Cold Steel Trail Master

[Hombre]

It all started with this one... Bought in Japan 1987...

Best,
Stefan
Sweden

 

[Hombre]

Then I found this one...

 

[The Whip]

Awesome, Stefan, and both are in such perfect condition! It's very interesting to me that your Gen 1 Trail Master, purchased in Japan in its first year of production, was the American-made model. It really does raise the question of when the Japan-made Carbon V Trail Masters (which also had Gen 1 blades) were manufactured. K KenHash , can your knowledgable contacts offer any insights about that Seki Trail Master?

Thanks for sharing the great photos!


-Steve

 

[KenHash]

Awesome, Stephan, and both are in such perfect condition! It's very interesting to me that your Gen 1 Trail Master, purchased in Japan in its first year of production, was the American-made model. It really does raise the question of when the Japan-made Carbon V Trail Masters (which also had Gen 1 blades) were manufactured. K KenHash , can your knowledgable contacts offer any insights about that Seki Trail Master?

Thanks for sharing the great photos!


-Steve

Steve,
Nobody knows for sure but best guess would be G.Sakai. They made all of CS's Seki folders until their production went to Taiwan.
I personally also have my doubts as to whether those TMs were actually the same "Carbon V" as in the Camillus models,
I see two possibilities;
(1) Cold Steel actually arranged to have the carbon steel shipped to Seki to be used for these TMs.
(2) Cold Steel instructed the OEM maker to mark the knives "Carbon V". The most commonly used carbon steel in Japan
at the time for outdoor knives was the SK series.
Today many decades later Knife companies are actually shipping their preferred steel to Seki makers, such as Fallkniven sending Elmax to
Hattori, and Spyderco sending K390 to G.Sakai. But I question whether that would have made sense in the late 1980s.
Ken

 

[Hombre]

Maybe I have to clarify... Sorry for my bad english but both of my Trail Masters are made in the U.S.A but the first one I bought in Japan 1987...
A friend of mine had fun about it because at the same time as I was in Japan he was in the U.S.A and bought a Magnum Tanto made in Japan...
Actually I was looking for the Magnum Tanto in Japan but the seller said they were not allowed to sell the Tanto in Japan but he had this Trail Master instead... They were not allowed to sell the Tanto because the Yakuza had a special technique to fight with the Tanto... True or just a thing he said because he wanted to sell what he had in stock I do not know... Can´t say that I regret myself for buying it...

 

[d762nato]

Now that's funny.

 

[Benjamin Liu]

My family used to be in an exchange student program with a Japanese organization and hosted Japanese students when they were in the US.

One of the students liked the US so much he stayed for his entire high school starting in 1992.

Anyway, he was into martial arts and was at or close to Shodan in Kendo, Iaido, Karate, and Shorinji Kenpo. I also trained in martial arts so we discussed the topic a lot. When looking at my various knives, he said that my CS Tanto (as well as my other tantos) was illegal in Japan since it was a "sword" but my other knives, even longer ones. were legal since they were just knives.

Looking back it was interesting that he did not distinguish between an American and Japanese tanto, though back then the popular straight angled versions of the American tanto were not very common.

Of course he was not a lawyer or in law enforcement so he was not an expert on Japanese laws, and probably knew what he knew about them through what his martial arts instructors told him.

 

[The Whip]

Steve,
Nobody knows for sure but best guess would be G.Sakai. They made all of CS's Seki folders until their production went to Taiwan.
I personally also have my doubts as to whether those TMs were actually the same "Carbon V" as in the Camillus models,
I see two possibilities;
(1) Cold Steel actually arranged to have the carbon steel shipped to Seki to be used for these TMs.
(2) Cold Steel instructed the OEM maker to mark the knives "Carbon V". The most commonly used carbon steel in Japan
at the time for outdoor knives was the SK series.
Today many decades later Knife companies are actually shipping their preferred steel to Seki makers, such as Fallkniven sending Elmax to
Hattori, and Spyderco sending K390 to G.Sakai. But I question whether that would have made sense in the late 1980s.
Ken

Thanks for info, Ken! It would make sense that G.Sakai was the manufacturer of the Seki-made Trail Masters. G.Sakai made the model RG-69 for Rigid Knives back in the late '80s.

Not only was this obviously a Trail Master clone in its design, but it even boasted special "U2X" blade steel. Clearly, the RG-69 was not G.Sakai's first foray into flat-ground, nine-inch-bladed, drop/clip-pointed, heavy-duty American bowie knives with rugged leather sheaths, thick brass oval guards, Kraton handles, and mysteriously unique blade steels!

-Steve

 

[KenHash]

Thanks for info, Ken! It would make sense that G.Sakai was the manufacturer of the Seki-made Trail Masters. G.Sakai made the model RG-69 for Rigid Knives back in the late '80s.

Not only was this obviously a Trail Master clone in its design, but it even boasted special "U2X" blade steel. Clearly, the RG-69 was not G.Sakai's first foray into flat-ground, nine-inch-bladed, drop/clip-pointed, heavy-duty American bowie knives with rugged leather sheaths, thick brass oval guards, Kraton handles, and mysteriously unique blade steels!

-Steve

The same G.Sakai knife was sold as the Blackjack (pre-Bark River Mike Stewart) Teton Bowie.

G.Sakai continued to sell this knife as the HSEK (High Speed Edge Knife).
It went through several iterations, the steel using 400C, SLD and one notable version using SRS15 Powder Steel at a high HRC. They also added wood, micarta and stag handle versions.

G,Sakai also put a Rosewood handle and different guard on it and was sold by Boker.

