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concealing a camp fire
- Thread starter Will
- Start date
- Joined
- Sep 24, 2005
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- 835
During the day it's the eye and the nose that you deal with.
During the night it's still the eye and the nose.
I've tracked right up to peoples campsites with just my nose.
For cooking during the day,
small, dry wood and built under bushes or trees to spread the smoke.
If the smoke goes along the ground then anybody downwind can sniff you out so pay attention to whats downwind.
At night, build it in a hole or put up a wall to block the light.
On clear nights your smoke can still be seen, and smelled.
Fires for warmth are more difficult to hide, because their bigger and you
keep them burning longer.
Short cooking fires you can cook and move,
overnight fires and repeat fires in the same place
are the ones that'll get you found out.
There are some pretty nifty plans for fires and stoves you can build.
Also, if they have choppers up looking around, their IR will spot your fire right off.
You can use them space blankets to block off some of your bodily heat signature
and they work somewhat with small fires in a directional sense.
Depends on how paranoid you what to be,
and remember, somebody's always watching.
Cook and move.:thumbup:
that's my 3cents
During the night it's still the eye and the nose.
I've tracked right up to peoples campsites with just my nose.
For cooking during the day,
small, dry wood and built under bushes or trees to spread the smoke.
If the smoke goes along the ground then anybody downwind can sniff you out so pay attention to whats downwind.
At night, build it in a hole or put up a wall to block the light.
On clear nights your smoke can still be seen, and smelled.
Fires for warmth are more difficult to hide, because their bigger and you
keep them burning longer.
Short cooking fires you can cook and move,
overnight fires and repeat fires in the same place
are the ones that'll get you found out.
There are some pretty nifty plans for fires and stoves you can build.
Also, if they have choppers up looking around, their IR will spot your fire right off.
You can use them space blankets to block off some of your bodily heat signature
and they work somewhat with small fires in a directional sense.
Depends on how paranoid you what to be,
and remember, somebody's always watching.
Cook and move.:thumbup:
that's my 3cents
If you are being followed or tracked, light a "decoy" fire away from your line of travel. Use damp wood, leaves, evergreen boughes.
Then scoot in your main travel travel direction, make a quick fire for cooking, douse it, bury it, and move on, chop, chop.
Then scoot in your main travel travel direction, make a quick fire for cooking, douse it, bury it, and move on, chop, chop.
- Joined
- Aug 3, 2004
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- 971
If you're just cooking or heating water etc. those hexamine tablets don't seem to have much, if any, smoke and no smell. Those work quickly and burn away to dust. You could make a stove for them with an altoid tin and that way your ash or whatever that junk is that's left, will be concealed and portable until you can get to cleaning it. Or you can just use the stove that comes with it! 
Keep the fire small, and use dry wood. Pay attention to the direction of the wind. Is the wind driving the smoke towards unwanted company? Don't light one if that is the case.
Keep the fire going for only as long as it is needed and smother it with sand and dirt to keep the smoke and steam down. Once the food has been cooked or the water heated put the fire out. A fire no matter how well concealled will draw attention wanted or unwanted.
Keep the fire going for only as long as it is needed and smother it with sand and dirt to keep the smoke and steam down. Once the food has been cooked or the water heated put the fire out. A fire no matter how well concealled will draw attention wanted or unwanted.
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- 3,291
If you really need to have a fire, keep it very small as has already been suggested. No matter how you situate the fire, you will be at the mercy of the wind and other's noses, especially if you are cooking.
If it's just warmth you are after, put on a poncho and lite a candle under the poncho. No light to draw attention and no smoke to speak of and you will stay warm.
If it's just warmth you are after, put on a poncho and lite a candle under the poncho. No light to draw attention and no smoke to speak of and you will stay warm.
- Joined
- Nov 29, 2005
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- 887
In the book _In the Days of Victorio_, which relates the life of an Apache boy growing up during the later stages of the Apache wars with U.S. troops, there are several observations of how the Apaches supposedly did things differently from (and, in the teller's opinion, better than) U.S. troops. If I remember correctly, one observation was that the Anglo-Americans built much larger fires; not a surprise; but the other observation was that the Anglo-Americans suspended their meat at some height over the coals, instead of cooking directly on the coals. It seems to me that if one lays one's meat directly on the coals, one will get a much-more-efficient heat transfer, likely blackening the outside of the meat (and maybe more or less cooking it in the process), in a much-shorter time. Downsides might be charred meat left semi-raw in the middle--but one upside might be that this might make the most of a small, short-lasting fire..
