damascus as user

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stokka

Joined
Sep 4, 2006
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Just wanted to know if anybody has damascus as a user. What are the impressions, pros and cons.

Tnx!
 
Hmmm, me too, lol, I only own expensive (over $100) damascus knives, but I was interested in buying a cheaper one (by cheaper I mean @ $50) and using it...
 
I make damascus. I've used it and have many customers that do as well. I've had nothing but great reviews, and reports of some very hard use. Sometimes guys seem a little too enthusiastic about their experiences.

The fact is that, if made properly, including appropriate heat treating, damascus should perform as well as the constituent alloys in the mix.
Sometimes people are very impressed with the performance of good damascus steel (such as the popular and venerable 1086/15N20 combination) and I believe that has a lot to do with the fact that few are familiar with the excellent characteristics of good carbon steel blades to begin with. Most people are used to mediocre stainless or other compromise materials. They'd probably be equally impressed with a nicely made 1086 monosteel blade.

For working knives, I'd stay away from a blade that has nickel in the pattern running across the edge and damascus mixes that use non-hardening steel steels (such as mild steel) except under very special circumstances.

Assuming you have a good material to start with, I think the biggest factor to knife performance is geometry.
 
JCaswell said:
I make damascus. I've used it and have many customers that do as well. I've had nothing but great reviews, and reports of some very hard use. Sometimes guys seem a little too enthusiastic about their experiences.

The fact is that, if made properly, including appropriate heat treating, damascus should perform as well as the constituent alloys in the mix.
Sometimes people are very impressed with the performance of good damascus steel (such as the popular and venerable 1086/15N20 combination) and I believe that has a lot to do with the fact that few are familiar with the excellent characteristics of good carbon steel blades to begin with. Most people are used to mediocre stainless or other compromise materials. They'd probably be equally impressed with a nicely made 1086 monosteel blade.

For working knives, I'd stay away from a blade that has nickel in the pattern running across the edge and damascus mixes that use non-hardening steel steels (such as mild steel) except under very special circumstances.

Assuming you have a good material to start with, I think the biggest factor to knife performance is geometry.
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OK, so which damaskus materials can compete with a good high carbon steel?
[edited] also does not 15N20 has nickel in it?

tnx.


Franciscomv

Looking forward to seeing your review.
 
JCaswell said:
...damascus should perform as well as the constituent alloys in the mix...

...They'd probably be equally impressed with a nicely made 1086 monosteel blade...
Click to expand...

This is very important to hear from real damascus master. Because sometimes it is promouted as a miraculas technology which outperforms monosteel blades. And only if it is done by good bladesmith.

Thea real value of damascus is beauty and uniqueness, and this what is right to expect.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
stokka said:
OK, so which damaskus materials can compete with a good high carbon steel?
[edited] also does not 15N20 has nickel in it?
Click to expand...

Most damascus is made from carbon steel, and as I mentioned, if done properly, the damascus material should be as good as the monosteel carbon steel that is also 'done properly.'

Stainless damascus can perform as well as it's constituent steels as well.

15-N-20 is a very nice steel to use with carbon steel. (It's a great steel on it's own too). It contains about 1.5% nickel and .75 carbon. It behaves a lot like 1075 as one would expect, but provides nice contrast due to the nickel.

When I say to avoid nickel in a pattern that crosses the edge, I'm talking about pure nickel which is used by makers for it's dynamic contrast. It's use in a blade is, in my opinion, sub optimal, especially around the cutting edge. (Unlike 15-N-20, pure nickel doesn't harden.)

Using mild steel, or other non-hardening materials, also strikes me as sub-optimal, though there can be application under certain circumstances. For a working knife I'd stick with a mix that only contains materials that would make a great knife on their own.
 
I've a stainless damascus folder made by HOSS II, using HOSS I's damascus... I use the heck out of it... It's steel, and it holds an edge... no better and no worse than any of the wonder steel blades I have nor the forged blades I use...
As long as the geometry and the heat treat are done well, you probably won't notice the difference unless you use a blade as your primary tool for 8 hours a day...
 
Hey Guys...

Oh ya,, they can be used as EDC knives..

I've got several damasteel custom knives that I use All the time..
They hold a good edge,, and they actually have a nice toothy edge..Like micro serrations...

Good cutters IMHO...

ttyle

Eric
O/ST
 
Damasteel is a good product. If you care to get the most out of it (in HT), it can be a very high-performing steel.
 
Mark, that is very good to know - I am looking for a good cutter and strong edge retention.

Nozh2002, so you feel that there is nothing damascus can offer for a user, that I would not have with high carbon steel? I can get 1095 and 15N20 damascus relatively inexpensive (it would have RC about 57). What carbon steel you would compare that with.

JCaswell, does pattern and the number of layers play any role for a user? I mean - I value the looks of a knife, but I value the function more. Looking at the Swamp Rap knife prices, I doubt that I can take it and dig a whole in a dirt with it without thinking that I am doing something I should not be doing. IF for the half of that price I can have a damascus and if it will perform close, then I would be sooo happy. The real question is how realistic is this my idea..

tnx!!
 
I prefer 1086 to 1095
There are circumstances where construction could be a factor. A tight twist, for instance can yield a micro 'toothy' character as described above while a 'random' pattern would probably not do that so much. I wouldn't consider this a huge factor.
When it comes to the performance you allude to, the grind will be most important assuming the damascus is a mix of good materials properly HTd.
 
Damascus in the sense of just a layered variant of monosteel(s) naturally doesn't add any functional though surely aesthetic advantages.
In the sense of the multi-layered composition of Japanese blades, with at least one or two up to several (suminagashi) softer (stainless) layers surrounding a high-carbon core, the functional advantages are obvious.
Aesthetic damascus is naturally more of a looker than a user.
 
tristram said:
In the sense of the multi-layered composition of Japanese blades, with at least one or two up to several (suminagashi) softer (stainless) layers surrounding a high-carbon core, the functional advantages are obvious.
Click to expand...

Respectfully, I think these advantages have evaporated with the advent of the modern steels, just as the functional advantages of traditional European pattern welding have. The obvious mechanical advantages of these techniques are overcome by the superior chemistry and processing of modern steels. (Though I think using traditional techniques but with the best modern materials is a worthy endeavor that shouldn't sacrifice function if done properly.)

I hate to say it, but if you were to pit a fine, old traditionally-made Japanese sword against something like a modern Criswell (I think he uses A2), and torture them to destruction, the A2 sword would most likely outperform. (probably spectacularly so.)
 
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