Sorry in advance for not having a lot of info or pictures to back this up but.... Council Tool is announcing the latest addition to the Velvi-Cut Line, Boy's Axe !!!! I'm friends with Council on the world's most popular networking site. just posted that...
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The BladeForums.com 2024 Traditional Knife is ready to order! See this thread for details: https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/bladeforums-2024-traditional-knife.2003187/
Price is$300$250 ea (shipped within CONUS). If you live outside the US, I will contact you after your order for extra shipping charges.
Order here: https://www.bladeforums.com/help/2024-traditional/ - Order as many as you like, we have plenty.
Coouncil Tool Boy's Axe
- Thread starter coreboy
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Yeah not too surprised - the backstock of Council FSS axes were pretty well received and sold quite well. If only they HT'd their 5160 better though. It's amazing steel but there's no reason why 5160 can't be hardened to 55-57 while still staying being more than tough enough for heavy chopping. It's not going to shine at 50-54 (and that's an awfully wide range they're allowing for at the premium they're asking). GB manages a consistent 57hrc and they're working with the equivalent of 1050..
Square_peg
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Can't wait to see one! 
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look forward to seeing one as well.
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I'm pretty curious on it too.
I will say though that as much as I'm liking my Council FSS boy's axe I don't see how the velvicutt could be worth twice the price.
I will say though that as much as I'm liking my Council FSS boy's axe I don't see how the velvicutt could be worth twice the price.
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It will provide a niche in the market where there isn't a top line boys axe. Their popularity is sky rocketing and it will be interesting to see the product and how the customer base responds to it.
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It'll be interesting to see how this takes off for Council. I personally would think they could make a good deal of money offering FSS-spec models as a standard item myself, while still offering the Velvicut line to the premium consumer.
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was there a date or time frame given on when it will come out?
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Bingo.
I'll chime in here for what it's worth...
Speaking with Margo Council about a year ago she said they weren't certain what type of steel GB was using to get that level of heat treatment.
She asked my opinion about a new addition to the Velvicut line - a Cruiser Double bit! I said it would probably be a big hit as the Hudson pattern had filled the woodcraft/survival niche and the only cruiser pattern I knew of was the one from Barco.
When asked if I'd buy one I said no. My choice would be a Jersey Perfect (if they could freshen up the dies) or a Boy's axe which wouldn't dilute the market for the big Dayton. I'm a little surprised they didn't go with the cruiser pattern but I'll buy the Velvicut Boy' axe when it comes out. I'd like to see it offered with a 32" handle.
Speaking with Margo Council about a year ago she said they weren't certain what type of steel GB was using to get that level of heat treatment.
She asked my opinion about a new addition to the Velvicut line - a Cruiser Double bit! I said it would probably be a big hit as the Hudson pattern had filled the woodcraft/survival niche and the only cruiser pattern I knew of was the one from Barco.
When asked if I'd buy one I said no. My choice would be a Jersey Perfect (if they could freshen up the dies) or a Boy's axe which wouldn't dilute the market for the big Dayton. I'm a little surprised they didn't go with the cruiser pattern but I'll buy the Velvicut Boy' axe when it comes out. I'd like to see it offered with a 32" handle.
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Yeah - it's a proprietary swedish axe steel and the only info GB has really let loose is that it's .50% carbon steel. A lot of people sort of rushed to the conclusion that meant plain old 1050, but I feel like it could potentially have other alloying agents.. That said though, heat treating 1050 to 57hrc isn't beyond the steel's limitations and it most certainly isn't for 1060 and 5160. I feel like Council is just keeping their axes in the high 40s to low 50s for fear of screwing up the odd batch and so that they don't have to be as spot on with the heat treat, thus saving money. Perfectly acceptable for their regular line of 1060, but for the premium they're asking for their Velvicut, I'd definitely expect the 5160 to consistency be in the 55-57hrc range.
