Did this happen to you ?

upnorth

upnorth

Joined
Nov 25, 2006
Messages
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I more or less feel like I have come near full circle with outdoor gear. I started with a few basics and even less knowledge. Then I eyeballed this site quite a bit, got out there more and dovetailed much of my new knowledge. Along the way I felt that I needed big knives, then maybe medium knives were ok after all. Now an ESEE Izula or a Mora seems perfectly fine. I did this less so with hatchets and axes as all I had was a big beater axe and some hawks. I picked a wonderful and still useful hatchet and small forest axe. Oh, then I had to get all kinds and types of fire starting materials and devices. Then fancier pots\pans, stoves etc. Now I feel that I can just pick through the heap and find 3-4 primary components for their size\weight and efficiency, and meet most of my basic needs with them. It more or less seems that all I needed was a bit more knowledge in the beginning to make a few key choices, and avoid the semi useful excess that I have now. I still like gear to a certain point but in the back of my mind I know that I don't really need 3\4 of it. And I find now that I want to carry less gear these days.
 
I feel like a lot of us but gear and stuff because we have an interest in it and it's fun to get the package in the mail and oogle over it for days just waiting for a chance to use it. People have all sorts of similar interests where they buy a ton of clothes, shoes, hats, games, etc. We just happen to love outdoor gear and knives. In reality we don't use all of it, we stockpile packs, knives, etc. but it's our interests and hobbies. Think to your first camping trip where you were buying your sleeping bag, tent, etc. walking through the store thinking you need one of everything, then you get out there and half of the stuff isn't even used. The more you use, the more you know, the more experience you have you end up realizing how little you actually need.
 
I think most of us evolve in knowledge, skills and interests. I have boxes full of old cookware, still very usable. Yet I most often find myself packing up just a couple of select pieces, a mix of old and new. And have cookware that I bought on a whim but never tried. I have three tents, but opt for a certain one every time. I have three sleeping bags, ditto. The hydration bladder stays on the shelf. I just didn't like it and went back to bottled water. Knives? Same evolution. I have hundreds of them in every shape and size, but generally head out with a couple of old mainstays. The one catagory of gear I do find myself conciously rotating through is my canoes. After having been canoeless due to theft several years back, I have four now. Each has it's unique characteristics and abilities. But yes, I have boxes of gear that never gets used.
 
Interesting
Full circle?
No
I am actually doing a makeover of my gear

I have canvas and wool gear
Classic stuff
Wonderful
But I realized my clothing is old and out moded

So I just spent a whole bunch of money on clothing that is much much lighter and functions much much better
A pile of trousers, soft shell, parka, and fleece weights almost the same as my canvas anorak (when the canvas is dry)
Will this stuff hold up another 30 years like my other stuff?
No
But I am looking forward to wearing out this stuff from hard use....

Knives, hatchets, and saws....
These definitely fall into the catogory of toys....
But I am realistic enough to know a small folding saw, a 3" full tang, and a penknife with my skill set will give me everything I need
Just finding out which one....

Firelighting is a Bic lighter, cotton wool made in to small balls with Mineral Oil in a leak proof pill container
And a fire stick to be woodsie...

I used to use an Army Poncho to camp. but it is too small
So I recently purchased a 9x9 tarp
And I really like the new gear
I have my eye on a really good very light tent for 100 pounds in England
My old Timberline is too heavy

So with that I should finish my updating and modernisation of my gear
 
Having always been a buy it try it- sell it hobbyist. This is normal for me. I do think I end up with the stuff that suits my needs best though. Going through an axe phase now. Have narrowed down the ones that suit my needs and getting rid of the extra.

I have done it with different tools and toys. Needs do change but I am happy with most of my selections and confident that I no longer need to try new items in those niches.
I agree though that often the simple solution is the best one. We can adapt in use to a new tool as long as that tool is suitable to the task. I cannot tell if my axe handle is 2" too long or short, but I can tell how it feels/how accurate it is and if it holds an edge- how versatile it is in choking up. I needed to try a few to find that out.