One other idea I've heard of--though I'm skeptical: there is a legend that Greek freedom fighters, during a conflict with the Turks, would wrap their (stolen) lamb meat in paper or something like that, cooking the meat sealed in some kind of barrier, to prevent the escape of telltale smells. (There is a Greek recipe called "arni kleftiko," meaning "thieves' lamb," that supposedly derived from this practice.) Now, again, a fire itself will be hard to mask in terms of smoke and smell--but there may be some way of using the foregoing idea for some added concealment. One thing that comes to mind, for instance, is the possibility of using things like hot rocks, or even coals, instead of fires per se for cooking. For example, if you use a cooking method that involves interspersing rocks with wood before lighting a fire, and then burying the food with hot rocks and coals, you'll have an open fire for a much shorter time than if you're counting on cooking over open flames or coals. One application of this might be, say, if your concern is having your campfire spotted at night by a scout on a mountain 20 miles away. If your meal is wrapped in vegetation and being cooked by hot rocks in a steam-pit by the time the sun goes down, your hypothetical scout is not going to see the flames he'd see if you were flame-broiling the same food on a spit. Similarly, say you used the method of packaging your food with hot rocks (say, inserting heated rocks into the chest cavity of a bird, and then wrapping it), you could end up putting a lot of distance between you and wherever you'd built the fire, by the time you actually started eating. It wouldn't hide the fire, but it would give you the opportunity to minimize the time spent next to it, and it would potentially help in misdirecting pursuers. Also, wouldn't be wrecking your own night vision with live flames or coals during the latter stages of cooking. Just some ideas. Anyone else?
One other idea I've heard of--though I'm skeptical: there is a legend that Greek freedom fighters, during a conflict with the Turks, would wrap their (stolen) lamb meat in paper or something like that, cooking the meat sealed in some kind of barrier, to prevent the escape of telltale smells. (There is a Greek recipe called "arni kleftiko," meaning "thieves' lamb," that supposedly derived from this practice.) Now, again, a fire itself will be hard to mask in terms of smoke and smell--but there may be some way of using the foregoing idea for some added concealment. One thing that comes to mind, for instance, is the possibility of using things like hot rocks, or even coals, instead of fires per se for cooking. For example, if you use a cooking method that involves interspersing rocks with wood before lighting a fire, and then burying the food with hot rocks and coals, you'll have an open fire for a much shorter time than if you're counting on cooking over open flames or coals. One application of this might be, say, if your concern is having your campfire spotted at night by a scout on a mountain 20 miles away. If your meal is wrapped in vegetation and being cooked by hot rocks in a steam-pit by the time the sun goes down, your hypothetical scout is not going to see the flames he'd see if you were flame-broiling the same food on a spit. Similarly, say you used the method of packaging your food with hot rocks (say, inserting heated rocks into the chest cavity of a bird, and then wrapping it), you could end up putting a lot of distance between you and wherever you'd built the fire, by the time you actually started eating. It wouldn't hide the fire, but it would give you the opportunity to minimize the time spent next to it, and it would potentially help in misdirecting pursuers. Also, wouldn't be wrecking your own night vision with live flames or coals during the latter stages of cooking. Just some ideas. Anyone else?
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- Nov 29, 2005
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Also, remember that long after the fire is gone, it can be a lot easier to smell someone who's stood downwind of the smoke.
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- Jun 5, 2006
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Light from fire and smell from smoke cannot be hidden. Period. People huddling around a campfire...and they will...cannot see something or someone 10 feet in back of them.
Old time colonial hunters used to use a trick of "candling" a deer at night, so I've read..they would set up a lighted candle on a stump...the deer would come to it out of curiousity...they would get silhoutted against the candle...a good head shot for the hunter standing back in the woods, in the dark.
One thing wrong with this is wind, a big problem at dusk. At midnight it's not such a problem.
Second problem is, what if the deer comes from another direction so as not to get silhouetted?
So campfires are going to give you away unless you're in a safe area.
Otherwise, make a cold camp.
Old time colonial hunters used to use a trick of "candling" a deer at night, so I've read..they would set up a lighted candle on a stump...the deer would come to it out of curiousity...they would get silhoutted against the candle...a good head shot for the hunter standing back in the woods, in the dark.
One thing wrong with this is wind, a big problem at dusk. At midnight it's not such a problem.
Second problem is, what if the deer comes from another direction so as not to get silhouetted?
So campfires are going to give you away unless you're in a safe area.
Otherwise, make a cold camp.
The thread of camouflage got me thinking about concealment in general, and concealing camp. Fire is the obvious give-away, and I wondered about any standard practices for concealing a campfire.
Will
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- Nov 29, 2005
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- 887
There are plenty of places in this world where what counts as perfectly law-abiding behavior here is considered a capital crime. There are parts of this world where the line between "duly constituted governmental authority" and "war criminals bent on genocide" are vague and in flux--Rwanda, Zimbabwe, Somalia, and the Sudan come quickly to mind, and there's a longer list of other countries where it would surprise nobody if they became that way in short order. One also reads a disconcerting number of stories about Latin American army regulars doing part-time work in the service of drug smugglers and the like--and you know for sure they might have access to some fairly-sophisticated tracking equipment.
Having observed some goings-on in some such countries in recent decades--in some of which I have friends engaged in educational, religious, news, and relief efforts, safari business, etc.--I've thought that if things happened to go sour while I was on a visit (or while friends are living there), it might be handy to know all the escape-and-evasion skills readily available. It's not much of a stretch to imagine, say, Sudanese or Rwandan militias getting ahold of a chopper, and those guys had no problem mowing down innocent civilians. Much more mundanely, every month or two I hear about U.S. law enforcement finding out that some opportunistic drug-dealer has set up shop in some national forest, usually staffing their pot-field/meth-lab/whatever with heavily-armed guards. If highly-funded-and-equipped criminals are out there--and we all know they are--being able to fade into the woods strikes me as a nice option to have up one's sleeve.
