Cool weather sleeping gear

Stormstaff

Stormstaff

Joined
Dec 14, 2007
Messages
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My 9 yr old son sleeps cold. Right now he uses a 1 1/2" Thermarest and a 30 degree bag.

He still gets cold when it's in the 50's.

Some things I was thinking :

Poly pro long underwear
Hat
Good socks

Suggestions on additions to help him sleep warmer please?

Thanks for your time and help!
Kirk
 
My son has made the mistake of not changing his clothes (bunch of kids and they played until late and he just crashed). Keeping a pair of poly-pro or at least a dedicated pair long sleeve/pants that are clean is a big help. Fleece hat, clean socks; I often add a poncho liner in my pack, so a couple of times I've stuck in the sleeping bag to trap more air.

Teach him how to breath into his sleeping bag...maybe a thicker ground pad?

Do the old standbys of a warm drink and/or snack just before bed.

ROCK6
 
Any chance he's overheating, creating sweat, then getting the chills? When I'm winter camping, I find I sleep better when I wear less to sleep in. Works for me on the Presidentials in the winter. Sometimes I do have to add extra clothing or even get up and do a few pushups, but it's better than being super warm at the start only to lose the warmth when I get sweaty.
 
Sometimes, for some people, you just have to add an artificial heat source. Chemical heat packs come in several sizes and last an amazingly long time. Activate one and place it in the foot of the sleeping bag inside of a pair of heavy socks to prevent direct contact with his feet.

Breathing inside the bag is not a good idea, IMHO. When we breathe, we expel a large amount of water. This would increase the amount of moisture inside the bag reducing the efficiency of the insulation, not to mention the reduced oxygen inside of the bag. Even on the coldest nights, I make sure my mouth and nose are outside the bag.

Covering the head is a great way to increase a bag's warmth. We lose a lot of heat thru our heads. When it is cold, I wear a wool watch cap. When it is really cold, I wear a wool ski mask.

I also agree with the suggestion of a fresh, dry set of insulated underwear and thick, fresh dry socks. IIRC, when manufacturers rate their sleeping bags for temperature, they assume the person is attired thus.

Also pay attention to the sleeping pad. Some air pads don't insulate at all but move body heat to the ground through internal air convection. Perhaps add a blue foam mat below the pad to stop this convection. You can get them at Wal_mart most of the year for about $6. They weigh next to nothing (1# with stuff sack), roll up to 6"x20" and can be strapped on the outside of a pack.
 
Make sure he drinks warm drinks prior to sleep and eats some Peanut M&M's (or something similar) that has a good blend of carbs and protein (carbs are like pine wood and burn quick and hot whereas protien burns in the body slower and longer like hickory or oak wood). The food is fuel to the body that will help generate body heat.

Make sure he is NOT turtling (meaning he sleeps with his head/mouth under the covers) as others have said.

He must change his clothes including underwear before bed as they are saturated with moisture.

For a ground cloth get him one of those really heavy duty space blankets (not the cheapy compact) with the reflective surface facing the bag. Mine is green on one side and the reflective on the other side. This will add 2-5 degrees. Then make sure he has a really good insulated sleeping pad, then a good sleeping bag and then put him in a Bivi Sack which will add at least another 10 degrees plus reduces any heat loss from wind - convection - and will also help trap the body heat (radiation).

Also put him inside a tarp shelter and that will add another 5 to 10 degrees. He'll be warm now! Block any wind from coming into the shelter by placing his pack next to his head or feet.

Camp up and away from valley floors where cold night air tends to settle. Get up a few hundred feet in elevation on the south/eastern side of the hill.

Then also apply all the other sage advice given...he'll be fine.