Bill
 
Not exactly but I do find I buy a lot less stuff than I once did.

In the way back when I used to buy a lot of stuff that I had become aware of and have it shipped home so it was waiting for me. There's a big epiphany moment that cured that. It was probably motivated by a bunch of factors though. 1] Substitution for genuine engagement. 2] The appeal of apparently novel items. 3] Genuinely novel and great new items that I falsely believed would useful to me. 4] Ignorance. 5] Sudden rush of buying power kicking in.

I rarely buy stuff now for a few reasons:

For a start I know a lot more about what I like and what I value. As an example I'd be reluctant to trade my mess kit although it is heavier that aluminium or titanium. I'll often go on trips and not cook anything, only boil water. If I am going to cook I'm going to cook properly. I do not place high value on food that if brought to me in an feeding establishment I'd send back just because I'm in the woods. Telescopic toasting forks to put burnt black bits on a sausage that no establishment would have the audacity to offer me as a breakfast, and all that. I went through a lot of mess kits, and now I've arrived.

Water bottles and rubbish like that. It's a very funny thing to watch guys with excessively heavy water bottles strapped to them for their personal use distributing a crate of water to the locals in super-light bottles one can get from a supermarket. They survived the same trip.

I've a much richer understanding of the properties of materials than I did. Design too.

I am much more resistant to persuasive communication, propaganda, behavioural shaping, and models of attitude change than I was when I really got rolling on this stuff. For a seller to sell me something it not only has to be very good but also very good for me.

I have a lot more experience now and I am seldom surprised. That's a gloomy view but never the less true. For reality to exceed my expectation it has to be a bit special, and most things are only ordinary, or “it figures”.

A great example for me is knives. Off the top of my head I can't recall the last time I picked up a knife I had never held before and was genuinely surprised. Bit like what they teach HCI students about seeing familiar objects and anticipation. Your hand starts making the shape ready to receive objects with very few cues about that object. And if you are familiar enough with those objects you are hardly ever wrong. In fact, it's usually only when it is wildly wrong do you ever notice at all – go to pick up a ketchup bottle and it feels like a kettle when you grab it and alarms bells go off. Saves you a bunch of money on lemon knives, and other gear too. I suspect carpenters get a similar thing with hammers and saws or a scribe grabbing a pen.

Now I like simple solutions that work well for me. I'm not adverse to spending if it is genuinely necessary. Packs and sleeping bags are good examples. Nobody is going to sell me a pair of trousers
for mountain / hiking / bushcraft / blah that are inferior to what I can get at a builder's suppliers for a third the price though. I looked at a new Gore-Tex jacket the other day, just shy of $1,304 USD. I wondered how many Gucci kit collectors will have as much fun in that as I do in my stuff. Few I suspect.
 
Yeah pretty much. I was in a SAR group in my teens and I really didn't have much gear. A compass, a small FAK, a good pair of boots, a rain shell, a few lawn and leaf bags, and a sak in my pocket. That was about all I carried and I find that I've pretty much come back to that. For a while there my survival gear needed a full daypack to carry it and it was about 10 pounds. Now my survival stuff fits into a quart sized ziploc and weighs about 2 pounds or less. I think it was a progression of having very few skills and not knowing WHAT you could do with nature, to having a moderate amount of skills and thinking you need bigger/heavier tools for the theoretical things that you COULD do with these skills, to having a lot of skills(experience) and realizing I've used nothing but my Izzy 2 the whole camping trip. To be honest I'm a bit bored with knives and gear right now.
 
Shotgun said:
Yeah pretty much. I was in a SAR group in my teens and I really didn't have much gear. A compass, a small FAK, a good pair of boots, a rain shell, a few lawn and leaf bags, and a sak in my pocket. That was about all I carried and I find that I've pretty much come back to that. For a while there my survival gear needed a full daypack to carry it and it was about 10 pounds. Now my survival stuff fits into a quart sized ziploc and weighs about 2 pounds or less. I think it was a progression of having very few skills and not knowing WHAT you could do with nature, to having a moderate amount of skills and thinking you need bigger/heavier tools for the theoretical things that you COULD do with these skills, to having a lot of skills(experience) and realizing I've used nothing but my Izzy 2 the whole camping trip. To be honest I'm a bit bored with knives and gear right now.
Click to expand...

