Diamond pocket stones

[Papilio]

I found some old threads roughly dealing with this topic. I hope you don't mind me asking.

As a portable sharpener I am quite happy with both the DC4 and the CC4 made by Fällkniven. I sharpen both knives and prunig shears / gardening tools. I keep my knives sharp, the DC4 fine diamond side is enough (no need for a coarser grit). But for the pruning shears I think about getting a coarser grit (sometimes they are quite blunt and having a fast cutting stone would be nice).
When it comes to diamonds I can not decide for one stone yet. DMT and EZE-LAP both have a good reputation. Both make pocket stones. But - yes, here comes a but - the EZE-LAP 4x1'' stones have this big groove in the middle of the stone. DMT Dia-Sharp have a continuous surface but are smaller, just 7/8''. This is 1 cm smaller than DC4.

Smith's has diamond sharpeners, too. They use an interrupted surface but are 4x1'' at least. They have a small groove but also a small patch with a continuous diamond surface (they call it a "Micro-Tool Sharpening Pad" for tips and small tools). Available in coarse (325) and fine (750) grit.
https://smithsproducts.com/4-inch-diamond-sharpening-stone-coarse
The Smith's website states that they use monocrystalline diamonds, too. I don't know if this interrupted surface is better than a continuous surface. The dots should catch the abraded metal and make the stone cut faster. Well, really? Used with water metal particles are flushed away. So this should not be a huge problem.

Fällkniven itself has new developed diamond sharpeners since early 2022. To be more precise: The FDD and FDC sharpeners. They are folding sharpeners like EZE-LAP EZE-FOLD or DMT Diafold.
https://fallkniven.se/en/produkt/fdc-foldable-diamond-ceramic-sharpener/
https://fallkniven.se/en/produkt/fdd-foldable-diamond-ceramic-sharpener/
The usable diamond surface is narrow (just 2cm). Both have the same fine 25µ diamond as the DC4 (no need for that if you have the stone). The FDD has a coarse 44µ diamond side. Buying a FDD would give me a coarse grit but also double the fine grit. Not very attractive for me. The FDC would add the ceramic side but also doubles the fine diamond (having the DC4). The best combination would be (for me) FDD and CC4.
I like the idea of a coarser diamond sharpener. But why the hell (sorry) don't they make a coarse diamond stone the size of DC4 / CC4 instead of those narrow folded sharpeners?

Any suggestions? What about the longevity? Is Smith's on the same level (quality) as DMT, EZE-LAP and Fällkniven?

Thanks.

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

Really don't need a diamond hone for setting a complete new edge on the pruning shears or other garden tools. The steel in such tools is not very wear-resistant and not very hard as compared to typical cutlery steels in knives. For setting new edges on blunt tools like pruning shears, something as simple as a 6" or 8" mill bastard file can actually do that very quickly and even faster than the pocket diamond hones you might otherwise use for your knives.

I previously kind of went down the path you're considering, in trying diamond hones for such work. In fact, I did first try a coarse DMT Dia-fold for that job. But the soft nature of the steel in those tools sometimes meant the diamond hone became clogged pretty fast and actually didn't remove metal at as fast a rate as I expected. I eventually realized that a mill bastard file is much more aggressive for such work, because it cuts MUCH deeper in such soft steels. Diamond is very hard and can cut anything. But even a Coarse DMT's grit (at 45 microns) is much smaller than the teeth in the file - so it can't cut as deeply as the file can. And the shallow depth of the grit layer on a plated diamond hone also means it can load up and clog pretty fast in such work on soft steel. By contrast, a decent file at ~60-ish HRC is plenty hard enough to cut the soft steel in the garden tools (maybe low-mid 50s HRC or even softer), and the depth of cut is much, much deeper with a file - so the work goes much faster.

Now, a diamond hone CAN work fine for the light tune-up work on garden tools. And even the diamond tools made and marketed for that sort of use fall into the same grit size range as the DMT Coarse or Fine, or somewhere in between. I use such a tool (Fiskars brand) for my pruning tools, for example. For touch-up-as-you-go type work, it does the job just fine in maybe a light pass or two on the tool's edge.

So, a file to set a new edge. And something like a 600 diamond to touch it up as you go. For such tools, a 'simpler is better' strategy actually works best for these.

