curious about specific makers and steels

[NJBillK]

I am looking to start carrying more traditional folders. I only have One and it is some 70s one I haven't been able to get identified. I found it unrusted with a jigged faux bone handle under a deck I was demo'ing... The deck was built late 70s early 80s, so that is my reference for a guessed age on the knife.

BUT, back to my question... Do you folks have certain steels that you prefer from certain builders and different steels from others? Such as does "trad maker A" produce a nice s30v but you prefer "trad maker B" when it comes to 01, or 154cm?

Since I am new to traditionals, I am looking to find out how particular I should be when it comes to both the steel chosen And the person crafting it, aside from just competency...

Thanks in advance
Bill

 

[yablanowitz]

If you are going to carry traditionals, you'll need to get used to 1095 carbon and 420HC stainless, with some 440 series stuff to liven things up. Queen used to do a good job with their D2, probably still do but I haven't tried one since they changed ownership. Higher end steels like S30V, 154CM and ATS-34 are pretty rare unless you go custom.

 

[NJBillK]

Ok, that's fine. With this all being new to me, I would like to know what to expect and a few names to keep an eye out for in local shops and if there are some particular steels to keep in mind, such as Queens d2, all the better.

I think I have an idea for a new thread due to this one. I would love to still hear from others regarding their thoughts.

 

[jkulysses]

Not sure what patterns you're looking for but Canal Street Cutlery is one of the only companies that I know of producing slip joints using modern steels. Their Barlow for example uses 14-4 CrMo blade steel which is just another name for 154CM. They also feature full stainless steel backsprings, liners and even bolsters so they will stay looking nice and shiny for a long long time with very little effort. I've had several of their knives now and find them to be comparable to GEC as far as fit and finish go they just don't have the selection of different patterns that GEC offers. Excellent knives though so I would check them out for sure.

Jake

 

[pinnah]

To answer your question, yes, definitely, you really need to consider the knife maker.

The knife manufacturer gets steel that has not been heat treated yet so that they can form it into blades.

After this, the heat treatment is applied and how the heat treat is applied varies considerably.

A good example of this is Case and Buck. Both use 420HC but there is a noticeable difference between the two.

It's hard to say better or worse here. Folks have different preferences in heat treat and hardness, just as they do in the base steel. Match the reputation to your preference.

 

[PghSteve]

If you are going to carry traditionals, you'll need to get used to 1095 carbon and 420HC stainless, with some 440 series stuff to liven things up. Queen used to do a good job with their D2, probably still do but I haven't tried one since they changed ownership. Higher end steels like S30V, 154CM and ATS-34 are pretty rare unless you go custom.

You're calling 154CM a better steel than D2? I strongly disagree with that overall, but I guess it depends on what you're looking for in your steel.

 

[PghSteve]

If you are going to carry traditionals, you'll need to get used to 1095 carbon and 420HC stainless, with some 440 series stuff to liven things up. Queen used to do a good job with their D2, probably still do but I haven't tried one since they changed ownership. Higher end steels like S30V, 154CM and ATS-34 are pretty rare unless you go custom.

Yablanowitz,
You're putting 154CM and ATS-34 above D2 in knife steel quality? I highly disagree with that from what I've read and understand about blade steel...but due to your 7300 posts here I have to assume you are substantially more knowledgeable than me. For a fixed blade bushcraft or hunting style knife, I consider D2 to be near the top of the line due to it's "almost" stainless properties, wear resistance, and toughness. I even generally would prefer the D2 vs the S30V. What am I missing on this?

 

[Chris Montgomery]

Yablanowitz,
You're putting 154CM and ATS-34 above D2 in knife steel quality? I highly disagree with that from what I've read and understand about blade steel...but due to your 7300 posts here I have to assume you are substantially more knowledgeable than me. For a fixed blade bushcraft or hunting style knife, I consider D2 to be near the top of the line due to it's "almost" stainless properties, wear resistance, and toughness. I even generally would prefer the D2 vs the S30V. What am I missing on this?

One thing to consider in your statement is what experience the person has had with those steels. I have owned at least one knife with all three of those steels mentioned. The one I owned in D2 was improperly heat treated. That left a sour taste in my mouth for that steel for several years, actually until I saw what properly heat treated D2 was capable of. The same could have happened with 154CM or ATS-34. So it bears mentioning that personal experience with certain steels can be bias based on one bad experience. I have also had production knives in 1095 from different factories that perform so different that I could have written it off as useless from one or been a staunch supporter from the other.

So it is my feeling that the question raised by the OP is not only valid but should be answered as thoroughly as we can.

All that being said, GEC dose a fine job on their 1095 and I have enjoyed using their product.

Case knives in CV are nice to use and sharpen but they will need sharpening just a little more often. Not terribly so just a bit.

The Traditionals in 154 CM I have used have been handmade and the maker did a fine job heat treating. It takes a bit more work to get that perfect edge, however it has been worth the additional effort.
Chris

 

[Peregrin]

Yablanowitz,
You're putting 154CM and ATS-34 above D2 in knife steel quality? I highly disagree with that from what I've read and understand about blade steel...but due to your 7300 posts here I have to assume you are substantially more knowledgeable than me. For a fixed blade bushcraft or hunting style knife, I consider D2 to be near the top of the line due to it's "almost" stainless properties, wear resistance, and toughness. I even generally would prefer the D2 vs the S30V. What am I missing on this?

I don't think that was the point Yablanowitz was making. All the steels referred to are good blade steel. I'd also prefer D2 in a fixed blade knife but any one of those would be fine in a slip joint.

To the OP's question you can find some real nice manufactured knives with D2, 154CM and ATS-34. Schatt and Morgan File and Wire Series use D2 and ATS-34. As was already mentioned Queen offers D2. I've used them all and they are done well. You just need to keep your eyes open and look for them.

If you're looking at custom knife makers most of them will make a knife in the steel you prefer. You'll see a lot of them using CPM-154 right now. It makes a real nice blade.

You'll see much talk about heat treating and Blade geometry. Both are as important if not more important then the steel itself. Saying that, I've never had a bad blade made by any of the above companies or any custom maker.

 

[matt009au]

I used to care more about the blade steel, until I started using cases 420hc and really liked it. Now it is generally the pattern and handle material (in that order) which are more important for me when buying a knife (although a nice steel helps). In my opinion any steel from any of the leading quality traditional makers (case, canal st, queen, buck, gec, opinel etc.) Will be more than adequate for most peoples everyday use.

On that note, for what it is worth my preference is for canal st 14-4 crmo or d2 from queen.