CS Trailmaster SK5

[Bowie Mike]

I took out my carbon V trailmaster today and re-confirmed that it is one of the best knives I own.

The balance, weight, blade shape, full grind, and chopping power are tough to beat for the price.

I was courious if anyone has tried the new SK5 version. I was considering getting a second one, but I'm not sure of the quality of this steel.

I recently discovered the awesome S30V steel (via Benchmade), and now I look much closer at steel types.

Thanks for any input.

Mike

 

[ashtxsniper]

I have been wondering the same thing...............free bump

 

[mrostov]

SK-5 is a lot like 1080 or 1085 steel, similar to what a lawnmower blade is normally made of.

The original carbon steel SOG Tigersharks were made of this.

 

[Bowie Mike]

SK-5 is a lot like 1080 or 1085 steel, similar to what a lawnmower blade is normally made of.

The original carbon steel SOG Tigersharks were made of this.

How would these compare with the Carbon 5 - I've never owned a SOG - thanks

 

[mrostov]

How would these compare with the Carbon 5 - I've never owned a SOG - thanks

Carbon V is Cold Steel's marketing name for 0170-6C tool steel, which is the same steel the Beckers were made out of, the same steel Marbles uses, and the same steel that Western used to call 'Chrome Vanadium'. This steel has been in use in better quality carbon steel knives for a long time.

Cold Steel quit using 0170-6C because the main knife maker left that was mass producing knives in this steel under contract for others was Camillus, and they made all of the Carbon V knives under contract for Cold Steel until Camillus went out of business recently.

SK-5 is OK, durable, and can take an edge, especially with a good heat and cryo treat. This steel is basically an Asian version of 1085 carbon steel, that is pretty much just plain steel with 0.85% carbon in it. The manufacture of these knives are probably being farmed out to Asia, hence SK-5 being used instead of the old time mainstay knife steel of 1095 like Ontario uses on many of it's knives.

The old, well used 1095 (what Kabar USMC fighting knives and USAF survival knives are made of) is a better knife steel than SK-5, and it has 0.95% carbon. The lower grade 1085 and SK-5 are often used my some small, custom knife makers and for many homemade knives because 1085 and SK-5 are what lawnmower blades are often made of. Many a knife blank has been cut out of an old, worn out, lawnmower blade.

0170-6C (aka Carbon V), is tougher, more durable, has a higher carbon content, and is even somewhat more corrosion resistant. This steel has some chromium and some vanadium (lacking in steels like 1085), and 1.00% carbon.

 

[DaleW]

.... Many a knife blank has been cut out of an old, worn out, lawnmower blade.

You know, I've been cooking this idea of making a tool specifically for batoning (a backwoods froe) and this REALLY got the gears turning. Thanks!

 

[nephildevil]

0170-6C (aka Carbon V), is tougher, more durable, has a higher carbon content, and is even somewhat more corrosion resistant. This steel has some chromium and some vanadium (lacking in steels like 1085), and 1.00% carbon.

so purely looking at the steel, its a step back, a less good knife

 

[Bowie Mike]

so purely looking at the steel, its a step back, a less good knife

I would agree - thanks for the info mrostov.:thumbup:

With Camillus gone, a good CS Trailmaster is also gone, as well as the BK9s.

I hope someone steps into market to replace two great knives made from good steel - at a good price.

I have RAT 7 in D2, but I prefer a 9-1/2" blade.

 

[Jan P]

Some years ago I did a very informal comparative chopping test with my SOG SK5 Tigershark and my Becker BK9. The SOG takes a scary edge but did not hold it as well as the Becker. Actually there was a noticable difference in edge holding. I don't know the Rc of the SOG though but from the feel when sharpening it is softer than the BK9.

 

[the possum]

For all practicaly purposes, I would not consider the steel itself to be any sort of step backwards.

The other elements in 0170-6C may help with things like wear resistance, which may or may not have any benefits at all depending on how you'd use your knife.

This steel is basically an Asian version of 1085 carbon steel, that is pretty much just plain steel with 0.85% carbon in it.
The old, well used 1095 is a better knife steel than SK-5, and it has 0.95% carbon.

For a big knife, especially one that will see impacts from chopping or general hacking/abuse, the higher carbon of 1095 would be worse. Actually a lower carbon grade like 1050 or 1060 would be much tougher, because at these carbon percentages the steel forms mostly lath martensite which is a tougher form than the plate martensite formed in higher carbon steels. You get a mix of both types with carbon contents in between.

If you want to make a fine slicer with a hardness of 64+ Rc, then 1095 makes sense. Despite it's widespread use, I don't see much sense in using it on a big knife and then tempering it down, when other alloys would be tougher at the same hardness.
In the end, the only way anyone would probably notice a difference between these two steels in normal use, would depend entirely on how the steel is heat treated and what hardness they settle on for this knife.