 

[Ourorboros]

Another vote for a mill file. That's what I use for anything straight.
For curved blades, like a bypass pruner or lopping shear, I use a round file. Between those two files I can do everything in the garage.

Diamond stones can wear down any steel. It's not the best for every steel, however. I avoid them for simple steels.

 

[SwissHeritageCo]

Really don't need a diamond hone for setting a complete new edge on the pruning shears or other garden tools. The steel in such tools is not very wear-resistant and not very hard as compared to typical cutlery steels in knives. For setting new edges on blunt tools like pruning shears, something as simple as a 6" or 8" mill bastard file can actually do that very quickly and even faster than the pocket diamond hones you might otherwise use for your knives.

I previously kind of went down the path you're considering, in trying diamond hones for such work. In fact, I did first try a coarse DMT Dia-fold for that job. But the soft nature of the steel in those tools sometimes meant the diamond hone became clogged pretty fast and actually didn't remove metal at as fast a rate as I expected. I eventually realized that a mill bastard file is much more aggressive for such work, because it cuts MUCH deeper in such soft steels. Diamond is very hard and can cut anything. But even a Coarse DMT's grit (at 45 microns) is much smaller than the teeth in the file - so it can't cut as deeply as the file can. And the shallow depth of the grit layer on a plated diamond hone also means it can load up and clog pretty fast in such work on soft steel. By contrast, a decent file at ~60-ish HRC is plenty hard enough to cut the soft steel in the garden tools (maybe low-mid 50s HRC or even softer), and the depth of cut is much, much deeper with a file - so the work goes much faster.

Now, a diamond hone CAN work fine for the light tune-up work on garden tools. And even the diamond tools made and marketed for that sort of use fall into the same grit size range as the DMT Coarse or Fine, or somewhere in between. I use such a tool (Fiskars brand) for my pruning tools, for example. For touch-up-as-you-go type work, it does the job just fine in maybe a light pass or two on the tool's edge.

So, a file to set a new edge. And something like a 600 diamond to touch it up as you go. For such tools, a 'simpler is better' strategy actually works best for these.

Your name really does what it says on the tin.

Excellent feedback as always OWE.

 

[sharp_edge]

I also have the same question as OP. Last time I was out, I had to use the diamond coated file on my Leatherman Charge TTI to sharpen my Spyderco K390 Endela. It worked but a two-sided pocket diamond stone would be a better choice, I guess?

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

I also have the same question as OP. Last time I was out, I had to use the diamond coated file on my Leatherman Charge TTI to sharpen my Spyderco K390 Endela. It worked but a two-sided pocket diamond stone would be a better choice, I guess?

In that situation, you might find one of the reputable brands like DMT, EZE-Lap, etc, to be more user-friendly and more versatile, and produce cleaner results. Any diamond hone should work, but some work better than others. The diamond 'files' on multitools won't necessarily be of the best size (too small) or quality (uniformity of grit grading, density of grit coverage, etc.). For very basic uses like touching up the working edges on garden tools, they'll likely be fine. But for better knives, a higher-quality hone would be worthwhile.

 

[Papilio]

The steel in such tools is not very wear-resistant and not very hard as compared to typical cutlery steels in knives.

Ok. Is this true even for better brands like Fiskars? I have some cheap Hardware Store tools for a couple of bucks. They are not very wear-resistant. That's for sure.

For such tools, a 'simpler is better' strategy actually works best for these.

Simpler is better is a good advice. But us "knife-nuts" (as you said in a former thread) don't always like it that way.

Until now I have used a small SiC stone for setting a new edge (and I really mean small, it must be 7x2 cm) and finished the edge with the DC4 (I use the ceramic, too). But this small SiC stone is a potential danger for my fingers. Honestly more than potential...

Will have a closer look at one of this files you mentioned.

Many thanks. As always a very detailed and instructive answer.


sharp_edge : I second what Obsessed with Edges wrote. EZE-LAP, DMT and probably Fällkniven (I don't know the new coarse diamond)) would be a much better choice. Dependeding on your needs (how far you let your edge go on the blunt side and how fine an edge you want) you have some options. Even a Superfine Diamond / Ceramic hone (I think it is called EZE-FOLD 530) made by EZE-LAP which would give you a shaving sharpness.

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

Ok. Is this true even for better brands like Fiskars? I have some cheap Hardware Store tools for a couple of bucks. They are not very wear-resistant. That's for sure.


