Comments on Buck NXT 1 and general rant

B

Blue Man

Joined
Sep 19, 2001
Messages
73
Hello all...

I was looking for a lightweight knife for hiking and camping and found the Buck NXT-1 on the web. (It's actually being advertised in Backpacking magazine, so I imagine it's an important knife for Buck).

The knife weighed only 2 ounces and seemed relatively large for its weight, which were important selling points.

I chose the Blue handled model with the non-serrated (regular) blade. They only list the Serrated model on the web page, which is something Buck really should fix ---to see the knife go to
http://www.backcountry-equipment.com/knives/k-buck/nxt.html

I received the knife in the mail today. I have a few problems with it. The black Rubber material on top of the blue plastic has fit and finish problems. At one part the rubber is not attached to the plastic properly. At another there is a gash. There are also two scratches which are more minor.

The major problem I have with the knife is it is very dull. It seems far more dull than, for example, a Victorinox Swiss Army knife or a Leatherman Wave blade is out of the box. I don't have any other pocket knives that aren't Swiss army knives to compare to, but it's still obviously way too dull.

So, I guess my first question is did I just get a dull one. Are all Buck knives dull? Just the NXT series?

I also think it is ironic that Buck in its instruction (warranty and registration) page offers to sharpen the knife for $6.95 if I send it in. They also have a three step guide to sharpening the knife, which is obviously geared to beginners but totally and clearly inadequate for beginners. Even if I wanted to sharpen the knife, if I just relied on their instructions there is no way I could properly do it.

These are my major problems with the knife. Although if it is industry standard for knives not to be sharp let me know. Again, I don't have much of a comparison so for all I know the knife can't be sharp because of legal liabilities or something.

The last problem I have is the strong Jesus message in the Warranty & Registration card. As it is italicized it's probably the most prominent part of the three page guide.

It's a quote from John 3:16 --- "For God loved the world so much that He gave his only son; so that anyone who believs in Him shall not perish but have eternal life."

Now I believe a business wants to be religious that's there pregorative, just as it's my prerogative not to do business with them.

But I spent a lot of time on Buck's web page looking at the company. I even read through much of the "about" section before deciding to buy this knife. Chuck does talk about God, in fact much of Chuck's message is the same on the web and in the instructions. Chuck even has John 3:16 at the bottom of his message. But just that, the text "John 3:16." They don't reprint John 3:16 on the web page, you'd have to know it by heart to realize what it meant.

If your going to mention Jesus in your instructions so prominiently, you should also mention Jesus on your web page prominently. In fact, arguably it should be in the advertisement for the knife as well. Give me fair warning for what I'm getting into.

Since it was mail order I'm not sure I'm going to go through the hassle of returning the knife, but I'm definitely not happy.

And I really wanted to like this knife too...

Again, before you attack me, I have no problem with Buck being a religious company. It may mean I don't want to personally buy from them, but that shouldn't offend anyone. What offends me is that they don't have anything on their web page talking about Jesus, nor in their ads (the web page is major, the ads minor). It's only until I've spent my money that I get the Jesus message. I suspect they don't mention Jesus on the web prominently because they don't want to hurt their business.

If Chuck just had his Senior Partner message about God, and completely left out references to Jesus and the John 3:16 quote, I'd personally think the company was sort of cool. I'd still want the rubber to have better fit and finish and the blade to be sharper though.

Thanks and sorry for being so negative...I'm sure Buck is a great company overall...
 
I can't say as I've ever gotten a Buck knife that wasn't outstandingly sharp. One must have slipped through the lines. That or maybe you're not quite used to a larger knife than a SAK. Larger and thicker blades are deceivingly sharp. You might want to try shaving a little hair off your arm to test it. But maybe you got a dud. If you want, I'm positive that Buck will be happy to help you out. Buck has the best customer service around, period.

As for the religious problem you have with Buck........ Whatever floats your boat. I was easily able to discern Buck's deep commitment to God through their web page. I was impressed by Buck's willingness to take a stand on what they firmly belive in, regardless of my own religious views.

Think about this though. Will you investigate the religious preferences of every manufacturer you buy from? I'm betting that you've got plenty of foreign-made goods, made by people of many religions. Gasp..... You may even have an American made product somewhere crafted by a Christian!!!!!
 
Hi Buzzbait...

I'm glad to hear that you've never gotten a dull Buck knife. I'd be very interested to hear from those that have a non-serrated NXT 1 as to how sharp it came. I don't have much experience with pocket knives (I do have a very nice set of Kitchen cutlery and lots of Swiss Army knife experience though...), but I am positive it is dull. I even just pressed my thumb against it with a fair amount of force. Clearly dull.

I think my mistake was buying a knife on the internet without having seen it first. I actually did lots of research on the web, then went to a knife store. I looked at lots of knives, but mainly Sebenzas and Benchmades. I then found the NXT 1 on the internet and decided to buy it without ever seeing it first. Perhaps I built up an expectation that the knife would be better than it was after having seen so many knives that cost 4 to 10x as much.

