CS Hawk vs. FT Hawk: Is FT worth the price difference?

No they are not. I just got the full run around from Dana.

I got a Camp Hawk in the mail about two months after ordering it. I posted an unboxing of it when I go it. I can understand the wait time, as he hand forges them.

When I went to go sharpen it however (because it came with a very steep edge with a heavy burr), I was having huge problems with micro chips. Not from use either, from sharpening it. And I am very good at sharpening my tools, every one of my knives, axes hawks and hatchet will shave.

I contacted Dana, and we both agreed that the bit was over hard, probably in the mid to high 60's on the HRC scale. He told me to put it on my belt sander and get rid of the edge that was on it. Flaten the edge basically. So I did. I re beveled the edge, and re sharpened it. Still having major problems with chipping.

He tells me that he will pay for shipping to him back, then he will re heat treat it, temper it, and send it back to me free of charge. Sounds great. So out it goes the next business day via priority mail international.

About a week and a half later I receive a phone call from Dana. He says that the edge I put on it was beautiful, and he would be proud to have it for himself. But he says that he can't see what the heck I was talking about.

He said he put it under a "special" micro scope and could only see a minor roll over. He also said he had to put his reading glasses on to see it with his eyes.

Well, when I had it I could look at the edge, and it looked like a hacksaw blade. Even after a fair amount of time on medium, fine and extra fine ceramic stones, finished off with fresh green stropping compound on a leather strop.

He said it popped hairs off his arms, and sliced paper "extremely well". At this point I was speechless. I asked for re heat treatment, but he said there was no reason whatsoever for him to do that. Even though he said it would only take him about 15 minuets to do. I asked if it would be possible to exchange it for another one. But he said that that was "unreasonable".

All of this went on at abut 8:00 PST. So the next morning, without me telling him how I want to proceed, I get an email telling me that it is in the mail back.

Now at that point I was seething mad. I was told that the shipping charges were to be paid for, and my hawk was going to be re heat treated. None of that happened.

I get it back in the same condition I sent it away in. Complete garbage. He sent along a piece of normal copy paper that he "cut" with the hawk. I could "cut" a piece of paper and get the exact same results that he got with a 1/8" piece of sheet metal.

My CS pipe hawk is x100 better then this piece of crap FT hawk. I will never buy from him again.
 
I don't think your request for a different one is out of line at all. He should have just sent you a different one or gave your money back whichever you prefered. Thats what most respectable knife makers would have done or offered to do. I'm sorry to hear about your situation, you definately have an ax to grind with the man.
Good luck with your outcome, i hope it all gets worked out for the better.


Doug
 
That sucks had the same problem sent it back and he fixed it
. He should of replaced yours
 
He should have, but I'm stuck with it now.

He said that it was costing him a lot of time and money to deal with this, which he would gladly absorb "if there was a problem with the hawk". So I guess he sees a tomahawk edge looking like a hacksaw, which is in the high 60's HRC, and thinks it is good to go. And because I live in Canada, I had to pay for international shipping....twice. All in all I have about $145 invested into this piece of garbage. The only thing remotely useful about it is the hardened hammer poll.
 
Wood Splitter said:
He should have, but I'm stuck with it now.

He said that it was costing him a lot of time and money to deal with this, which he would gladly absorb "if there was a problem with the hawk". So I guess he sees a tomahawk edge looking like a hacksaw, which is in the high 60's HRC, and thinks it is good to go. And because I live in Canada, I had to pay for international shipping....twice. All in all I have about $145 invested into this piece of garbage. The only thing remotely useful about it is the hardened hammer poll.
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When you get a chance Woodsplitter could you post a pic ? Would like to see if it looks like mine did before i sent it back. Thanks Rich
 
LEGION 12 said:
When you get a chance Woodsplitter could you post a pic ? Would like to see if it looks like mine did before i sent it back. Thanks Rich
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When I got it back from him the last time, I took it out and ground the edge down at a 90 degree angle. I ground off enough steel to get rid of all the chips. I then re profiled it for the second time.
When I got it inside, all it needed was a few passes on a butchers steel, and a stropping to get it pretty sharp. It still has very small chips in the edge that would not be picked up by my camera.
The problem is when I actually sharpen it on a stone. When I am putting even the slightest pressure on the edge while I am sharpening it on a ceramic stone, it chips pieces of the edge like one would knap flint.
I have a lot of experience with 1095, and this edge is waaaay to hard. I have the edge alright at the moment, and I don't want to mess it up just to take a picture. That would mean another few hours trying to fix it again.