Simpler is better is a good advice. But us "knife-nuts" (as you said in a former thread) don't always like it that way.

Until now I have used a small SiC stone for setting a new edge (and I really mean small, it must be 7x2 cm) and finished the edge with the DC4 (I use the ceramic, too). But this small SiC stone is a potential danger for my fingers. Honestly more than potential...

Will have a closer look at one of this files you mentioned.

Many thanks. As always a very detailed and instructive answer.


sharp_edge : I second what Obsessed with Edges wrote. EZE-LAP, DMT and probably Fällkniven (I don't know the new coarse diamond)) would be a much better choice. Dependeding on your needs (how far you let your edge go on the blunt side and how fine an edge you want) you have some options. Even a Superfine Diamond / Ceramic hone (I think it is called EZE-FOLD 530) made by EZE-LAP which would give you a shaving sharpness.

Just so happens, the pruner I use the most and maintain as I described earlier, is a Fiskars bypass pruner. Might also have an older anvil-style pruner from Fiskars, but I don't remember the brand specifically, on that one. And another anvil-style my Dad used, I think a Sears Craftsman brand. In all cases, I've found the steel to be easily soft enough to set the edges using the file. And I use the Fiskars-branded diamond tool to touch them up. That goes in my back pocket everytime I'm using the pruners.

For the files, the size of 'tooth' in the file varies with the size of the file itself. This means smaller files have a somewhat finer finish, and bigger ones more coarse. For a small-cutter yard tool like the pruners, the 6" or 8" files strike me as ideal - both in sizing the tool itself to the blade being sharpened, and in the speed at which they work. And lubricating the file with some WD-40 also makes cleaning the file much easier, and minimizing clogging issues there as well. Wear some heavy gloves when using the file, to protect your fingers (I sharpen 'edge-leading', into the edge with the file). I like to mount the tool or the blade itself (if disassembled) into a bench vise when using the file, to keep everything secure and steady with both hands controlling the file itself.

 

[Papilio]

Using a file a bench vise seems to be a good idea. As well as gloves. I haven't used gloves when sharpening because I found them to reduce the "touch" or "feel". Scars make guys more attractive, don't they?
Thanks again.

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

Using a file a bench vise seems to be a good idea. As well as gloves. I haven't used gloves when sharpening because I found them to reduce the "touch" or "feel". Scars make guys more attractive, don't they?
Thanks again.

Same preference here, when sharpening my knives. But with the file going into the edge on these tools, there's usually more pressure being used and the potential is greater for a slip-up. The file will either dig in or it'll skate with relatively small changes in angle or pressure - so you have to pay attention. I've had light, glancing bumps against the edge this way with my knuckles, and have been lucky. Really have to be mindful of what you're doing with each & every pass and don't rush things. And for checking progress, the visual indicators will be more obvious - you'll SEE how fast the metal is coming off and you can periodically pause and check for a burr, with a glove off and the file laid on the bench for a moment.

 

[Papilio]

I have not much experience with this technique. The main problem I see is to find and hold the right angle.
Years ago I used an EZE-LAP Hone & Stone File (Super Fine), but sold this nice little sharpener (I don't know why). I will have to slow it down. For my safety as well as for not removing too much metal because as far as I remember those mill files can be quite aggressive.
Thanks.

 

[Ourorboros]

I also have the same question as OP. Last time I was out, I had to use the diamond coated file on my Leatherman Charge TTI to sharpen my Spyderco K390 Endela. It worked but a two-sided pocket diamond stone would be a better choice, I guess?

K390 will need a diamond whetstone. For a personal portable system, a DMT Diafold is good.

Ok. Is this true even for better brands like Fiskars? I have some cheap Hardware Store tools for a couple of bucks. They are not very wear-resistant. That's for sure.

Because of the abuse they take, gardening tools are usually softer heat treats with lower carbon steels.
Also, like many companies in recent decades, Fiskars has diluted their name by having lower quality product in their line-up.
Now with the Japanese, it might be a white steel taken to a high HRC. But that's better handled with a waterstone than diamonds. I've seen hori hori's and axes with listed HRCs of 61+, which is risking a lot of chipping for something that hits roots and pebbles.

 

[Papilio]

That would explain why they have such a bad edge retention.