But still the fit and finish problems and dullness are definitely there.

As for checking out the religious preference of every vendor---I don't care what the religious prefernce of a vendor is. If there religious that's great, if there not that's fine too. I just don't want to be proselytized by someone whose product I'm buying, especially when I don't expect it. (I.e. if I buy a bible I wouldn't be surprised by it--but in this case I was).

I think it's an important difference.

Thanks!
 
check with joe houser, I am sure that he would be willing to help you out if your knife came that dull.
 
Blue,

First off, I am sorry you received a Buck knife that was not sharp. There are definetely benefits to having the knives sharpened by hand but one of the draw backs is that occassionally one gets out that is dull. Regarding the fit and finish of the rubber overmold, I would have to actually see it to determine what happened. In any event, it sounds like it should have been better and is not representative of how these knives are supposed to go out.

On the issue of the message in the box, it is a hard one to win. On the one hand we have folks that applaud us because we don't put the "almighty dollar" above the Almighty. We know we probably loose some business due to that note.
Then on the other hand are the folks that are flat out offeneded by it. I traced the origin of that note back to an original knife box from 1948 in which our founder, Hoyt Buck, had stamped the entire verse of John 3:16. Just as the note today says, God has always helped us out of some pretty tough jams. The Buck family has always been committed to giving God the glory for the success of Buck Knives. To stop doing that would be to turn our backs on Him. I'm sorry it offends you, I really am.
Please send us your knife and we will be glad to make it right for you under warrantee.
Buck Knives
1900 Weld Blvd.
El Cajon, Ca. 92020

Take care,
 
Joe,
That was a kind and considerate response from a kind, considerate man. You constantly show me that Jesus Christ is at work inside you and that your faith is something much more than lip service.
For those who are offended by Buck's invitation to look to their "Senior Partner", I urge you to reconsider. If the Bible is not true, you will have lost nothing to have known about what it says. On the other hand, if God's word is true and you reject it, you have lost everything.
 
I agree totally. I applaud those who take a stand such as this. We should worry as much about our freedom of religion as our freedom to have these beutiful "tools":cool:
Just because those at a company decide to show that they believe shouldn't affect you adversly. If you don't like it just look at it as wasted paper.
 
Yep, we have to worry about all our constitutionally guaranteed freedoms, because there is always someone wanting to take them away. Just remember, when the second amendment is taken away, the rest will soon follow.

From the discription given of the knife, I'm wondering if Blue could have gotten one that was returned to the dealer by another customer. All of the Bucks that I bought new have been very sharp.
 
Thanks for the encouraging words guys. I will print this thread and give it to Chuck, after Blue has had a chance to respond.

Take care,
 
First, Joe, perhaps I should send the knife directly to you. With a bit of luck the serial number can be used to trace back why the knife wasn't perfect. Should I send it to the address below with attention to your name?

I've now had a lot of time to think about John 3:16 --- "For God loved the world so much that He gave his only son; so that anyone who believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life."

The problem is the divisiveness of this scripture. Many evangelicals believe the contrapositive is also true--anyone who does not believe in his only son shall perish, and not have eternal life.

Such thinking has caused or justified many atrocities; certainly, the crusades spring to mind.

I'm sure that Buck can find a piece of scripture that conveys their love of God while not alienating Jewish, Islamic, and maybe even atheistic customers.
 
Blue,
I have to resist the temptation of responding here on the Forum as we are getting off topic here. I would be more than happy to discuss this issue via email though.
On the issue of your knife, yes, please send it to my attention. I would like to show it to our engineers to make sure it is an isolated case.

Take care,
 
Blue

Joe will take care of the knife. The fit questions you had notwithstanding, the edge should have been scarry sharp. That was a mistake on our part and will be corrected at our cost. I am curious on the fit questions you had. There are times when customers do have a higher standard then we do and those issues are the ones that catch my interest to see if we need to make an internal adjustment to our own standards. I want to see if this knife was a mistake or an unacceptable standard that needs to be reestablished.

As to the christian part of your original message, my grandfather was a very religous man of incredible integrity. With him it did not matter if anyone was looking, he did the right thing. He used biblical principles as the procedural foundation of his business. He worked hard but so did a lot of other people. Our business flourished beyond my grandfather's wildest dreams. God had honored this business so much that my father felt led to incorporate a statement giving God the glory for this success. Grandpa wrote that statement that is still included with the knives.

Dad spends 3 months a year traveling the country speaking at men's fellowships and churches and boy scout meetins etc. He has a great story about how we, like knife blades, must be heat treated by trials before we are durable enough to be of any real use to the master. It is a cool story and really makes sense when he tells it.

As to your point on why it is not mentioned on the website...hmmmm I will have to look into that. If it is not mentioned anywhere, it was not left out through a conscious desire to hide God's impact on our business.

All this thread needs now is a good politics discussion and we will have covered all the bases...

Please give us a chance to make good on the NXT. The edges we are capable of are the best in the industry. Edge 2000
 
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