Designing a compact tactical hawk - need feedback

M

Murphys Law

Joined
Oct 10, 2011
Messages
122
Hey guys.

I have gone completely nuts!

I just finished my first knife (link)
And now I want to try myself on a hawk :p

It will be small, compact and light and inspired by Edwood7's awesome winkler hawks. :eek:

So I popped out a design:

hawk1.png


OAL: about 10"
Width tip to tip about 5"

As you can see, I tried to accomondate an ergonomical grip with two different grip positions.

Feedback please!

My questions:
  • Any comments on the design in terms of geometry?
  • Any comments on the design in terms of ergonomy?
  • I want to make it full-tang. How thick would you choose the stock?
  • What type of steel would you choose?
  • To which hardness would you harden it?

Thanks a lot!
Best,
Murphys Law.
 
Last edited:
I have no input on geometry or ergos but for steel I would go with aldos 1084 - easy heat treat - and make sure you do a couple of cut outs under the scales for weight reduction. The tang should probably be 3/16" or 1/4" thick. The h.t. will be a little tricky. You'll have to do a differential ht to get a 52-55 rhc on the cutting edges and leave the tang fairly soft.
I've never done one on my own but did spend a weekend with my brother working on his. It's a lot of work but worth it in the end.
 
Just by looking at it (which got a little awkward for me with the two rectangles around it) the handle looks a little odd. The fact that it comes out of the head "backwards" then sweeps forward might make the angle of the head counterintuitive. I would start with the beginning of the handle perpendicular to the head and then sweep forward.

However, you could cut it out of 3/4" (19mm) plywood and see how it handles. Nothing will tell you about a design like trying it in real life. Plywood is cheaper than steel and quicker to work with.
 
Imagine using the spike, will that handle work with the reverse grip? Make it out of a piece of plywood to test the ergonomics, first.
Overall, I like the design though.
 
Hello,

thanks for the input so far!

I'll definitely make a prototype as soon as I get my hands on some material and myself into the workshop. (Not that easy during college-time).

Keep up the good comments!

Best,
Murphys Law.
 
I read an article regarding the Winkler RnD taking over a year of research and alterations. Thing is, you'll have to make mistakes before you find what works, for this particular concept.
Like many things, direct experience will tell you more than any other source. I own numerous hawks, each of them have their strengths and weaknesses, pros and cons. The design, handle ergos, weight, mass distribution, swing arc, power, cutting edge, texture of the grip, etc..just have to be experienced.
One of my hawks, GG&G BAttlehawk, has G-10 handle scales, they are textured, and awesome with gloves, painful without. I mean I'm tearing up the palms of the gloves, but that hawks doesn't slip at all.
It also has an exposed pommel, and the metal is rounded, it still penetrates about 1/4" deep in wood, just due to the weight of the hawk. I'm just saying a sharp point may be overkill, and dangerous to the user, round it off to keep your own bloodloss to a minimum.
The GG&G and the Winklers are 3/8" thick, but there is a big difference. The GG&G does not have a tapered tang, so it weights 44oz. The Winkler RnD's have a tapered tang, and some holes to lighten up the weight, specifically in the handle. This allows for it's weight to be in the head. If the GG&G was lighter in the handle, it would be faster, yet still hit very hard. Weight in the head=more power a faster swing=more power a lighter hawk=faster in hand

All of the factors are based on the user, his strength, his technique, and the type of targeted use. Shorter lengths carry well, but the same head with a longer shaft=more power. Too long and it gets akward. Somewhere is a perfect length and weight for each person.

Overall I like the look, use will lead to refinment. Is it a fighter, if so, give it a knife edge. If you want to chop wood, better make it more robust.
 
Hello fox,

thanks for your comment! that was really helpful!

I'm at my parents house later today, so I will spend some quality time with a printer, cardboard and scissors to rough out the overall dimensions.Afterwards I'll find a piece of plywood and will cut out a model for ergonomics and handling.

As far as handle scales go, I'll try a local variant of Micarta and round them well.

While I haven't got the equipment to do a fully tapered tang, I will definitely drill holes in the handle for weight reduction.

Thanks for the heads up regarding the pommel - I think I will redesign that area a little.

Thanks again!

Best,
Murphys Law.
 
Okay, I redesigned a little.

The first version was WAY to small. this one is 12" long.

I changed the handles to a more universal design, rounded the tip at the butt end and lost the spike.

Why the spike?
I figured I wouldn't need it... ever. Also the removal of the spike would allow me to use significantly smaller stock to grind from.

Plus with the flat back, this axe has a little scandinavian vibe going on. I like it.

Here it is. More testing to come!

hawk2.png


Best,
Murphys Law.
 
I like this one too, like a "francescan", is that what they call them?
A flat back would help for utility chores, like pounding stakes and breaking ice and stuff.
 
Last edited:
Okay, things are getting real!
100$ worth of steel (damn, hadn't thought stock could be so expensive) arrived at my place yesterday, as well as material for the handles.

I'll make the scales from "Hartgewebe". This is the German version of Micarta for industry use. Its cotton fabric with phenolic resin, just as Micarta is, in a nice natural color. Will post pics soon ;).
I use it because its dirt cheap. I got enough for the hawk and another 3-4 knives for about 9$. And if it looks, feels and acts anything like Micarta in the end, it was well worth it.
The scales will be removable and will be secured with three heavy duty stainless steel screws and nuts. These should arrive here any day now.

I'll start next week! Thanks for all your recommendations!

Best,
Murphys Law.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top