Coyotes.. Gramma's cats.. and bears! Oh my!

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bored2deth

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Hehehe..Hey peoples,

My grandmother's cats have begun to.....disappear. It's odd.. I was up there not two months ago, and having to watch every step to avoid stepping in cat doodie.. Stupid cats...pooping everywhere..doodie on everything! -_- Yes, I did end up stepping in a rather large (for a domestic cat) pile of doodie. Glad I was wearing cheap old work-boots. Wow..and I thought bear doodie was rotten..cats have them beat with ease. (Although, admittedly, bears make alot more of it.) I had tracked the furry bas*a*ds for over an hour, checking the area clearly, found quite a bit of activity. They have dogs, but those dogs have pens. Her husband is a ding-a-ling, and couldn't trap a mouse or hit the broadside of an Amish barn with a .10 gauge! Now, my grandmother is telling me that the population of feral cats has dropped by 90%, and two of her house cats..and a new kitten..have ended missing as well. Add to that one of their small, stupid dogs got out..he's gone too. I'm certain the ferals and domestics alike, along with a neighbors cat and dog, have ended up as coyote doodie. I've tried to warn them to keep their cats inside, and their dogs well-penned up..but the old fart (her husband) doesn't listen to anyone, even those far and away more experienced than him.

I've read reports of even large dogs being killed by the smart little bas*a*ds.. One vs several, that is. It's gotten me to wondering, as I work outdoors, if I could fall prey to a pack. Should I bring my dog with me? Two vs --? I've read reports on hundreds of pets going missing all over the country--birds, cats, and even larger dogs. I've also read reports of a woman being killed by a pack on a hiking trail, and several children. My work is in the outdoors, and so I wonder. Typically I work with a chainsaw, but I usually have a nice double-bit axe, with a bit of custom-work done. I won't carry a gun at work..falling trees, roots to trip on..that could backfire on me. Should I worry about a coyote pack eyeballing me as their next meal? I don't think I'd taste very good...too chewy and bitter lol. Has anyone on the boards been attacked by a coyote pack?
 
Lots of smaller pets have gone missing all around the USA, since 'yotes are following the increasing deer population. I've never seen one mess with a dog of any size and they seem to have a knack for going after the older beagles, that are easy to catch and kill. (I've ran across a couple of old beagles they gutted and left until the ground was froze, then devoured mice hard to dig up then)

I doubt very seriously one, or even more would ever even come close to a grown adult human. It may have happened before but it's extremely rare and the one case I remember, where a woman was killed by two, it was in a park and they'd been fed by people. Not to say don't carry a knife and a sidearm when out and about. I do and it's just insurance against anything out there in the woods, man or beastie.
 
Thank you for your reply, Jill Jackson,

My grandmother actually has smaller dogs, I believe the one snatched was a Mtn.Feist. I liked that little dog. She has a larger, much more aggressive dog..though, he is penned up..as I'm sure he'd drop a coyote or two. No, I don't see one or two, or even three as a threat to a full grown, determined adult but still..I mean a pack.. My main concern is my grandmother, she goes up that steep hill to feed their animals and her fool husband sits on his fat a##. I've managed to convince her to carry a walking stick, at the least. I hate to think of old beagles getting torn up by coyotes, that's a sad thought. In my time I've had nasty encounters with feral dogs, but I'm guessing coyotes are a bit smarter about picking their marks. :-)
 
My Wife and I train detection dogs as well as doing behavioural rehabilitation, and we get a lot of woods time in the course of the job. That doesn't always happen in Coyote country, but considering their current prevalence here in Nova Scotia, the definition of "Coyote country" is a fluid one. It's our position that any Dog that accompanies its handler into the woods should be on leash - ours work normally on a 40 foot long line and harness, but transit is always on a 6 foot lead. While Coyotes have been known to be attracted by the presence of a domestic Dog, they are only one, danger that has been overplayed in the media, mostly out of fear for the safety of pets and small children. We must never forget that there are Porcupines, Skunks, poisonous Snakes if you have them where you live, and good old Murphy's Law that will bite you now and again no matter how savvy you are, just to teach you not to be too cocky.

