Comparing eras of the 110

Joined
Jul 27, 2015
Messages
4,666
OK, so I'm relatively new to the 110, but one thing I do know is the way collectors compare eras of things made for a long time. In the gun world, for instance, Dan Wesson get compared between the CZ era, Monson, etc... In bikes, Trek bikes from the original Waterloo facility get compared with the different iterations up to the modern materials used today, and the list goes on with every hobby.

So with the 110, is there a particular era when they are considered "as good as they've ever been," or have things been pretty consistent? I know I've heard people speak fondly of the edge retention of the 440C blades. What time were those made?
With the 420HC and Bos heat treat, are they at their peak today? or is fit/finish a little lower to stay price competitive?
 
The best way to learn about the development of the 110 is to read as much as you can about the model history. The way your question is phrased you will get a lot of widely ranging personal opinions about what is or was best. But you will learn a lot more if you collect some of the old knives and do your own research.The developments that happened during the first ten years or so of the 110 are really interesting. It seems there was a lot of trial and error development. If you really look, you will find that there is a lot more than just the different blade steels. Start searching this forum and read the BCCI Newsletters. Have fun.

Bert
 
I can only speak for me and my tastes, others may have a different favorite. To me the 2 dot era with strong frame, semi-hollow ground blade of 440C, solid macassar ebony handles from 1974-79 were some very fine examples of a strong, working knife. Then the 3 dot era knives (1980) with the above features and now a fully hollow ground blade of 440C were some of the top production examples of that time frame. One would have to go all the way to 2010 (30 years later) to the Bass Pro and Cabela's models of a coated blade with cpm-154 or S30V steel (the powdered steels) to best the previous models. But everything else moved forward too. The fit and finish on these are top shelf. DM
 
I guess I didn't really give an answer to your question. My personal preference is the early knives before the 2 dots. (Once again David and I have different opinions.That's good since if we all liked the same thing, life would be a bit boring.) I like the slimmer handle and blade shape of the old 110. Unfortunately, those knives were not as strong as the later versions. The Federal 110 from the 50th anniversary comes close to my ideal of the 110.

Bert
 
I like and have used them all, at one time or another over the years. Like the older slightly slimmer frames, and the slab sided, but the go to are the Alaska guide or BP in S30V and CPM154 for their longer stay sharp. Never had a problem sharpening any of them like some have had. But thats another thread.
Never had any kind of failure on any 110 I have ever used. And I have a box full of old 110's that I have gathered up over the years.
Gotta look up the next local Buck Anon meeting. :rolleyes:
 
I agree with David as for favorite years of the 110s.
That's the period 110 I carried most of my working life.
I save the really old ones for collecting.
Like Bert…I also like the slim 50th anniversary Federal that came out last year.
Like Pack Rat…I like the AG and BP in the steel upgrades.
I'm sure I would agree with most anyone who posts about their 110s…it's reached 50+ years old for a reason. :thumbup:
I carry quite a variety of different 110s, but mostly either an old two dot from the mid to late 1970s that I put sambar stag covers on or a custom slimmed down version with a pocket clip.
Sounds like I like Buck 110s, huh? :)
 
Maybe instead of looking for a "golden era" we should just say that there have been changes, but for any period the 110 has been a great knife and a great value.
 
The 110 is an interesting knife and has a rich history. It is one of the, if not the, most imitated large lockback knives. Boker, Puma, Schrade, and a lot of Chinese junk copies have been made, to name a few. There are many pretenders but only one true 110. Buck has made the 110 in a wide variety of blade materials (440C, BG42, 425, 420HC, S30V, D2 come to mind) and a wide variety of scale materials. A collector could go wild trying to find all the variations. Even with the advent of more "modern" designs, the 110 is still on top of the heap in many ways.
 
Maybe instead of looking for a "golden era" we should just say that there have been changes, but for any period the 110 has been a great knife and a great value.

You make a very valid point. However there is just something about those macassar ebony scales that make me all gushy inside.
 
OK, so I'm relatively new to the 110, but one thing I do know is the way collectors compare eras of things made for a long time. In the gun world, for instance, Dan Wesson get compared between the CZ era, Monson, etc... In bikes, Trek bikes from the original Waterloo facility get compared with the different iterations up to the modern materials used today, and the list goes on with every hobby.

So with the 110, is there a particular era when they are considered "as good as they've ever been," or have things been pretty consistent? I know I've heard people speak fondly of the edge retention of the 440C blades. What time were those made?
With the 420HC and Bos heat treat, are they at their peak today? or is fit/finish a little lower to stay price competitive?

