Copperhead or Swayback or . . ?

[rjdankert]

Hi, I'm looking for a new pocket knife for EDC and maybe a little whittling. I'd like a folder with a Wharncliffe or sheepsfoot blade and stag scales (wood second choice). The front runners so far are Case XX: 1) mini copperhead, 2) swayback jack, and 3) seahorse. The difference between the copperhead and swayback seems to be that one has the two blades on the same end while the other at opposite ends. I know very little about knives and would like to know the pros and cons of each design. After that the seahorse is a bit longer and has the coping blade. I think I like the idea of a little longer knife, but is not a must. Not sure what to do with a coping blade. All three are shaped differently.

Would appreciate any comments on these knives or others I might consider.

Thanks, Bob

 

[Planterz]

The Mini Copperhead is a fairly small knife. 3 1/4", and both blades use the same backspring. Very low profile, which makes it nice for carrying, but perhaps not as nice for using for extended periods. Your had will probably cramp.

The Sway Back Jack is also fairly small, but is more substantial than the Mini Copperhead. 2 backsprings, obviously, which makes it thicker, plus a larger handle. Most find it very comfortable to use because of the handle shape, despite its short length. It's also fairly hefty for its small size, due to its construction.

The Seahorse is a much more substantial knife than the other two. 3/4 of an inch might not sound like much, but when it comes to these kinds of knives, it does. It might be larger than you'd care to carry in your pocket. The Seahorse will probably weigh about double the Mini Copperhead.

There are other options, unless you're insisting on buying a Case. Northwoods makes a 4" dogleg whittler with a wharncliffe main blade, and is in D2 steel which will hold its edge far longer than Case's steel. If you're OK with carbon steel (not stainless), check out Great Eastern Cutlery, specifically the patern #61 Congress (4 blade) and Half Congress (2 blade), the pattern #62 Half Congress (2 blade) and Courthouse Whittler (3 blade), and the #89 Executive Whittler (3 blade). I believe some #61 Half Congresses were made in 440C stainless. Many other companies make/made congresses and half congresses as well. Personally I'd stay away from the Case ones though, like the 64052 (4 blade) and 62052 (2 blade), as the blades on these are rather thin and flexible. Maybe the 6488 has beefier blades, I don't know (it's a much larger knife).

As for the purpose of the coping blade, in carving, it's used to scour lines and do fine detail. Coping blades are typically thinly ground so they're good for removing material a little bit at a time. They also shred cardboard boxes nicely.

Here's a good link for the various types of blades you see in traditional pocket knives.

http://www.agrussell.com/Knife-Encylopedia/a/134/

Note that what's usually described as a coping blade is referred to as a "cut off pen" blade in that link.

EDIT: Oops, I just noticed that the Northwoods Dogleg, unlike their other whittler, is not D2 steel, but 420HC. Probably 56-57Rc hardness. Still probably better than Case's Tru-Sharp (which is supposedly also 420HC, but a bit softer). Northwoods does have a small congress in D2 in some beautiful stag. 4 blades: 2 large sheepsfoot main blades, a pen blade, and coping blade. A bit on the pricier side, but stag always is.

 

[Eric H]

Although I've been 'into' knives for quite a while, I'm relatively new to traditional. I can tell you this though--I have not seen the overwhelming love for any certain pattern of knife like I see here for Case's Swayback since I don't know when.

 

[Planterz]

I have not seen the overwhelming love for any certain pattern of knife like I see here for Case's Swayback since I don't know when.

It's not only the pattern, but the level of craftsmanship and refinement. The Case knives that bear Tony Bose's name are made to a higher standard than the rest of their knives.

 

[Will Power]

The Swayback is a very appealing knife even for people who don't generally go for small knives. The finish is high but it's a precision user as well offering a lot of dexterity. It also looks like you want to own it and use it. I do with the cv and stainless versions I have, personally i like it as a Barehead pattern too.

The Seahorse is an attractive knife too and offers a substantial handle. The OP might like to consider a Whittler from Böker, Queen or CASE or a GEC 25 Wharncliffe blade-some are single others have a pen secondary. A very significant smaller knife like the Swayback.