Spyderco also at one time sold the same knife fitted with a black micarta handle,
Spyderco's relation with G.Sakai of course goes way back and still continues with Spyderco's Seki models like the Endura, etc.

 

[The Whip]

The same G.Sakai knife was sold as the Blackjack (pre-Bark River Mike Stewart) Teton Bowie.

G.Sakai continued to sell this knife as the HSEK (High Speed Edge Knife).
It went through several iterations, the steel using 400C, SLD and one notable version using SRS15 Powder Steel at a high HRC. They also added wood, micarta and stag handle versions.

G,Sakai also put a Rosewood handle and different guard on it and was sold by Boker.

Spyderco also at one time sold the same knife fitted with a black micarta handle,
Spyderco's relation with G.Sakai of course goes way back and still continues with Spyderco's Seki models like the Endura, etc.

My apologies for the delayed response, but work had me away from the computer this week. Thank you for the great history of the G.Sakai bowies, Ken! I had forgotten that the Teton and HSEK knives were identical to the Rigid model. The Boker I don't believe I've seen before, so thanks for sharing it. Interestingly, when I looked it up, I discovered that Boker (also under the Magnum brand) sold a Kraton-handled version of that blade identical to the others.

Regarding the Spyderco, I don't recall that knife at all. I assume it was a G.Sakai-labeled knife from back when Spyderco sold G.Sakai brand knives, as opposed to a Spyderco-marked model. Do you have a photo of one? Is the micarta color the only thing that distinguishes the Spyderco knife from any other? Here's a micarta version of the HSEK, but these handles appear to be dark brown.

-Steve

 

[KenHash]

My family used to be in an exchange student program with a Japanese organization and hosted Japanese students when they were in the US.

One of the students liked the US so much he stayed for his entire high school starting in 1992.

Anyway, he was into martial arts and was at or close to Shodan in Kendo, Iaido, Karate, and Shorinji Kenpo. I also trained in martial arts so we discussed the topic a lot. When looking at my various knives, he said that my CS Tanto (as well as my other tantos) was illegal in Japan since it was a "sword" but my other knives, even longer ones. were legal since they were just knives.

Looking back it was interesting that he did not distinguish between an American and Japanese tanto, though back then the popular straight angled versions of the American tanto were not very common.

Of course he was not a lawyer or in law enforcement so he was not an expert on Japanese laws, and probably knew what he knew about them through what his martial arts instructors told him.

Benjamin,
Your student was misinformed.
The Cold Steel (and other) Tantos have never been classified under Japan's Gun & Sword Law 銃刀法.
The reason is that the law clearly defines a sword as one where the blade can be removed from the handle by pushing out the mekugi. In other words the traditional construction of swords and smaller blades. The Cold Steel tanto falls under a "Knife" category with a "tanto-type blade" because the blade can not be removed from the handle.
Many Japanese are under the misunderstanding that any large bladed knife, tanto style or not, falls under the Gun & Sword Law, which is not correct.
While the term "Tanto" may be used to describe a knife, there is a legal definition under Japanese law.

After the 2008 Akihabara incident, all knives with double edges (daggers) and Tanto-style blades. became illegal to possess in Japan.
Other knives are legal to possess, but carry is strongly restricted to "lawful purpose" conditions.
Ken
.

 

[boring]

Then I found this one...

That one is on my grail list. Thanks for showing

 

[KenHash]

My apologies for the delayed response, but work had me away from the computer this week. Thank you for the great history of the G.Sakai bowies, Ken! I had forgotten that the Teton and HSEK knives were identical to the Rigid model. The Boker I don't believe I've seen before, so thanks for sharing it. Interestingly, when I looked it up, I discovered that Boker (also under the Magnum brand) sold a Kraton-handled version of that blade identical to the others.

Regarding the Spyderco, I don't recall that knife at all. I assume it was a G.Sakai-labeled knife from back when Spyderco sold G.Sakai brand knives, as opposed to a Spyderco-marked model. Do you have a photo of one? Is the micarta color the only thing that distinguishes the Spyderco knife from any other? Here's a micarta version of the HSEK, but these handles appear to be dark brown.

-Steve

Steve,

Thanks for the photos. I never knew Boker sold that in the original handle/guard form.
I have also never found a photo of the precise G.Sakai bowie that was sold by spyderco, Your photo above may well well be it.
I personally had no idea until Sal Glesser himself stated that "we use to sell those, with a micarta handle". He didn';t specify if the knives were simply sold through Spyderco or were actually branded as Spyderco.
Ken

 

[The Whip]

Steve,

Thanks for the photos. I never knew Boker sold that in the original handle/guard form.
I have also never found a photo of the precise G.Sakai bowie that was sold by spyderco, Your photo above may well well be it.
I personally had no idea until Sal Glesser himself stated that "we use to sell those, with a micarta handle". He didn';t specify if the knives were simply sold through Spyderco or were actually branded as Spyderco.
Ken

The Magnum might have been a European release. The only two pictures that I found were both from Germany.

Back around 1989/1990, Spyderco imported G.Sakai knives and sold them through some of the distributors that carried Spyderco's models. I only remember small folders, but clearly Sal offered some fixed blades also. To my knowledge, Spyderco's first (and, for a long time, only) fixed blade was the Moran, which wasn't introduced until 1997. So I don't think any of the G.Sakai models bore the Spyderco name.

-Steve

 

[cbach8tw]

I got a HSEK Bowie from a distributor in the 1990s for a about 100.00 dollars, I thought it was a good bargain for a Bowie when I could not afford the CS TM at the time. Eventually got a second (marked) TM all black made in China, I believe it was Sk 5 steel, it was bulky and heavy and didn’t feel the same as the HSEK in the hand, traded it, still got the HSEK Bowie……..somewhere.