skiving. I don't have any of the problems addressed here lately and yes, many years of experience is a factor, but also choosing the most efficient tool for the job is a greater factor. At some point from start to finish I gain some time with less effort than guys using tools made for another job just to "make do". My personal production is really pretty good for a one man shop. (about 1 1/2 sheaths a day average 365 days a year). I bet Dave beats that by a good margin. I'm pretty sure that would not be possible without the right, most efficient tools and equipment.

Any way, as I said in the beginning , this is not a challenge and not to be confrontational, but the cost of my tools, and machinery has amortized many multiple times with a pile left over. If you are happy with what you are using then by all means keep using it!…………..but when you come on this forum and ask a question or ask for advise you might find the "pros" have a different outlook on many things.

Best Regards,

Paul
Click to expand...

Awesome advice, I had been thinking of up-grading for my small amount of leather work.

I was reluctant to get my first expensive Maul at first but after reading the advice of the professionals here it really helps. I love my Maul now :)

Thank you for the info.

Much respect and admiration from the kydex bender
 
Pauls right as usual and I'm done.

Spend that money and get the best of the best tools and machines and have at it, because I've had it.

I'll continue in my caveman way and be happier for it. I do everything the wrong way, and you know what? I like it and will keep it up in spite of it all.

More time in the shop instead of writing helps and tutorials, its a good thing. See yall around the net. :)
 
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