 

[Dr. Mudd]

Mrostov, thanks a lot for your excellent and authoritative sounding information comparing Cold Steel's older Carbon V steel to its newer steel. I don't doubt that you are correct, but could you give us the source of that information or tell us how you came know all about it? For those of us who have prized the Carbon V knives this is a significant change in CS's blades. I am very pleased to own about two lifetimes' supply of the older CS knives, thanks in part to buying some of their "seconds" when their prices were too good to pass up. Every few years I get something right.

 

[ashtxsniper]

I am glad I got plenty of carbon v when I could.

 

[mrostov]

Mrostov, thanks a lot for your excellent and authoritative sounding information comparing Cold Steel's older Carbon V steel to its newer steel. I don't doubt that you are correct, but could you give us the source of that information or tell us how you came know all about it? For those of us who have prized the Carbon V knives this is a significant change in CS's blades. I am very pleased to own about two lifetimes' supply of the older CS knives, thanks in part to buying some of their "seconds" when their prices were too good to pass up. Every few years I get something right.

I wrote that from memory. It's just stuff I've learned over the years from both paper print and web. I looked for a couple of links I had on SK-5 but couldn't find them but I read up on it some time ago when dealing with an old, SK-5 Tigershark. The info on SK-5 out there on the web is scarce, and usually from an Asian source.

If you'll notice, Cold Steel's ultra cheap Bushman knives have always been made of SK-5, and their manufacture was farmed out to Asia. Now that their higher end knives in carbon are in the same league as the Bushman, I'm curious to see if there is a suitable price drop in the SK-5 blades now that they are using lower grade, cheaper Asian steel and the knives are mass produced in Asia.

The better knives that Cold Steel now offers is their 'San Mai III in VG-1' which is just another renaming of an existing steel, which in this case is VG-10 laminated steel, which is what the Fallkniven blades are made of. The center layer in this Asian made stainless laminate has a carbon of 1.00%.

IMHO, for the prices that I've seen for some of Cold Steel's stuff, they should start making some it out of S30V or ATS-34 (aka 154CM).

 

[TimeConstant]

ashtxsniper: Wow. Just like.... Wow

 

[Bowie Mike]

......IMHO, for the prices that I've seen for some of Cold Steel's stuff, they should start making some it out of S30V or ATS-34 (aka 154CM).

I completely agree. I just discovered S30V through Benchmade (Rukus) - truely an awesome steel. I have a few of the Buck Alpha series in ATS-34, also a great steel. I would buy a lot more Bucks if they made more knives with ATS-34.


If they would make Trailmasters in S30V, my shelves would look like Ashtxsniper's.

 

[mrostov]

I completely agree. I just discovered S30V through Benchmade (Rukus) - truely an awesome steel. I have a few of the Buck Alpha series in ATS-34, also a great steel. I would buy a lot more Bucks if they made more knives with ATS-34.


If they would make Trailmasters in S30V, my shelves would look like Ashtxsniper's.

They made a 7" Becker out of S30V called the 'Becker Extreme' but it was around $250. Probably one of the best, factory production, large (10") blades you can get at the moment is a Fallkniven Thor.

Here is a link to a special series of Buck's most popular hunting knives made for Cabelas. It's called the 'Alaskan Guide Series'. They all have blades of cryo treated S30V.

LINK

 

[Bowie Mike]

Thanks for the link Mrostov.

I have been looking at the Thor for a long time, but haven't been able to drop the $300 for it. I used most of my knives and it would be hard for me to take a full swing into a log at that price.

However, now that I understand steel a little better, I am convinced that paying a little more for a knife with good steel is better than paying less for, what I'll call, "a medium quality knife". I have a lot of them.

Anybody own a Thor, any comments?

Thanks

 

[mrostov]

One knife that is often overlooked is the Marbles Trailmaker. It's got a 10" blade of 0170-6C tool steel hardened to Rc58. The ones I've handled had a full tapered bevel with a convex grind. Every carbon blade knife I've seen from Marbles has been a REALLY nice knife. Having used both, I'd much rather have one of these than a Cold Steel 'Carbon V' Trailmaster. They are also a lot less expensive than a Fallkniven Thor, often as much as 1/3 to 1/2 less depending upon handle material, though they are still a first class knife. I have seen a few limited production run copies with a Damascus blade and handles are commonly available in stag antler, jigged bone, stacked leather, and curly oak.

http://www.marblesoutdoors.com/cutlery/trailmaker.html

 

[S. Brown]

Anybody own a Thor, any comments?

Thanks

I have a thor and I love it. That thing bites so far into wood with its ridiculously sharp edge its not even funny. It is a great knife. The blade is as strong as anything and the vg-10 takes a REALLY sharp edge and is not as difficult to sharpen as s30v.

 

[Random04]

I've got a Trailmaker with a bone handle, got it for around $180 or so. I admit that I haven't had a chance to use it a lot yet, but it's a sweet knife. Well balanced, great edge, and I've got a lot of respect for the steel. Hopefully I'll be able to get out a play in the next week or so.