Also, any user of the internet has to assume that the public is watching, and that includes whatever law enforcers happen to take an interest. (Wouldn't you?) If I were hiding under a rock immediately after escaping from Alcatraz, I wouldn't log on to BladeForums to ask folks about ideas for escape and evasion. So, though I agree with 2dogs that this forum should not go down the road of assisting people in committing criminal acts, I'm not particularly worried that it's headed that way. If anything, I imagine anybody participating in this forum is, by that fact, being higher-profile than someone who was actually planning a life of crime would like to do. Having nothing to hide, however, I'm not terribly worried.
Having observed some goings-on in some such countries in recent decades--in some of which I have friends engaged in educational, religious, news, and relief efforts, safari business, etc.--I've thought that if things happened to go sour while I was on a visit (or while friends are living there), it might be handy to know all the escape-and-evasion skills readily available. It's not much of a stretch to imagine, say, Sudanese or Rwandan militias getting ahold of a chopper, and those guys had no problem mowing down innocent civilians. Much more mundanely, every month or two I hear about U.S. law enforcement finding out that some opportunistic drug-dealer has set up shop in some national forest, usually staffing their pot-field/meth-lab/whatever with heavily-armed guards. If highly-funded-and-equipped criminals are out there--and we all know they are--being able to fade into the woods strikes me as a nice option to have up one's sleeve.
Also, any user of the internet has to assume that the public is watching, and that includes whatever law enforcers happen to take an interest. (Wouldn't you?) If I were hiding under a rock immediately after escaping from Alcatraz, I wouldn't log on to BladeForums to ask folks about ideas for escape and evasion. So, though I agree with 2dogs that this forum should not go down the road of assisting people in committing criminal acts, I'm not particularly worried that it's headed that way. If anything, I imagine anybody participating in this forum is, by that fact, being higher-profile than someone who was actually planning a life of crime would like to do. Having nothing to hide, however, I'm not terribly worried.
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- Sep 26, 2005
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- 3,516
Best call your local authorities, mr. buzzkill.
I'm sure he's on the lam from the cops, skulking around in the woods at night.:jerkit:
I disagree. Fire needs oxygen to burn. If you put meat directly on the coals, you smother them. Suspending meat above coals is more efficient and promotes higher temperatures.
Heh. That must be why they won.
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- Sep 26, 2005
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- 3,516
I belive many experienced woodsmen cook directly in the coals, raked to the edge of the fire. I have tried it and my fire did not go out.
I am pretty sure the average indian had better wilderness skills then your average US troops, but I am just as sure the troops had better weapons.
I am pretty sure the average indian had better wilderness skills then your average US troops, but I am just as sure the troops had better weapons.
Do you put the meat directly on the coals, or wrap it in leaves or foil or something first? Would putting it directly on the coals not cover the emat in soot and ash?
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In my favourite survival handbook, "Primitive living and survival skills" by Jon and Geri Macpherson, he says "many of the old time boys" would simply chuck it into the coals, dust off the ashes, and chow down. Hairy critters they would singe the hair off in the fire first.
Corn on the cob was dipped in water, then roasted in coals.
He takes it one step further by explaining how to encase the critter in mud, airtight, and cook it in the coals. Of course its harder to judge when its done, but the mud keeps juices in it, so it wont dry out too fast.
Best of all, theres no need to skin the fish or pluck the bird, etc, because
it all sticks to the mud when you rip it open.
he goes into methods of broiling over the coals, and also baking in several ways, such as piling coals over a small stone oven, or building a fire in a hole you dig, then when you get some coals, add some green, wetted fragrant grasses and twigs (which add a nice smoke flavour, but choose wisely)
then put in your meal, add a hot flat stone that was heating by the fire, then some extra coals. It is more of a steamer then a direct cooker, and it takes several hours, but you are left with a "gourmet" meal that you dont have to worry about burning, and your camp can be built, wood cut and area scouted while you are waiting.
That method is probably too much work for me, but I will give it a try someday im sure.
Corn on the cob was dipped in water, then roasted in coals.
He takes it one step further by explaining how to encase the critter in mud, airtight, and cook it in the coals. Of course its harder to judge when its done, but the mud keeps juices in it, so it wont dry out too fast.
Best of all, theres no need to skin the fish or pluck the bird, etc, because
it all sticks to the mud when you rip it open.
he goes into methods of broiling over the coals, and also baking in several ways, such as piling coals over a small stone oven, or building a fire in a hole you dig, then when you get some coals, add some green, wetted fragrant grasses and twigs (which add a nice smoke flavour, but choose wisely)
then put in your meal, add a hot flat stone that was heating by the fire, then some extra coals. It is more of a steamer then a direct cooker, and it takes several hours, but you are left with a "gourmet" meal that you dont have to worry about burning, and your camp can be built, wood cut and area scouted while you are waiting.
That method is probably too much work for me, but I will give it a try someday im sure.