Different Names for the same steel

B

Balls Deep

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Jan 2, 2014
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As I've been looking through knife stuff over the years I'll find my self seeing a new steel name, looking it up and then finding out that it's just a different name for the same steel. Here's some that I'm aware of:

ThyssenKrupps 4116/x50cr15mov - all the same steel, German stainless, used on Henckels, Whustoff, and now lower end knives advertising it like winco. My understanding is it's all the same steel and the low cost I'm hearing can be from recycled x50cr15

420 HC/ True Sharp Surgical (tm) - basically same steel and differentiation has to do with proprietary heat treat by case.

AUS8/ Molybdenum Vanadium - I've seen these steels listed interchangeably on multiple knives. Seems like in kitchen knives they call it Molybdenum Vanadium and in pocket knives or fixed blades just AUS8

12c27/ Inox - I'm aware that Inox just means stainless though I'm seeing a lot of Inox blades be advertised as true 12c27 sandvik, I've also seen some Inox as 4116 so maybe this means less.

I would love to hear if there's other same names for steels you're all aware of or if I'm dead wrong on anything. It makes trying out new brands a little more fun an interesting when you have something to compare the steel to.

Thanks,
Balls
 
There's TONS of steels like this. For one thing, there are multiple steel grading organizations with different nomenclatures. Additionally, individual manufacturters have their own designations/trademarks.

At the end of the day, though, metallurgy is just metallurgy. All the fancy names don't change the composition.

http://zknives.com/knives/steels/steelchart.php
 
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^ Exactly right, there are TONS of these!! That is a long list!
 
What really counts is the heat treating process the knife the knife Mfg. uses on this steel, many might use this same steel and each might do the heat treating differently.
So just comparing the steels being use does not give the same answer for each knife Mfg.ed from the the same steel.
 
:confused: It can be confusing , especially when the name is trademarked ( e.g. Cold Steel's Carbon V ) . My understanding is that "Carbon V" is whatever Cold Steel wants to put in , rather than a particular formula ? o_O
 
A lot of knife companies didn't exactly say what kind off stainless Steel they were using, stainless was sort of new and high tech so the fact that it was stainless Steel was good enough. This is still often done on cheapo knives, which are simply marked rostfrie to mean that it's German Steel, it's normally just some 420j2 or soft 440a. Same goes for most all " STAINLESS " or " STAINLESS STEEL " Chinese knives, but I'm sure junk knives aren't what you've got in mind.
50yrs ago most people tended not to pay attention to exactly what specific steel was being used, and just let performance speak for itself.
I'm pretty much this way, it matters weather or not the steel is carbon or stainless but that's about it.


I believe the KA-BAR chrovan Steel is the same as or very similar to the 1095cv that western used, and may not be too different than case's cv steel.
 
When you get into the steel industry, you realize it's actually very common.
You have different standards: AISI, ASTM, SAE, other country codes and standards, in house proprietary names, just the nature of the business.
 
when another steel manufacturer comes out with something new, the other brands have to have it too, so they make something similar with slight differences or slightly different ways to make it.
for instance m390 is from bohler and then CTS 204p came about using about the same composition but using a different grain size and slightly different manufacturing technique giving it nearly the same properties of m390. same with 20cv.

all 3 are different but in the end the steel results in very similar properties, mostly indistinguishable from an end users perspective.
 
If you buy a large amount of a steel you can ask for a special composition.
If a steel has a patent and you want to have something with similar properties you have to play with the composition .When a number of steel mills are doing the same thing it becomes a game of getting close enough to avoid patent infringement but get the similar properties ! BTDT !
Steel mills can also melt within the standard composition but on the high or low side of the normal range of an element ! Done that too !

Much of metallurgy today is "micro-metallurgy" where adding small amounts of an element can make a very significant difference in properties. Examples - adding Boron to steel [ .005 % ] , adding Vanadium to 9260, adding Germanium to sterling silver [still sterling but tarnish resistant and very oxidation resistant for forging -Argentium ]
Just like cooking !
 
I called ZT while working in knife Dept. when i noticed the blade material changed in the ZT 456 from the Bolher M390 to the CPM-20CV, was informed it was because of the availability of the needed material for production.
From what i see in one material tables the M390 has 0.70% Silicon where the CMP-20CV has 0.30% Silicon everything else is the same.

Thank you everyone for ramming my mistake up my Asx
 
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snapshot2017 said:
I called ZT while working in knife Dept. when i noticed the blade material changed in the ZT 456 from the Bolher M390 to the CPM-20CV, was informed it was because of the availability of the needed material for production.
From what i see in one material tables the M390 has 70% Silicon where the CMP-20CV has 30% Silicon everything else is the same.
Click to expand...

0.70% vs 0.30%
 
ATS-34/154-CM.
M390/CPM 20CV

I also read that the steel Victorinox used in the Swiss army knives is similar to TruSharp surgical like Case uses.
 
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