Dies-hex or round?

W

Wapiti

Joined
Sep 25, 1999
Messages
482
This is not specifically a knifemaking question, but it is related.
I am welding 5/16" mild steel round stock to my tangs for my hollow/stick tang knives which I plan to thread the pommel/butt cap onto. The nature of my question pertains to this threading. I plan to thread them with a 5/16"-18 (or would -24 be better??) die, but wanted to ask you all if you could clear up what kind of die to use.
In my catalogs and in stores I find:
"Hexagonal dies" in carbon and HS steel
and more expensive "round adjustable split dies" in carbon and HS steel. I am getting mixed messages from various people. My understanding is that for threading stock, the HS steel round adjustable split dies are the best and that hex dies are designed only for rethreading and cleaning up old or damaged threads. I also understand that carbon steel dies don't last nearly as long as the HS steel ones (all my drill bits and taps are HS steel and I like them that way) but do cost less in the short run. But one person did tell me that it is fine to cut threads with hex dies.
Anyway, I was hoping someone in the Forums could lend me a hand and clarify my understanding, or if anyone knows of a better site that deals with these topics and might better answer my questions, just point the way.
In case you can't tell, I own no dies yet, but want to get started on the right foot.
Also, what is the best O.D. (1" or 1 1/2") to get in the round dies in and why are they adjustable anyway...
Thanks for any help.
 
With all my opinions I suggest you wait to get a few more although mine are based on experience. I'd go with the 24 thread because it's finer. More threads per inch = finer adjustment or ability to compress things more given the same torque. Another way to say it, is using the same torque on 18 or 24 threads per inch will cause more compression on the finer threads than the corser ones.

Hex dies are typically used for chasing threads as you mentioned, however they can be used for cutting new ones. The split dies are better since they can be adjusted by a thousandth or two one way or another. This is particularily useful if you have a premade male part that isn't just perfect and want to make a thread for it. By adjusting the die, you can make the thread more custom as far as a tight or looser fit. Normally the dies are not adjusted for each use, however they could be if you want to take the time to experiment. You do have to be a little careful since expanding them too much can cause them to split - i.e. break.

As far as choosing 1" or 1 1/2" diameter, that would depend on how many you plan to get and/or how much you want to spend. If you ever plan to thread a 3/4 or larger diameter pieces (not sure of exact size where OD of dies changes), you should get the 1 1/2" ones and you'll only need one die holder that is for 1 1/2" dies. It will have longer handles than the one for 1" dies. Personaly - I'd go with the 1" diameter for any dies up to 1/2" thread and then 1 1/2" diameter for anything bigger than 1/2" thread. Also, if you want to make smaller threads like #4, 6 or 8, the dies smaller in diameter than 1" as well as smaller holders. You could end up with 3 or 4 die holders for different size dies. Hope this doesn't cause more confusion than help!

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Fran (CT)
 
Ruffscruff,
Excellent! Thank you for the very clear and consice explaination. Sounds like I was headed in the right direction and now things are much clearer, thanks to you.
I agree with what you say about the more threads per inch and with my butt-caps being only so thick I can use as many as I can get; I am going to switch to -24.
Thanks again.
 
24 threads per inch are much stronger..more adjustment. The hex dies ae most often for thread clean up . The round are for making new threads

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Robert,
I had considered allthread or a bolt, but for some reason thought that all the threads cut in along the shank might make it slightly weaker than a solid shank, but maybe that is silly.
Silver solder might be a better idea, too.
Wayne Goddard recommended to silver braze them on.
Thanks
 
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