Finally, he needs to acclimate himself to the outdoors. He is probably like most of us and used to sleeping in a warm room, warm home environment. Start slowly reducing the heat in his bedroom at night making it gradually cooler, and cooler until he becomes much more accustom or acclimated to ambient tempature of the outdoors. It is surprising what a difference this will make. Then he won't need to pack an extra 20 pounds worth of gear to stay warm. This is the best long term solution, but most people are not willing to pay the price for this "inconvienance" and will instead just take the short cut and buy and carry more gear - heavier sleeping bags, etc.
 
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Put a closed-cell pad under the inflatable. Most heat is lost through the ground.
 
A good pair of dry wool socks can make all the difference in the world, as will a wool beanie (I like the thin-but-warm smartwool ones, but I have to break them in so they fit my big head).

The first time I really experienced the magic of dry socks was on a backpacking trip. When we were at higher elevation, the temperature dropped quite a bit at night. To cut down on weight I was using a half-length Z-foam thermarest pad. However, the half-length left my feet and legs exposed to the cold ground and consequently I could not get myself warm enough inside the 20F bag I was in (It was probably about 35F out). This was despite wearing a dry shirt to bed and being crammed into a 3-man backpacking tent with two other people. A few days in, I put on a pair of my extra heavy wool socks and slept great for the rest of the trip.

Poly thermals are also good, though it needs to be very cold for me to sleep comfortably in them.

Quirt said:
Block any wind from coming into the shelter by placing his pack next to his head or feet.
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I don't know where you camp, but usually the packs aren't even in our site to avoid bear encounters.
 
You could also fill up a Nalgene bottle with some very hot water and put it in the bottom (feet) end of the bag. Warms the bag up nicely and for quite a while.
 
This keeps me warm for 12+ hours in winter. Kind of like wearing a mini-furnace just over your base layer. Heat is trapped under your clothes. Makes a big difference on a cold night. I keep a fresh one in every pack I have in the cold months.
http://www.thermacare.com/product/back-hip.aspx
 
Ferrousknight said:
I don't know where you camp, but usually the packs aren't even in our site to avoid bear encounters.
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Well I only stated that as an example if the situation warrants and obviously certain common sense caveats apply...however, typically in bear country the food supply is suspended in a tree several hundred yards away clearly seperate from the RON or Base Camp and our packs.

My pack and the equipment it contains inside is consider mission critical gear, and my food supply is not. I generally do not leave my food in my pack in order for bears to destroy the entire pack or to drag it off to another location never to be found. I can live without food and I can obtain more if I need too. My equipment in my pack I cannot if I lose it, misplace it or it is packed off by animals. Inside my pack is equipment such as medical, communication, etc that is essential for life support for my group I train with. If we must leave in a hurry (which we had to do once during an eruptive flash flood) then we want to grab our gear and immedately go, without having to wonder around in the dark searching for packs a few hundred yards away.

But you're insight and observation is extremly valuable and noteworthy. Food and anything "scentful" needs to be in a seperate location!

However, if the situation dictates where one must be seperated from a pack then use wood or debris to block the wind.
 
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Ferrousknight said:
...I don't know where you camp, but usually the packs aren't even in our site to avoid bear encounters.
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If Illinois has a problem with bears I am not aware of it. Here in SW Tennessee, I don't have to hang my food or my pack. But SMNP is deep in the thralls of bear problems. The park now has a website announcing which campsites and shelters are closed due to recent problem bears (read: hikers causing bear problems). Whereas a person could count themselves very lucky to even see a blackie there when I hiked the AT back in 1974, twenty years ago the population was estimated at 600 bears in the park. Latest estimates are a population of 1,600 bears.

Likewise the number of hikers/campers has increased, and many of those new users haven't a clue as to proper behavior in bear territory. Cables are provided at many sites to hang not just food, but also packs and the cables are seldom defeated. If people would just use them, and other proper methods of food storage, cooking and sanitation, bear problems would decrease.
 
