Definition of a high-end folder

philwar

philwar

Joined
Mar 27, 2009
Messages
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My collection of folders I consider high-end is growing, and more is on the way. But even for myself it is not very clear what I consider high-end. Some folders are just expensive, and considered high-end just for that.
Some are not that expensive but look and feel it, are clearly different from folders like a Cold Steel Voyager or a Kershaw Scamp (brands that also make high-end stuff).

So I'd like to hear from you all, what do you consider high-end? Does it require high price? Exclusive blade steel, or other materials? Design? Are there properties it can't have, like an FRN handle, or cheap blade steel?

Your thoughts please. Brand examples, construction, materials, F&F, designers, it's all good.
 
  1. Materials
  2. Fit and Finish
  3. Design
  4. Durability
  5. Function

Knives like CRK, Strider, Hinderer, William Henry.

While blade steel does matter, once just can't slap something like a S30V blade in a knife then call it high end as we have seen some cheaper knives with S30V blades.

There are knives with AUS-8 blades that I would consider higher end than some with so called better steels.
 
Ankerson said:
  1. Materials
  2. Fit and Finish
  3. Design
  4. Durability
  5. Function
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I say the two highlighted bits out of this list. Design/durability/function, they're all in the eye of the beholder. But something that is well built is well built to everyone. And something that is made out of good stuff is just made out of good stuff, be it expensive stuff or hard wearing stuff.

I've held high end folders in the tactical range and in the art/custom range. They all felt high end because of BOTH the materials AND the fit and finish, even when I didn't like the design or intended use.
 
Ankerson said:
  1. Materials
  2. Fit and Finish
  3. Design
  4. Durability
  5. Function

Knives like CRK, Strider, Hinderer, William Henry.

While blade steel does matter, once just can't slap something like a S30V blade in a knife then call it high end as we have seen some cheaper knives with S30V blades.

There are knives with AUS-8 blades that I would consider higher end than some with so called better steels.
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Well said. For me the most important are the first 2 mentioned criteria. Fit and Finish is for me the most important followed by materials.
 
Personally, I would feel that in the description of "high end," the "end" field would be referring to it's price tag. To say such is merely a way of shortening the sentence "high end of the price spectrum," I would think. In so saying, I would imagine that high end knives would inherently be the more expensive ones. It's like saying "top shelf" whiskey. It's the more expensive of the lot, but as a colloquial term, we say "top shelf." I do feel, however, that high end does not necessarily equate to high quality, which is what I feel you're describing. High quality can come at a high cost, and sadly, so can low quality. Depends on how well the manufacturer can dupe the buyer, I guess.
 
Apebrains said:
Personally, I would feel that in the description of "high end," the "end" field would be referring to it's price tag. To say such is merely a way of shortening the sentence "high end of the price spectrum," I would think. In so saying, I would imagine that high end knives would inherently be the more expensive ones. It's like saying "top shelf" whiskey. It's the more expensive of the lot, but as a colloquial term, we say "top shelf." I do feel, however, that high end does not necessarily equate to high quality, which is what I feel you're describing. High quality can come at a high cost, and sadly, so can low quality. Depends on how well the manufacturer can dupe the buyer, I guess.
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This.

It's why you commonly hear a Tenacious being described as "feeling like a high end folder" (not that I agree) despite it's low cost.
 
I think it implies more than just price or people would say 'it feels like an expensive folder'. I would say high end means a well crafted knife out of quality materials.

I personally would never call a knife with AUS8 steel a high end knife because for me a high end knife needs to have a superior blade steel that holds an edge for a long time. For me materials are more important than fit and finish. I care more about function than looks.
 
FlaMtnBkr said:
I think it implies more than just price or people would say 'it feels like an expensive folder'. I would say high end means a well crafted knife out of quality materials.

I personally would never call a knife with AUS8 steel a high end knife because for me a high end knife needs to have a superior blade steel that holds an edge for a long time. For me materials are more important than fit and finish. I care more about function than looks.
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This underscores why exotic materials are not always accurate in what constitutes a high end knife.

Someone's high end knife might be an expensive knife with a resilient, tough steel like AUS-8. I'd hate to have ZDP on something that gets beat around like a Rajah.
 
I consider "high end" to mean both high-quality and high-price. There are of course high quality knives that are cheap and high price knives that are low quality, but "high-end" is more of a general term for the expensive, very nice, kind of exclusive things.


also: I have no idea why people obsess over materials. If made and handled in the right way, some no name stainless steel could be just as good as magical super cryogenicly subatomicly treated S30V. I think super rare expensive materials are just a selling point to the more snobby demographic who wants super exclusive products that are far superior to everything. Yes some of the better steels are....better, but its not even close to defining the quality of the knife as a whole
 
FlaMtnBkr said:
I think it implies more than just price or people would say 'it feels like an expensive folder'. I would say high end means a well crafted knife out of quality materials.

I personally would never call a knife with AUS8 steel a high end knife because for me a high end knife needs to have a superior blade steel that holds an edge for a long time. For me materials are more important than fit and finish. I care more about function than looks.
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I have seen some real crappy knives with S30V out there while on the other hand I have seen some really nice ones with AUS-8 and 440C. ;)
 
Itch Blade said:
This.