Also, I wouldn't even blink an eye to pick up a Velvicut Jersey Perfect on a 32" handle if they improved their HT. As for the 32" on the boy's axe though, I couldn't see them justifying the production as it would be too niche. Heads under 2.5lbs rarely find their way onto handles longer than 28"
QUOTE=killa_concept;12152653]... heat treating 1050 to 57hrc isn't beyond the steel's limitations and it most certainly isn't for 1060 and 5160. I feel like Council is just keeping their axes in the high 40s to low 50s for fear of screwing up the odd batch and so that they don't have to be as spot on with the heat treat, thus saving money. Perfectly acceptable for their regular line of 1060, but for the premium they're asking for their Velvicut, I'd definitely expect the 5160 to consistency be in the 55-57hrc range.[/QUOTE]
Council is vary aware of the low priority placed on edged tools by most of the market and their need to compete with offshore manufacturers. There is little wiggle room during production for mistakes and experimentation which may account for the "play it safe" attitude. Nonetheless, they are also very appreciative of suggestions that help them in their goals of raising standards while staying competitive in a very limited market. I'd suggest a phone call or polite letter delineating your wants and desires.
I just stumbled on a near mint True Temper Jersey Perfect with a 28 inch handle so I'm covered there
Being on the tall side I prefer the 36" ones I've got even though a few are beaters with little use other than splitting.
My reasoning behind a lighter axe head on a longer handle is twofold. First: There aren't many appropriate sized small axes for tall people. If you're over 6'4'' then a 28" axe is more like a glorified hatchet IMHO. While not in Steve Tall's category, I don't use boy's axes for chopping much of anything as I value my lower extremities far too much. My Council Boy's axe is mostly used for free hand trimming/limbing. If I'm going to buck a log I reach for a 36" full sized axe. The same is true for splitting. I get greater head speed due to the longer radius arc which saves my strength plus I don't have to squat or bend at the waist so much which seems to prolong my endurance and takes the strain off the psoas muscle - a major contributor to low back strain. This is not to be confused with "race" chopping in which every available muscle group is used to its utmost. Longer handles soften the shock load and are easier on the joints, too.
Second: Longer handled smaller axes are also excellent for smaller statured people including many women. My significant other maxes out at 3lbs on a 30" handle with 2lb10oz being the most comfortable we've found but we don't have any in between those two. She can also manage a 32" handle length when splitting/bucking if the head is lighter. I have a 2.5lb Agdor that she uses despite the handle being a little thick.
I think there is a market for the small head/long handled tool once the benefits are understood. I know that the older I get the lighter the tools will have to be. It's not a race anymore.
Council is vary aware of the low priority placed on edged tools by most of the market and their need to compete with offshore manufacturers. There is little wiggle room during production for mistakes and experimentation which may account for the "play it safe" attitude. Nonetheless, they are also very appreciative of suggestions that help them in their goals of raising standards while staying competitive in a very limited market. I'd suggest a phone call or polite letter delineating your wants and desires.
I just stumbled on a near mint True Temper Jersey Perfect with a 28 inch handle so I'm covered there
Being on the tall side I prefer the 36" ones I've got even though a few are beaters with little use other than splitting. My reasoning behind a lighter axe head on a longer handle is twofold. First: There aren't many appropriate sized small axes for tall people. If you're over 6'4'' then a 28" axe is more like a glorified hatchet IMHO. While not in Steve Tall's category, I don't use boy's axes for chopping much of anything as I value my lower extremities far too much. My Council Boy's axe is mostly used for free hand trimming/limbing. If I'm going to buck a log I reach for a 36" full sized axe. The same is true for splitting. I get greater head speed due to the longer radius arc which saves my strength plus I don't have to squat or bend at the waist so much which seems to prolong my endurance and takes the strain off the psoas muscle - a major contributor to low back strain. This is not to be confused with "race" chopping in which every available muscle group is used to its utmost. Longer handles soften the shock load and are easier on the joints, too.
Second: Longer handled smaller axes are also excellent for smaller statured people including many women. My significant other maxes out at 3lbs on a 30" handle with 2lb10oz being the most comfortable we've found but we don't have any in between those two. She can also manage a 32" handle length when splitting/bucking if the head is lighter. I have a 2.5lb Agdor that she uses despite the handle being a little thick.
I think there is a market for the small head/long handled tool once the benefits are understood. I know that the older I get the lighter the tools will have to be. It's not a race anymore.
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EasyDigging.com has proved that concept with their digging tools, I think. They carry 3lb. Tramontina picks and have 45" handles made for them. I own one of their pick mattocks and it's great having the lighter head and longer handle. Still hits like a ton of bricks while maximizing reach and minimizing back strain.