I am a Scoutmaster in Northern Indiana and we sleep out in cold weather all the time! There has been a lot of good feedback here. The main thing we run into is that kids don't think about doing what it takes to be warm until they wake up shivering at 2:00 in the morning. They run around and get all sweaty and dirty and then they just crawl into bed and wonder why their "20 degree bag" is cold. It is more than the bag. The bag is but one part of a system.
First of all - don't believe the temp ratings on the bag. There is no standard or test they have to pass to get a rating, it is just what the companies want to put on them. The cheaper brands will be way off! I bought a 20 degree Slumberjack bag and I was cold in it sleeping inside a building! Don't be afraid to take a bag back and exchange it! I have been through four bags and have finally found the one that works best for me. It is a 15 degree bag that really keeps me warm down to about 40 degrees. Get a mummy bag and check to make sure it has good baffles along the zipper, a thick baffle around the neck and that it draws up snug around the face. Also make sure that it is easy to work the drawstrings and zipper in the dark. The mummy bag has less air to heat up and the baffles and drawstrings cinch it up tight to keep heat from getting out. On a realy cold night, the only thing exposed should be your nose!
Resist the temptation to put your head inside your bag - all the moisture from your breath will condense and make things wet and clammy - you want to stay dry.
CLEAN CLOTHES! Long johns, sweats etc. Including thick socks and a cap on his head, maye even light weight gloves. NO COTTON! I tell my scouts that 'COTTON KILLS". If it gets sweaty, or wet or damp, the game is over. Hands, feet and the head are like the bodies radiators due to the large amount of blood vessels near the surface. You need to cover these areas up! It is all about keeping the heat that you have inside you from escaping - once it is gone you cant get it back and you have to replace it. That means fuel. The suggestion of M&Ms or a power bar before bed were good ones. Hot drinks, not so much. You have to stay hydrated, but to much will make you need to get up in the middle of the night and crawl out of your warm bag, go out side, pee, then come back in. You looose a ton of precious heat doing that. I know guys who take a pee-bottle in their bag to save the heat, but I can't bring myself to do that.
My biggest issue is keeping my feet warm. I tried everything - and what works for me is thick socks and putting hot water into a Nalgene, putting that into a big zip lock bag (don't want any leaks getting the bag wet), and sliding the whole thing into a sock. Put that at the bottom of the bag and yuour feet will be toasty all night. You can also use the water to brush your teeth or get your coffee started in the morning, too.
I also have a really big zero degree rectangular bag that i slide my 15 degree mummy bag into on those really cold Feb campouts.
I am a really cold sleeper. I will wear long johns, wool socks and hat, fleece pants and shirt, light gloves, I will put a 15 degree down bag into a zero degree bag and then put a hot water bottle at my feet. That keeps me warm down to about ten degrees.
On a last note, try to come up with a system that does not rely on those hot packs. You can stay warm without those. I have seen kids burn their skin when a they roll onto a pack and it stays trapped under them, and I have seen times when the packs die in the midddle of the night or kids forget to bring them. I tell my Scouts to leave them at home and figure out a better way to stay warm.
 
Hi guys great thread by the way. Im new to the forum and camping . I starting to get some gear together. My 7 yr. son and myself will be going on a boyscout campout this Oct. We get cold easily so i purchased 2 mummy bag for 29 on sale at big 5 yesterday do you guys think it will work. any experience with these.
http://www.amazon.com/Suisse-Sport-Alpine-Double-Sleeping/dp/B002H10PW8

Also if it aint to much to ask. Can you recommend any tents. Im thinking on maybe a 4 person tent mid size. But will keep us warm and dry. I also plan on taking it hunting with my Bro in law. So I heard not to buy a big one if you plan on hiking and packing it on hunting trips.There is like 3 on sale at Big 5 sporting goods here the ad page 4
http://big5sportinggoods.shoplocal....gle&storeid=2503823&rapid=982405&pagenumber=4
Im thinking of this one.
http://big5sportinggoods.shoplocal....pid=982405&pagenumber=4&listingid=-2086071548
 
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