It's why you commonly hear a Tenacious being described as "feeling like a high end folder" (not that I agree) despite it's low cost.
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Exactly. See, in this scenario, we notice said knife is a "high quality" knife that feels LIKE a "high end" knife.

I do love how we knifesters are such an educated community as well. We regularly have these elevated, even esoteric etymological excursuses......how's that for alliteration?:eek:
 
Itch Blade said:
This underscores why exotic materials are not always accurate in what constitutes a high end knife.

Someone's high end knife might be an expensive knife with a resilient, tough steel like AUS-8. I'd hate to have ZDP on something that gets beat around like a Rajah.
Click to expand...

I personally don't use knives for beating on. A nice folding knife blade is meant to be sharp and be able to precisely separate material while remaining sharp for as long as possible IMO. In my experience the steels that hold an edge for a long time also get sharper than other steels which is important to me.

I don't use fixed blades and only have 2 that never get used. If I needed to beat on things a lot I would carry a fixed blade and it would probably be pretty cheap if there is a chance I am going to abuse it. But if I enjoyed high end fixed blades for beating on it still would not have AUS8. I would pick M4 or A2 which are designed for toughness. Personally, if I need to hack or chop something up I have better tools for the job. A machete, ax, or chainsaw works much more efficiently than any fixed blade I can carry on my hip. Again, this is just my opinion based on my uses.

For my uses a cheaper, yet tougher steel like AUS8 does not have any advantage. I guess other people that like to hack and beat on things with their knives will have a different set of criteria than I do.
 
FlaMtnBkr said:
I personally don't use knives for beating on. A nice folding knife blade is meant to be sharp and be able to precisely separate material while remaining sharp for as long as possible IMO. In my experience the steels that hold an edge for a long time also get sharper than other steels which is important to me.

I don't use fixed blades and only have 2 that never get used. If I needed to beat on things a lot I would carry a fixed blade and it would probably be pretty cheap if there is a chance I am going to abuse it. But if I enjoyed high end fixed blades for beating on it still would not have AUS8. I would pick M4 or A2 which are designed for toughness. Personally, if I need to hack or chop something up I have better tools for the job. A machete, ax, or chainsaw works much more efficiently than any fixed blade I can carry on my hip. Again, this is just my opinion based on my uses.

For my uses a cheaper, yet tougher steel like AUS8 does not have any advantage. I guess other people that like to hack and beat on things with their knives will have a different set of criteria than I do.
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AUS-8 can be and is a lot better than you would think when it's done correctly. ;)

Here are 2 videos I made using 2 different knives, both with AUS-8 blades... Watch the videos and you might just be suprised.

I am not saying AUS-8 is high end Premium Steel, but it not junk either.

[youtube]<object width="640" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/yQaq-Ox0fRQ&amp;hl=en_US&amp;fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/yQaq-Ox0fRQ&amp;hl=en_US&amp;fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385"></embed></object>[/youtube]

[youtube]<object width="640" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/TeH6fZ-4jvc&amp;hl=en_US&amp;fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/TeH6fZ-4jvc&amp;hl=en_US&amp;fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385"></embed></object>[/youtube]
 
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Any sort of process that adds to the strength or sharpness of a knife. Milling out and lightening (not just drilling) of liners is a high end trait. Another would be the use of durable materials like titanium and micarta, polishing of the blade(which is lengthy and costly), and the overall thought put into a knife. Not so much price.
 
Ankerson said:
I have seen some real crappy knives with S30V out there while on the other hand I have seen some really nice ones with AUS-8 and 440C. ;)
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What is your definition of crappy and nice? Fit and finish? Out of curiosity what were the crappy knives with S30V? I can't see too many companies spending the money on S30V and then making a 'crappy' knife with it.
 
FlaMtnBkr said:
What is your definition of crappy and nice? Fit and finish? Out of curiosity what were the crappy knives with S30V? I can't see too many companies spending the money on S30V and then making a 'crappy' knife with it.
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They can and do, they can cheap out on the heat treatment and other materials in the knife, F&F etc and in the end you have something that isn't worth spit because a Buck 110 with 420HC would be better.

You have to really watch what you are buying because some will throw in something like a S30V blade just to sell their knives to people who really don't know. All they see is S30V and buy them..... I am using S30V as an example....

I don't point fingers and bash any company, no need to start any flame wars here... ;)

They are out there though believe me.
 
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In my mind there aren't really any production folders that fit into any "high end" category, not as I'd define it.

With the exception of maybe Hinderer's production XM-18, which sort of blurs the line between custom and production.

Fit & finish, materials AND durability are all important to me when they all come together. In the absence of any of those aspects and I completely lose interest.
 
High end, to me.....Customs/CRK/Hinderer/Strider/Microtech. Any company that puts out $300++ knives that preform notches above the rest and look good doing it. In the spirit of not starting an argument I stop there.
 
philwar said:
What's your definition then?
Click to expand...

I think custom built folders are high end. Very loose definition I know, but I've never been impressed by anything by Spyderco or Benchmade or any other production.

I'm consistently impressed by what I see by knife makers like Burchtree, American Kami, etc.

This is just my opinion of course, but when I think about high end folders, that's where my mind wanders.
 
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