I once had one of my working Dogs take a headfirst plunge into a putrid mush of dead leaves suspended in stagnant water that was filling a crevasse, and that she mistook for dry land. I grabbed her harness and pulled her out, thoroughly coated and oh so fragrant, and took her to a nearby stream to wash her down before continuing with the operation, but that night she developed a raging ear and eye infection, projectile vomiting, and life threatening dehydration that soon infected my other Dogs, no doubt via the shared water bowl. We were administering sub-Q fluids every two hours for three days to keep everyone alive while our vet tried to figure out what was going on - all the while disinfecting the house and yard of vomit and liquid feces. Finally, at my urging, he tested for giardiasis and BINGO! Amazing what the right antibiotic can do.

In another event, a friend of mine who owns a lot of woodland was limbing trees and cutting up deadfall one day in the company of his Sheltie when he heard a loud snap and a brief yelp. His Dog had been decapitated by a bear trap that had been set on his property without permission. My point is, these are all part of the equation.

In the vein of human encounters, another friend was snowmobiling in deep snow a couple winters back when his machine broke down. Silly bugger was not hauling snowshoes (he does now) so he began to slog back toward his camp. He started hearing Coyotes yipping and getting closer to him. Soon he started seeing them through the tees as the group split up to flank him. He told me he started to panic as he realized he only had his hunting knife and a small hatchet with him, and while the crust on the snow was supporting his weight for the most part, he would occasionally break through to find the snow was nearly hip deep in spots. Then he got angry, tore a dead limb from a nearby tree, bashed it against the trunk and yelled, "COME ON!" To his amazement - he really thought he was in a fight to the death - the Coyotes grew silent and went on their way. I don't present this story as a definitive solution to being hunted by Coyotes, but it stands in contrast to events in my region where people are running blissfully down a forest trail, ear buds in and music on, oblivious to everything right up to the point where they get attacked from behind by one or more Coyotes whose prey drive was triggered by seeing something running by.

I don't posture as a grand authority by any means, but I work every day with the canine mind and the Coyote is a real piece of work in its purest form. I have a few articles on my website that might be of interest to this discussion:

From 8 August 2012 - Worldly Wisdom Wednesday – Brought To You Today by the Coyotes of Nova Scotia

From 2 June 2010 - Contemplations on a Really Bad Idea

From 3 September 2008 (a Wolf, not a Coyote, but still illustrative) - After Action Report
 
Back when my wife and I first moved into our old house a nearby piece of woodland was cleared for a Wal Mart and the resident Coyotes moved into the swamp surrounding our developement. Pretty soon most of the outside cats had disappeared (good riddance I say) and smaller dogs were coming up missing.

I was on my way out the front door one day to bring the trash cans up from the curb and my wife said there was a dog hanging around the front yard. My dog at the time (80 lb female Boxer) always went with me when I went outside but this time I put her on a leash and boy was I glad I did. I went outside and immediately saw that the "dog" was a large male coyote. He wasn't the least bit concerned about me but he eyed my dog hard. She would have gone after him had she not been on a leash. The coyote went into an aggressive stance and slowly started creeping up the drive. I stomped and yelled and waved my hands and he didn't back down. I told him if he was still there when I came back he was dead. A .22 WMR later and he went in a garbage bag and back down to the curb. Too many kids in the neighborhood to allow that kind of nonsense. Only experience with a coyote I've had up close. I definately wouldn't have turned my back on him.

If they worry you, a .22 Mag revolver is good medicine for them. A leather flap holster will keep it and you safe in the outdoors. No telling how many soldiers have fallen on such a setup around the world. Coyotes aren't what I would call a problem where I live, but I always keep an eye and ear out for them when I'm in the woods.
 
Bigfatts said:
I was on my way out the front door one day to bring the trash cans up from the curb and my wife said there was a dog hanging around the front yard. My dog at the time (80 lb female Boxer) always went with me when I went outside but this time I put her on a leash and boy was I glad I did. I went outside and immediately saw that the "dog" was a large male coyote. He wasn't the least bit concerned about me but he eyed my dog hard. She would have gone after him had she not been on a leash. The coyote went into an aggressive stance and slowly started creeping up the drive. I stomped and yelled and waved my hands and he didn't back down ... I definately wouldn't have turned my back on him.
Click to expand...

