Crime and punishment...

namaarie

namaarie

Joined
Aug 23, 2004
Messages
1,499
I'm sure I'm not the only one here who was stunned and sickened by this recent home invasion/murder in Connecticut. My dad thinks he once knew the husband/father who survived, back in school. Whether he did or not doesn't really matter--this story raises such a range of anger and questions regardless.

My first response was, without a doubt, that this whole situation would have been averted nicely with the proper use of a .45 or something. Talk about a situation where home defense would have been truly a lifesaver.

Then, my thought was how awful that poor guy must feel. To have been there, powerless to stop it, and to have lived when they did not. I know I'd never recover from that. God, what a world. :grumpy:

But then, to realize that the perps. were recently out of prison. That they had extensive records, and yet our system allowed them out to do this. I know that our prisons are overcrowded and I know that there are many complications, but this thing was so preventable. What's the answer? I really don't know, but there must be a better way.

I can't imagine how humans can commit such atrocities. Can anybody here even begin to fathom the kind of scenario that would lead a person or people to become OK with brutally killing an entire family? In pure cold blood? How can humans be so sick, so cruel? We see so much of it nowadays, but it never fails to stun me.

I guess I'm wondering, how can we, as a nation and a society, avert such catastrophes? I mean, personally, I'm keeping my AR-15 and my 1911 ready, but this is a problem with society-wide bearing and the answer must go beyond personal defense. These things happen, but they shouldn't.

Sorry to bring up a bummer, but I feel strongly about this and I think that there are some really good people here who know a lot more about the system than I do. What can be done? How can we, as a society, curtail the senseless violence that is becoming so tragically characteristic of our modern age?

Chris
 
Don't be afraid to speak your mind, Wolf. Popular or unpopular as an opinion might be, the Cantina is a place that will hear them all. The only rule left in this place is the Golden one.

Personally, I find the whole situation disgusting. I don't know how you fix it, but I know that disarming responsible citizens so that they cannot protect themselves is not the answer. Perhaps the difference between the human race and human civilization is that having a civilization gives a species the means to cut out the "bad spots". There will always be the sick and depraved that will prey upon the weak and unaware. It has to start with one's own person. In this world of ready made meals, reality TV, and the World Wide Web there will still be the chance encounters where one will have to choice life or death and in doing so may have to commit an act of violence.
 
0K.

IMO, TPTB actually want more crime, as:

It makes more $ for the lawyers,

more money for the doctors who treat the victims,

more excuses for more gun/knife control,

and more excuses to further their agenda of creating a totalitarian police state.




Occam's razor applies. If they truly wanted to nip crime in the bud, they'd enact a zero tolerance policy for heinous crimes such as murder, rape, child molestation.

But they don't. And that led me years ago to the conclusion I posted. Yes I'm cynical. Oh well.



Now I reckon I'll crawl under the porch.
 
They broke in at 3 A.M.-so unless you heard them--a gun would not have helped-if you're attacked by 2 armed men-while you're sleeping..(and I have a 1911 where I sleep)

Now an alarm system would have changed things--as would a Dog(any size) large enough to wake the Father.

As far as the 2 scum bags that did it---they will never get the level of punishment they deserve...on earth anyway.

Never forget that you might live in the the best house on the block--but that Criminals can drive there as easy as you did..

Make sure your children understand the type of world we live in...

And I hope the father gets to spend 5 minutes alone with each man before they send them to jail.

Sincerely

Dr.Bill Martin D.C.
 
Exactly, Ted. That was one thing that boggled my freakin' mind when the whole Katrina thing was going on. WHY were they taking the protection from law abiding citizens? They can't police that place worth very well under normal circumstances. How could they expect to watch out for everyone with a mass exodus going on? If I were a cop in a tough place like that, I sure wouldn't mind a few steadfast heads of the household taking out a few pieces of trash for me.

Wolf, you raise interesting points. I find that truth might have a little more to do with government bureaucracy than conspiracy. However, I have as much evidence to back my argument up as you do. The Big Brother noose has seemed to have tightened as of late. Whatever the reason, things are not right in the world both legally and morally.
 
Dr. Martin, you are right. An alarm probably would have made a big difference. All the guns and ammo in the world won't save you if your throat is slit while you sleep.
I think the lesson is that of awareness. The more time you have to respond, the greater your chances at survival.
 
Our legal system disgusts me.

Violent predators cannot be rehabilitated. If you mug someone, commit armed robbery, or forcibly rape someone -- and it can be proven to a jury beyond a reasonable doubt -- then you need to be executed ASAP.