I like this. I keep intending to take a notepad along and make a list of gear taken and used, and gear left unused. Then bit by bit leaving the unused gear at home. My excuse for not doing so (besides laziness) is that nowdays, my sherpa is a canoe and a flowing river carries us both, so added bulk and weight are just ballast, not a burden other than the portage to the launch and at the takeout. But maybe I'll do that this weekend on the river. Except for food, my drybags are repacked and ready to go.
 
One aspect of the equation is what do you intend to spend your time outdoors doing?

Some people like to speed hike with a set goal of distance traveled... means you want to travel light. Some like to stop and relax, taking many breaks, have a hot meal.

Some camp simple, some like to spend time fashioning bushcraft chair, table, or cooking rigs. Interests as much as experience will dictate what you decide to carry.

When I was a teen, I backpack camped and tried to cover alot of ground. I also had no money so my kit was mostly cast off military surplus. Now I can afford somewhat better gear but no longer like to go fast and far. Worklife is stressful enough. When outdoors I prefer to relax and work on projects. Hikes are usually under 6 hours and I like to have a nice hot meal along the way.

Bill
 
I would put it as "my activities have varied with my ability and available time".
At this point, I make time, and have the ability, to do the stuff I want to do. Now, equipment is strictly a means to an end, and the toy factor doesn't interest me any more, only practicality.
In a way I've come full circle, because what I keep and use now(as far as bladed tools go) are the same or similar as a dozen years ago. I did a lot of playing, and spent many thousands of dollars on toys to play with, in between, but "playing" is exactly what I always called it.
My gear progression has been quite linear, though. Always looking for lighter weight, better performance, less bulk, etc. As a result I carry less and less, go further faster, and see and do more, while being more comfortable. My enjoyment of the outdoors continues to increase, and that's what it's all about!
 
Maximizing that enjoyment factor is exactly what it is about for me too.

I'm minded of the ideal amplifier, a straight wire with a gain, and nothing else. Obviously “ideal” meets reality and some other things must be introduced, but you don't lose sight of what the ideal is.

For me, a lot of the stuff that people get sold has little to do with reaching a state of genuine enjoyment. It more like the are trying to satisfy the pester power of their inner child. And on that treadmill each fix is very short-lived so they buy more and more on the quest for their grail X.

I've actually been watching a fascinating thing occurring recently in real time:

Staring in April this year I have been taking a guy out fishing nearly every week. He had never been before but he has come out with me on the tredders a lot and camping a few times. We've got the lot all rolled up into one at the moment and most weeks we do an overnight either camped down at the beach or we peddle up to a river.

In daily living I treat him as an equal at most things and at some things he is my superior. At this though as far as he is concerned I am god. That's an uncomfortable position for both of us. Neither of us want all the arrows pointing down. On that, I sent him off to join a fishing forum so he could absorb them into his Borg too. And I've been watching what has been going on.

He's an articulate chap, but no matter how well he frames the exacts the responses he gets are 75% uptight kit driven sorts. Apparently, he needs to lob out yay much on this and that or he wont get results. What results? Sure he won't keep up with some of the match fishermen that are there. It would be foolish to suppose he could, but most of them, yeah no sweat. He doesn't need a Japanese red rod for the river. And a Banshee or Salt will reward him just as well as average off the beach as the recommended Diawa blah if is technique is sound. Critically, he will never complain of blank days or throw his rod at the floor like a tennis player having a tantrum because our trips are fundamentally mellow. Hitherto, I can say that I don't think either of us has had anything other than an extremely enjoyable time.

