Craftsman Knife Identification

[Codger_64]

A member recently brought this knife to my attention and wanted to know more about it, so I thought I would post it here and we could discuss it.

From this series of photos, you can see that the knife has a plain (flat) ground blade with a series of thumb notches, a pronounced choil, one piece Staglon handle with blank nickle silver shield, nickle silver compression rivets.

The only marking visible on this example is the Craftsman U.S.A. tang stamp. The blade has obviously been cleaned of rust and some pitting is visible.

The sheath looks rough as all get-out, practically looking home made. But it isn't. The folded riveted sheath is the original for this knife, purposely made with the rough side out.

Here are my two examples of this same knife.

As you can see, there was originally an identifying blade etch, "HEAVY SKINNER". Unlike some Craftsman hunting knives and most Craftsman pocket knives, there is no Sears number anywhere on the knife.

And since I've never seen one in it's original box, nor found one in the catalogs to date, I still don't know exactly when it was made, or for certain who the maker was.

Yes, it shares a lot of characteristics with Schrade and Imperial knives. Quite some time ago when I first ran across this pattern I asked a former Schrade employee about it. They didn't recognize it and said with some degree of certainty that it was not made in the Ellenville Schrade factory.

So to me, that suggests an Imperial knife made in Rhode Island before that factory closed and was consolodated with the Schrade division in Ellenville, circa 1985. The style features suggest an even earlier origin, such as the late 1960's through mid 1970's. Whatever it is, I don't recognize the blade pattern as a production Imperial. Do any of you? Does anyone have one in it's original box, or seen one in a catalog?

Michael

 

[tongueriver]

Thanks, Michael; that was very interesting. There is a certain large internet entity wherein one might find one of those right now! I would really really like to see some pictures of the elusive Craftsman variant of my favorite 165 OT/UH.... hint-hint

 

[Codger_64]

As you can see, Baer gave Sears pretty well free rein with the Schrade trademarked names, and as long as they were willing to pay for special factory order features, Schrade was happy to provide them. Sears went through a several decade phase where they wanted their knives to be strikingly different from the regular production knives from their makers. This is one such knife. Nice, eh?

 

[ea42]

Michael, those handles (on the staglon knife) are strikingly similar to Camillus handles from the early seventies era, although if Camillus wasn't contracted with Sears, that point would be moot, not to mention the fact that it doesn't look like any Camillus knife I've ever seen. I do have an Imperial Old Timer with that darker staglon though, and the UH165's were a shade darker initially as well. So there, I guess I really haven't solved anything as far as handle color. I'm beginning to realize that there was a lot of "sharing" going on with manufacturing , at least in the late fifties, sixties, and seventies, between all the IKC's and even Camillus. I don't doubt that the Baer's role as majority stock holders had something to do with this. Interesting how the tang is completely encased in the handle. I'm going to be really obscure here, but wasn't there some kind of set put out by possibly Imperial that had two fixed blade knives and rugged sheaths, I think named after Kit Carson? I saw it not too long ago, the handle was similar but I believe the blade was an upswept style like the 49ers.

Eric

 

[ea42]

OK, here's a Kit Carson pic, which now that I look at it bares no resemblance whatsoever, not even the handle material I'm baffled, the old Cammy handles don't match up either, maybe you've got a Schrade after all, perhaps a hybrid 165UH with 15OT handles?

[/IMG]

Eric

 

[Codger_64]

Yep, more questions than answers about this one. Baer did buy out the Kastor heirs and take full control of Camillus circa 1963 (he had retained major portions of stocks when he left Camillus in late 1940). Even as he turned over major portions of Camillus stocks to his two daughters, Betsy and Marjory, he kept his influence in the company and in fact, used Camillus to provide his other companies with components and finished knives. He also used Camillus to fulfill contracts acquired from Sears. Eventually, Camillus regained near sole supplier status with Sears. I wouldn't totally rule out the possibility of Camillus as a source for these.

These knives may have been a marketing experiment for one or the other of Baer's companies. As such, it may have been an in-store only offering, never appearing in a catalog. Sears, to my dismay, has no corporate memory of their knife purchases and sales. Sears and Craftsman tool collectors seem to ignore knives in their research and collecting, not really considering them tools per se.

We may never know anything more about this pattern, but it is interesting. I. for one, will continue to keep my eye out for an original new in the package example. That might tell me a lot and allow me to cross reference it with old records. If anyone runs across one, I would appreciate your bringing it to my attention.

Michael

 

[tongueriver]

Thank you very much for your pic and comments. Great stuff!

 

[Codger_64]

You're welcome tongueriver.

Something I didn't mention which I think is interesting about the Sears Craftsman Heavy Skinner. Of the examples I have seen, more often or not the handles are cracked on the top, bottom or both, where the tang enters. Perhaps this design flaw was the reason the pattern was dropped and not used as a production pattern.

 

[paul'ie]

Say Heah Guys, I wish I knew how to take a picture than enter it into a post I have a nice up sweep wooden handle with a choil on the blade that has no markings but a good condition knife that's very sharp in a very nice leather shesth, I don't dress game but I use this knife as a back up and it throws sparks like a sparkle and curls great because of its thin up swept blade the handles are wooden and tge gaurd appears aluminum the handle is wood and shaped very good to fit the hand sort of boxy but very comgortable.