That's a common experience with Coyotes where I live as well - they rarely react with anything resembling concern at the approach of a human, but a Dog will get more attention than they ever wanted.
 
I agree with you guys--coyotes are a pain in the a@@ and a menace..however, keeping down the population of stray cats is (as cold as it may sound) a good thing. Feline's can transmit some nasty bacteria with those claws and teeth. Plus, stray cats tend to take out quite a few birds (including more rare species). I love dogs, especially my own, and I'd hate to think of anyone's dog being ganged up on by a pack of coyotes and torn apart. They seem to be a cowardly bunch, but not so much it seems in larger numbers. Much like any predator, they prefer an easy target. My grandfather used to tell me stories of
wolves, "They go for the slower, weaker animals. Culls the herd, you see, and in this way they go about their prey with less risk of injury to themselves."
From what I've read and seen, the bas%a$ds seem to use tactics, even to the point of luring a dog off to be ambushed. I really dislike coyotes. I'm growing tired of listening to their songs at night. Maybe I'll try my hand at tracking them, I've tracked deer and bear, why not a coyote..
 
We hear Coyotes often at night (and see them during cold weather) and we have usually 5-8 barn cats. Only rarely does a cat turn up missing. I think the Owls are a greater threat here. Fox are also tough on cats if they can catch them out in the open.
 
Back in 2008.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/589309-Close-encounter-with-a-large-yote

From thread:

Originally Posted by jill jackson


I don't think there was anything wrong with this 'yote, he just didn't sense me because my dogs was harassing him and he wasn't gonna run from my dogs. There's some fairly large packs around you hear them at night socializing. You mostly see a pair or a single one in the day though.
In this exact same area last winter I found an old beagle they'd killed and gutted. I'd ran into this poor old fella on my hikes a few times and they got finally got him. He laid there till the ice and snow got on the ground, then they devoured him in a day or so. (i didn't know who's dog it was to tell them)
 
Do not underestimate coyotes. My cousin has a 2700 acre wheat farm in easern washington. He has lost many dogs to coyotes, including a full grown german shepard. The coyotes gang up and wear the dog out. Coyotes do not fight fair and are very smart. As they may be Rabid, a weapon with reach (i.e. a gun) is a very good idea.
Ron Athay
 
On three separate occasions I have had coyotes chase one of our cats into my garage. I solved the problem each time with a hollow point .22 right in between the eyes. I have found that dead coyotes at the tree line of my property keeps other coyotes out of my yard.
 
'Yotes being canine- I wonder how they react to a dog whistle?? Maybe unusual enough to rattle them? Stream shooting peppper spray might be useful. I used to work alot of fence line and ALWAYS had a cheap old single shot 12 guage with me. Rabid animals, feral dogs, the threat of running into the odd Black Bear under bad circumstances.

Area close by had an issue with a large bear for a time. It was seen chasing ponies in a corral, looking in a window at folks watching TV- it tore up the chain link dog kennel and ate one guys dog as he watched screaming all the while.

While I would not rate being attacked by a group of coyotes as likely, animals do not always behave as we expect.

Bill
 
A biologist from a local university said eastern coyotes have bred with dogs, producing a larger and more social animal. My neighbor got a male that was definitely in the German Shepard size class.

We have three packs near. We hear them calling back and forth at nights.

There have been numerous attacks on pets and livestock (such as alpaca, sheep, goats), but none on people in this area so far. We have few feral cats left, no ground hogs to speak of (common pre-coyote), and I have not seen a fox since shortly after we first started seeing coyotes. Somehow, the turkeys seem to be coping.
 
Well..hell..the coyotes took two goats. Bah! Now the old fart is talking about getting a MULE!! -_- Yes, it'd likely keep the coyotes away but still..they are foul-tempered and bothersome. Any chance a Mule would attack or injure my grandmother? -_- I have a better solution myself:He could sell the goats. There has to be something that old goob can do. I refuse to get involved myself, as he and I don't exactly get along too well. A jenny would likely be able to knock some coyote heads, but then the old fart could try shooting them...only problem is he can't shoot straight.
 
Hehehe...an ass for an ass!! (Yes, the old man has that coming.) I hope it bites him. I've read up on the subject and they do seem to have a taste for hoofing coyotes to death, even using them as chew toys.
 
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