 

[rjdankert]

Planterz, Thanks for the reply. At this point, I have no reason to insist on a Case. I have tried to track down the knives you mentioned. I think I'll drop the seahorse and copperhead. Liked the dogleg and executative whittlers, but may add to my list a Great Eastern Cutlery Tidioute #62 Easy Pocket Congress (3 3/4"). I like the rounded bolsters over the squareish ones on a Great Eastern Cutlery: Northfield #61 - 2 Blade Congress. But I'm unsure of the difference between Tidioute vs Northfield.

Thanks again, Bob

 

[rjdankert]

Eric, yea. A lot of good responses on a recent thread here that got my attention. Bob

 

[rjdankert]

Willgoy, will check out Böker and Queen. The GEC 25 is nice,but not quite what I'm looking for (right now,at least). I've already looked at Case pretty thouroughly. thanks, Bob

 

[Knife Crazied]

I've never owned a seahorse or cooperhead but I do own a swayback. It is one of those knives that just melt in your hand. Beautiful knife, very comfortable, and pretty darn attractive if you ask me. :thumbup:

 

[dannyp]

Queen also made a Half Congress with Birdseye Maple scales. It's been discontinued, but you may still be able to find one. The Swayback is a wonderful little pattern, although it could be a tad small if you have large hands.

But I'm unsure of the difference between Tidioute vs Northfield.

The basic differences are that the Northfield line has fancier bolsters, higher polished finishing on the blades, more robust swedges, and they have the upper end scales like stag. They also tend to have long pulls where the Tidioute knives use nail nicks. Both lines use 1095 unlike the Great Eastern branded knives which use 440C.

 

[Eric H]

It's not only the pattern, but the level of craftsmanship and refinement. The Case knives that bear Tony Bose's name are made to a higher standard than the rest of their knives.

I certainly believe you (as well as the rest of the forum members who love the Swayback), and I plan to pick one up in the very near future, but my Case/Tony Boss Sowbelly that I bought new a few years back leaves quite a bit to be desired. It's the only Case I've ever owned, and if it is a "high water mark" for the Case knives, I doubt I will be buying any more of them again. (The GEC Trapper that I recently bought is 2 or 3 times the.knife that my Sowbelly is, for only a little more money.

All that being said, I will still give the.Case Swayback the chance to change my opinion.

 

[Eric H]

Then again, now that I just received my Scale Fruition with the wharncliff blade, I have serious doubts that the Case Swayback will be able to keep my attention! (I admit that they aren't in the same class...)

 

[LKJW]

I am enamored with the SBJ. Tough to keep it out of my pocket. Been trying to force a little variety lately.

 

[ThundarStick]

I have done a little whittling with both the Seahorse and Swayback and I perfer the Seahorse for whittling, but the Swayback for carry. Can't go wrong with either IMO.

 

[cj65]

To the OP, make the trip to a cutlery shop and handle any and all, you will be in a better position to evaluate.

 

[Will Power]

Yes the Easy pocket Congress might well serve you, that and GEC's Courthouse Whittler which offers Wharncliffe master and Pen, Cope secondaries. There's a richly illustrated thread on this.

 

[hunterfisher808]

I like all of these patterns a lot. The wharnie really comes into it's own on a controlled pull cut, especially when coupled with a swayback handle. The seahorse has a lot of handle to blade ratio making it a classic choice for whittling. I really like the size of the copperhead for EDC, and the clip blade is probably the most all around style made. Would be best if you could test drive 'em all to see which one "pops your nut" as my ole man would say

 

[rjdankert]

dannyp, thanks for the education on Northfield vs Tidioute, and GEC.

And thanks to all responders, I have learned a lot.

Bob

 

[rjdankert]

So I looked at more threads and more internet surffing and ended up with a GEC Northfield #620311W EZ pocket courthouse whittlier with burnt stag scales. Here it is:

I like the size and feel. And it seems to be solid construction. I got it to be a working knife so cosmetics aren't on the top of my list. I expect the blades will get scratched as time goes by. But I really expected the blades would have a better polish new out of the tube:

I could clean the tool marks up, but I don't think it is worth the effort for a user. Is this typical for a $125 knife? Thanks for looking, Bob

 

[shrapne1]

thats a beautiful knife, but youre right, for 125 bucks it should be pristine. I know when they put the knife together it can get some scuffs, but it looks like the main blade is rubbing?