Delica 4 blade swap lockbar question

Fred Sanford · Mar 28, 2017

I have two knives that I want to swap the blades on. A ZDP-189 BRG D4 and a VG-10 Foliage Green G10 D4. I usually swap the blade AND the lockbar when I do swaps on a Delica. I have never done a FRN to G10 blade swap however. The lockbar on the G10 D4 is sanded (or ground) so that it looks to have a brushed finish like the SS liners do. The FRN D4's just have a 'regular' looking lockbar.

I would much rather leave the lockbar in the VG-10 D4 that came with it since it maches the liners. I can swap the lockbars and, of course, sand the incoming lockbar from the ZDP FRN knife so it somewhat matches the liners of the G10 model.

My question is this: Does anybody know if the ZDP-189 and VG-10 D4's use the same lockbars or are the lockbars in the ZDP knives different in some way (harder)?

This is truly a first-world problem. It is something that I want to do, not something that needs done.

winnerone23 · Mar 28, 2017

I don't know the difference between vg10 lockbar and a ZDP bar.. but I had to change the Hap40 bar, over. When I swapped it into my G10 Delica.

91bravo · Mar 28, 2017

Not sure on the g10 Delica as I've never handled one, but I have the g10 Enduras. I know that if I'm doing a blade swap like that, I would definitely keep the blade and lockbar the same from knife to knife. I know it's easier to just drop the pivot and switch only the blades, but I personally, would switch out the lockbar it was mated with as well.

winnerone23 · Mar 28, 2017

I did my G10 Endura, DF2, and FRN Foliage Green Ladybug. All Hap40 swaps.
I had to swap the lockbar with the blade, on all 4...

353 · Mar 29, 2017

I have a ZDP Manbug which came to me with a lockbar that didn't snap all the way down flush like it's supposed to. So I tried swapping with the lockbar on my VG-10 Manbug and VOILÀ both knives came out with perfect locking action!

I also sent a mail to spyderco because I had the same worry about the lockbars having different steels in them. They replied with:

"The internal parts are the same material. If you are having trouble with your knife you are welcome to send it in for warranty evaluation."

Now this can be interpret two ways:

- Blade and lockbar are the same steel in each knife.

or

- All produced lockbars etc for each model are the same steel. Example: Lockbar for the Manbug is the same for both ZDP and VG-10 models.

I believe the latter is the correct one.

jazzz · Mar 29, 2017

I changed the blades only from a G10 Delica and waved Delica, and they were fine. Only way to know is try it first. A lot less work doing only blades.

Kid Shamrock · Mar 29, 2017

I did a blade swap several years ago from a FRN to a G10 Dragonfly. I tried swapping lock bars, but it wouldn't lock properly. Ended up just doing the blades and everything was fine. I would try just the blades first.

Chris "Anagarika" · Mar 29, 2017

My Endura SB blade won't match with my VG10 lockbar. The VG10 lockbar is too big for the SB blade tang notch. No harm trying I guess?

Edit to add: both are FRN. I don't have G10 version to compare.

Spey · Mar 29, 2017

Pivot location on my two DF (g10-vg10 & FRN-zdp189) were different. Geometry of lock faces also were different. BladeSwap was a no-go 4 me.

EDIT: DF = Dragon Fly in my reply. Just re-read thread & see you were asking about a Delicate.

Fred Sanford · Mar 29, 2017

Thanks folks.

I'm not worried about the smaller amount of work as I've got it down to a science now and can swap Delica blades in just about 10-12 minutes and have both knives complete (switching the blade and the lock bar).

I was more interested in knowing if there is a difference in hardness between the two lockbars?

353 · Mar 29, 2017

At this point I would send Spyderco a mail. If you do please share the answer.

Fred Sanford · Mar 29, 2017

I'll email Spyderco and see what they say. Thanks.

Spey · Mar 30, 2017

David Lowry said:
I'll email Spyderco and see what they say. Thanks.

No disrespect meant ...,
it seems this effort would be wasting time.

Spyderco general policy is related to producing products they stand behind. Modifying a product like you are asking would outrightly be voiding their warranty, and they have stated this many times over.

Potentially two knives modified, and possibly one sold off into the market (possibly to be returned to Spyderco because of owner referenced problem). Two future potential warranty claim knives.

So, you are hoping for a productive response that would potentially assist you to make a modification that would turn multiple warrantable products into non-warrantable (assembled that are not as designed & assembled by manufacturer).

My overall point, asking the mfr. for comment that might provide any answer that would convince you to do this modification seems futile and a waste of time for all involved.

Also, consider CQI, where any two knives from same model can and many times do have slightly differing parts (the example I noted related to DF in earlier post). Even within the same production run, tolerances (all parts within individual part spec's) of parts assembled can result in an overall assembly that does not pass inspection (tolerance stacking).

Asking on a forum, from other members/peers, is your second best option. Best option being doing it yourself, or speaking directly to someone who has. In no way am I trying to talk you out of a personalized modification (most I carry are such).

Regards,

harronek · Mar 30, 2017

I dont know about a FRN - G10 swap , but when I swapped my ZDP blade into my Titanium / Damascus scales the lock bar was different and I had to swap the lockbar as well as the blade .
The ZDP lockbar sat a fraction higher than the Titanium scales , it never really bothered me much , but I can tell you they were different .

Ken

joeldworkin307 · Mar 31, 2017

Also had issues with the dragonfly hap40 to g10 swap. Lockup didn't work for blades and lock bar didn't sit in a full swap. Disappointing, but I got my hap40 cheap so it looks like I'm going to have to get custom scales made.

Spey · Mar 31, 2017

joeldworkin307,

Do you have a scale maker that does quality replacements for the FRN in mind?

353 · Mar 31, 2017

joeldworkin307 said:
...and lock bar didn't sit in a full swap.

I'm having some trouble picturing this, care to explain? I'm planning a ZDP to G10 Manbug swap myself so all info is greatly appreciated.

winnerone23 · Mar 31, 2017

Spey said:
joeldworkin307,

Do you have a scale maker that does quality replacements for the FRN in mind?

Boomer52...

He did the G10 scales for my Native, as well.. (not a FRN model, tho)

353 said:
I'm having some trouble picturing this, care to explain? I'm planning a ZDP to G10 Manbug swap myself so all info is greatly appreciated.

Picture the gimping on the top of the scales..

The G10 doesn't have that.. so the lock bar sticks out, just slightly..
I'll get a pic, when I get home, if one hasn't been.

353 · Mar 31, 2017

winnerone23 said:
I'll get a pic, when I get home, if one hasn't been.

I take it you've done a swap with the Manbug in G10 then? I'd REALLY apreciate if you had a before and after pic of the lock bar sitting. Never heard of this issue before. But anyways thank you for enlightening me!

:thumbup:

winnerone23 · Mar 31, 2017

353 said:
I take it you've done a swap with the Manbug in G10 then? I'd REALLY apreciate if you had a before and after pic of the lock bar sitting. Never heard of this issue before. But anyways thank you for enlightening me!

[emoji106]

Not on a Manbug.. but a Hap40/G10 Delica swap..