Whoa! I ride a '79 Trek 500 from the old Waterloo barn, so this is a comparison I can sink my teeth into.

I think there are similarities and some big dissimilarities.

I think the thing interesting about the 70's and 80's were the advances in materials and machining that allowed for more automation.

With steel framed bikes, the transition point was with the introduction of manganese alloys like Tange Mangalloy, Ishawata Mangy-X and Valite (Fuji rebranding of Ishawata Mangy-X, by most accounts). This allowed the mass production of brazed steel biked with crude robotics of the day. Prior to that, lightweight tubesets such as Cr-Mg Reynolds 531 and Cr-Mo Columbus SL or Ishiwata 022 needed to be hand brazed to keep the temperatures very low - something that old robotics couldn't pull off. The Mangalloy type tubes could handle the higher brazing temps of the old, crude robotics which meant for the first time in history, a light weight frame could be mass produced. I remember selling Fujis in the very early 80s when the lines started moving to Valite and it was just crazy how good the frames were at a very, very low price point.

I think the transition from 440C to 425Mod and then to 420HC is similar to the cycling industry move to Mangalloy. More correctly, I think the knife industry moved to fine blanking blade forming in the same way that the cycling industry moved to machine produced frames. My understanding (please somebody correct me if I have this wrong) is that 440C was too hard on Buck's fine blanking machinery.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1157650-110-change-from-440C-to-425M


By the 90s robotics got good enough to machine braze cr-mo but by then, the market had moved to other materials entirely. Welded aluminum, then TIG welded titanium and then carbon fiber frames seem to be somewhat the equivalent of the powder steel revolution (e.g. S30V).

Another similarity that I see between the Buck 110 and the early Treks is that both are Americanizations of pre-existing European designs. The geometry of the early Treks was stolen almost directly from the English clubman style bikes (e.g. Raleigh International) and French Spotif and Randoneuring designs (light frame, long wheelbase, lots of rake). In the US it was called a sport-touring design and incidentally was the same design Cannondale used to launch their bike building.

In a similar way, I don't think the Buck 110 design just appeared out of nowhere. The Spanish Navaja and others established the combination of a clip point blade and locking blade and the combination of brass and wood was well established with the French makers like those from Laguiole.


I think there is one important way that the comparison of the Buck 110 and the early Treks doesn't hold up. Nobody rides lugged steel anymore. Well, almost nobody does. In this sense, only the most serious retrogrouch (like me) rides a '79 steel Trek. IIRC, Joe Hauser (from Buck) rides a carbon Trek Madone (or did when we briefly exchanged email on the subject).

In contrast, the Buck 110 has much more long standing appeal to more people.

Trek has sort of kind of brought the sport-touring frame back with the current Domane. I have a colleague who rides one and we compare notes. Each of us defines the "golden age" differently. He loves the carbon fiber. I prefer the old steel.

But on the other hand, I prefer the modern 420HC and Dymondwood version of the 110 compared to my old 2 dot one. No logic to it.

All this to say, you'll have to find your own "golden age" in here somehow.
 
I have four production 110s from years 1987, 1996, 2010, and 2014. That's almost a 30 year span. And from the ones I own it seems like they keep getting better as the years pass.

The 2014 is a 50th anniversary model and has become my favorite. Fit/finish is excellent and little subtle details keep perfecting this blade, like the lockback lever at the butt end on this newer model is rounded out better and fits more flush than in my previous models.
 
Whoa! I ride a '79 Trek 500 from the old Waterloo barn, so this is a comparison I can sink my teeth into.

Haha. In my past life, I was a bike mechanic and collected vintage bikes. But for a couple I can't bare to get rid of, they're mostly gone now. Down to around 7 bikes. The collector's market around vintage bikes is fascinating, as different vintages offer the advances in manufacturing from use of lugged and braised steel frames, to lugged carbon, aluminum, etc... etc... Get into bottom bracket sizes, French threads, and the componentry and it could take a lifetime to figure it all out. Thank G-d Sheldon Brown did it all for us!


Thank you all for the explanation. Apparently, I have a lot of homework to do!!!
 
To me the 2 dot era with strong frame, semi-hollow ground blade of 440C, solid macassar ebony handles from 1974-79 were some very fine examples of a strong, working knife.

I agree with David. Design, fit, finish, and materials all came together during this period.
 
Back
Top