Topically for this forum there's been some knife related stuff in that mix too. Apparently, he has the wrong knife. Ha! Well I know everything about that knife because I gave it to him years ago. It's a Kephart shaped thing, and I can remember exactly what it is good for and exactly what it is shit at. Better still, I actually have it here 'cos I am cleaning it up a bit. It's me that's gets to sharpen it and determine how well it cuts. As I said to him; “yes, there is a lot wrong with that knife, why do you think I didn't want it?”. I bet you've not discovered what those things are though have you?”. He then recounted some of what he had been told. “Has that ever happened” I asked. “Nope, I love it”. “Well there you go then. “Till then enjoy it, and if that ever does come up I'll point you to a better one”. I proceeded to take the piss out of him for a bit then for being totally “psyched out by kit”. He knows why and he learned. If the boot was on the other foot I'd welcome no mercy and his cruel barbs. Keepin' it real innit.
 
;) I used to do some long distance shooting. I hung out at a forum specialized for guys that did such. Many were Mil and LEO. I owned custom rifles for shooting long distances and taking field abuse. Some costing over 3K- optics exceeding 2K. Did the cost and precision of those rifles make me a precision shooter? NO WAY! They did eliminate the hardware factor but the hardware was never the primary limiting factor anyway. I had them because I had the funds to spare at the time. I do not own them now.

I was asked often if my rifle was a sniper rifle. I smiled and responded that "No, because I am not a sniper so it cannot be a "sniper rifle"." Nothing wrong with trying out kit to see if it suits your needs. Obsessing that one cannot enjoy an activity unless they have the best kit is good for business but bad for the individual.

I ended up selling my rifles when the interest passed. I got most of my money back, can say I fired some of the most accurate rifles available and had a blast.
When I get finished with my current axe interest, I will keep the ones that worked out best for me and sell the rest. Having fun and will have nice tools at the end.

On fishing, I remember the most fun I had in my fishing days involved a cane pole and a flyrod with top water popping bugs. Not my largest fish but pure fun.

Bill
 
Your post accords with my own feelings that the more experience you have the more you know what you do or don't need to load up on and why.

I agree it is that obsessive and compulsive purchasing that it is the problem. The being sold too thing. Nothing wrong with owning cutting edge stuff as such, what can be wrong is the motivation.

I like playing about with passwords and the odd bit of gaming so I have some nice graphics cards. On the flipside I don't give a hoot that my tredder doesn't have 30odd gears. I'm glad that I don't own a knife I'd be happy to chop chain with although some think that's essential.

Mmmm, not so much the objects but moreover why those objects. What will they do for you.
 
I don't know....

I have lots of knives and hatchets but I'm a collector and a user.

Some stuff I use in the outdoors I have had for years and never seen the need to repair or replace.

The main stuff as far as gear I've gotten into in recent years has been to try to get lighter stuff because the older you are the harder it is to carry a lot of heavy stuff.
 
I conceive of collecting as a bit different. Regardless of what it is that is being collected I suspect there's a different mechanism at work. An example for me there would be Bernard Levine, that I have a great deal of respect for on his subject. That said, I doubt he's on Xbay gobbling up each new thing that comes along just because he can.

The way some people operate reminds me of when networked computers became mainstream and people discovered free pr0n. Download the internet.
 
Nope!

I tend to research before buying things.

I am eyeballing a ti emberlit that I know I dont need, but seems so useful.
 
I went through this sequence with having to have all the gear I felt important. Now I am selling off most of the knives as I finally found the ones that meet my requirements, which is primarily hunting. I'll keep the 3 machetes as they were inexpensive and still useful at the ranch or in the yard. As for all the other "knives" I really only need 3 and will keep 10 total, mostly out of sentimental value. Looks like a 4" fixed blade with a beefy handle, a beater folder and my "office" folder are all I really need. I am likely to keep the half dozen Mora's I have as the wife uses them in the kitchen and I lend them out. I find it interesting how we spend $ to discover what fits and then move on to other interest. Good thing women aren't that way or I'd be broke.
 
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