Unfortunately, meth and crack addicts generally cannot be rehabilitated either, although execution for such a one would be deemed unduely harsh. HOWEVER, those who choose to manufacture, traffick, and deal such poisons should be executed as well.

"But no," our legal system sez, "We should lock these predators up with other criminals for a few years, allowing them to continue to victimize others while we mistreat them, until their resentment and hatred towards society festers like a boil . . . and then we'll release them back on the streets."

Our legal system seems to think that the best solution is simply to outlaw honest citizens' means of self protection against these animals. But the animals don't care about going back to prison, so they feel free to ignore any and all laws pertaining to weapons and violence.
 
Steely_Gunz said:
Dr. Martin, you are right. An alarm probably would have made a big difference. All the guns and ammo in the world won't save you if your throat is slit while you sleep.
I think the lesson is that of awareness. The more time you have to respond, the greater your chances at survival.
Click to expand...

I agree 110%

and speaking of Throat slitting---perhaps one of the fellows in prison will do us TAX PAYERS a favor--and do that to each of them...

I can only hope
 
Steely_Gunz said:
Wolf, you raise interesting points. I find that truth might have a little more to do with government bureaucracy than conspiracy. However, I have as much evidence to back my argument up as you do. The Big Brother noose has seemed to have tightened as of late. Whatever the reason, things are not right in the world both legally and morally.
Click to expand...

I used to believe it was just a matter of bureaucratic monkey business until I began paying attention and questioning things.

Bureaucracy is a large factor though.



When I compare fact #1:

Criminals often get a comparative slap-on-the-wrist after committing a serious crime.

to fact #2:

The-Powers-That-Be are jumping at every opportunity for more gun/knife control because they are allegedly "determined to end violent crime".


I can't help but wonder if fact #1 and fact #2 might be related somehow.

My conclusion is they in fact want MORE crime because it furthers their agenda (see fact #2) because instead of cracking down on criminals, they crack down on those of us who obey the law.
 
tyr_shadowblade said:
Our legal system disgusts me.

Violent predators cannot be rehabilitated. If you mug someone, commit armed robbery, or forcibly rape someone -- and it can be proven to a jury beyond a reasonable doubt -- then you need to be executed ASAP.
Click to expand...

I agree.

In the old days they had something called "The Gallows". Public execution was an excellent deterrent.
 
Wolf_1989 said:
Criminals often get a comparative slap-on-the-wrist after committing a serious crime.
Click to expand...

Yeah, but they'll throw the book at an honest citizen with a clean record who violates a weapon law, and will even twist and reinterpret the law to convict them of a crime that a good attorney could've gotten dismissed. And if you actually use the weapon? Then you've become a "vigilante" whom the judge and prosecutor feel obligated to "make an example of" and you'll get the maximum allowable sentence with no plea bargaining.

A criminal who shoots someone in an argument or robs a store at gunpoint typically gets several charges dismissed and part of the sentence suspended.
 
Well lets hope there never released again, full lock down with out any exercise &no human contact ever & food through a hole in bottom of door, would be good & would give them time to contemplate thier actions & the result on thier own lives.

This struck me as an interistng vid. on same page as the one linked to, sure its sort of relative in a strange way.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=i9xf62PKC5M&mode=related&search=

Spiral
 
tyr_shadowblade said:
Yeah, but they'll throw the book at an honest citizen with a clean record who violates a weapon law, and will even twist and reinterpret the law to convict them of a crime that a good attorney could've gotten dismissed. And if you actually use the weapon? Then you've become a "vigilante" whom the judge and prosecutor feel obligated to "make an example of" and you'll get the maximum allowable sentence with no plea bargaining.

A criminal who shoots someone in an argument or robs a store at gunpoint typically gets several charges dismissed and part of the sentence suspended.
Click to expand...

Exactly.

If they REALLY wanted to crack down on crime, the reverse would be the norm.
 
Ultimate in scary. Yes, an alarm might have helped, but if a home invasion happens, how many of us are really ready to deal with it. I"m ready to be aware of my surroundings and notice a bad neighborhood, suspicious strangers, etc., but when I'm home, I relax. If somebody kicks in my door, runs up the stairs and grabs my son, my wife or me, I'm just not ready to handle that and I daresay that most people without military or police training are and probably not even many of them.
 
As I sit here, I have a loaded Ruger 44mag and a tomahawk in reach, and there's a 107 lb half-german shepherd next to me. Nothing escapes his attention.
 
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