And no the problem does not lye with my stones. I use the same methods on all my axes, hatchets, hawks and knives with no problems whatsoever.
 
Wood Splitter said:
When I got it back from him the last time, I took it out and ground the edge down at a 90 degree angle. I ground off enough steel to get rid of all the chips. I then re profiled it for the second time.
When I got it inside, all it needed was a few passes on a butchers steel, and a stropping to get it pretty sharp. It still has very small chips in the edge that would not be picked up by my camera.
The problem is when I actually sharpen it on a stone. When I am putting even the slightest pressure on the edge while I am sharpening it on a ceramic stone, it chips pieces of the edge like one would knap flint.
I have a lot of experience with 1095, and this edge is waaaay to hard. I have the edge alright at the moment, and I don't want to mess it up just to take a picture. That would mean another few hours trying to fix it again.

And no the problem does not lye with my stones. I use the same methods on all my axes, hatchets, hawks and knives with no problems whatsoever.
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I should of taken a pic of mine before i sent back but i didnt im on your side i ruined my file trying to get rid of the chips on mine before i decided to send it back . He told me the same thing he told you that is was a bad heat treat after he received it he agreed thats what the problem was and that he would re heat treat it which he must have because when i got it back it was fine no chips . The edge was a little rough but a few minutes on some diamond stones it sharpened up real nice . I wonder how many more are out there with a bad heat treat but people dont know any better . After waiting four months having to send it back and reading abought yours i doubt if i would ever order another one from him again either but i think im done buying new hawks for awile .
 
Wood Splitter said:
I would recommend a CS pipe hawk for general woods work. It is my favorite all around hawk. It just needs some work to the edge when you get it.
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I have access to a belt grinder so that shouldn't be a problem. I'd go Wolf Creek but they're still backordered. I could probably get a spike hawk and a pipe hawk for less than a FT and have defense and woods taken care of. :P Are the vietnam or trench hawks any good for anything?
 
Wood Splitter said:
Check out this guys YT channel for a bunch of practical use reviews of almost every CS hawk. http://www.youtube.com/user/ZEUKI1

I would also look into getting a Wolf Creek. I would personally wait the extra time to get one. Although CS hawks are good with a little work.
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I may get a WC in the future and I know they take work but I have til the end of July before I head over to Texas to spend some time in the wilderness for a few weeks. :P I've also watched his videos so I know to go pipe hawk but I find very limited reviews on the 'Nam hawk
 
Is there anything wrong with Two hawks stuff? I've been looking at some of his hawks lately on line. I wonder what his backlog woud be.
 
I have seen photos of one of his hawks that broke clean off near the eye, but I believe it was replaced with no problems. Other then that I have heard very good things about them.
 
Well i guess it can happen if not forged just right. That really sucks Wood Splitter and the rest of you guys with the faulty hawks. You would think he would know not to harden a hawk bit that hard. Whats going to happen when you beat on some hardwood i wonder. Well at any rate be careful with that hawk, and you may want to wear safety glasses if you do start beating on something with it.
 
d762nato said:
Well i guess it can happen if not forged just right. That really sucks Wood Splitter and the rest of you guys with the faulty hawks. You would think he would know not to harden a hawk bit that hard. Whats going to happen when you beat on some hardwood i wonder. Well at any rate be careful with that hawk, and you may want to wear safety glasses if you do start beating on something with it.
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I may be wrong but from what I know you usually want to keep a hawk or hatchet a little softer. I may be talking out of my ass though.
 
VolundoftheForge said:
I may be wrong but from what I know you usually want to keep a hawk or hatchet a little softer. I may be talking out of my ass though.
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A good axe or hatchet should be mid to high 50's HRC. Dana said that a hawk is a utility tool and does not need to be as sharp as I wanted it to be....Hence the reason he saw no problem with my hawk. Which in my opinion is complete BS.

I am pretty sure most of you guys keep your axes hatchets and hawks pretty much shaving sharp. I don't think I need to explain why sharper is better to you guys;)

Anyway....I guess I just have a very scary looking hammer now! :D

I wouldn't want to chop with this hawk anyway. It reeeally hurts your hands while chopping there is so much vibration.
 
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